re school exclusion

[mummy207]

I posted a while back about my DS being inappropriate at school, he asked a teacher to add him on snapchat and was isolated for it. The reactions on here were split between whether this was an overreaction by the school or acceptable. I accepted it and sanctioned him at home and fully supported the school after reading all of your helpful responses. Lots of teachers responded.

Unfortunately today there has been a follow up and I have been told my son needs to be excluded tomorrow and stay at home. I totally agree he is being absolutely unacceptable , he apparently lifted his top up and asked the teacher whether she liked his abs. I know it's fucking insane, don't get me started.

They have said because this is his second "Sexually inappropriate offense" (question whether the snapchat thing was sexually inappropriate!!) , he needs an external exclusion which will go on his record. Although I agree he is in the wrong, this again to me seems really ridiculous. What is making him sit at home all day going to achieve? He will be on xbox! Also some of his peers have had several fights, bullying, etc and not been excluded. Exclusions are really rare. I am absolutely devastated. Is there anything I can do about this? It says on the paperwork I can challenge the exclusion?

Bloody hell Unknown!

@UnknownStuntman

What an outrageous comment and made, I hope, for no other purpose other than to be outrageous!

Ridiculous comment unknown!

I'm not wrong, though, am I? If SS were notified that a repeated sex pest was living with vulnerable children and it's mother didn't care and it's father was making jokes about it, I'm sure they would take an interest.

If SS were notified that a repeated sex pest was living with vulnerable children and it's mother didn't care and it's father was making jokes about it, I'm sure they would take an interest

It's stark reading, but every bit of is true.

Aren’t words dangerous eh?
“Repeated sex pest”
“Cocky, disrespectful teen”
Which phrase would the press use?

@UnknownStuntman

Do you find spelling as well as thinking difficult?

Your rather silly-and I think purposeful- misspelling of my name leads me to think that your hands may be a little on the hairy side.

Which phrase would the press use?

May I suggest feckless parent?

Indeed you may

'Repeated sex pest!'

Lol!

OP - you're getting very concerned about your son being, understandably, excluded for one day, just one day.
If your son doesn't stop harassing the teacher the exclusion could be much longer or permanent.
Talk to senior staff to see how you can support their attempts to civilise your son.

God, am having a flashback to a cocky 16 year old who thought it hilarious to wiggle his bum at me while asking did I think it was peachy?
This was after having been told to bring me his logbook to comment in after he'd been doodling bums all lesson.
He was less cocky when I got hold of his Aunt who worked at the school and who simply said she'd sort it. I am no Spring Chicken so water off a duck's back really - just immature silliness meant to embarrass me/disrupt the lesson - but had I been an NQT or younger then it might have been intimidating. Same kid threatened to put fireworks in my exhaust and claimed he 'knew where I lived'.
Charming. Especially when I had a toddler to collect at the time.

OP he has to accept the punishment and you need to explain how bravado+ 'bantz' (shudder) can = sexual harrassment. And that the very least his buffoonery makes it difficult for others to learn = him being a selfish git.
for the poor woman having to deal with such twatdom on a daily basis.

OP has waltzed away because she doesn't like being told her son is a disgusting misogynistic piece of trash.

Let's face it, if the teacher had been black rather than a woman, and the 15yo, rather than being sexist had instead been racist - calling the teacher a n*** and so on, would the parent suggest "moving the child to another class" as a realistic solution? We all would've known that in the long-term, the kid will grow up to be a racist, a racist pandered to by his parents.

But here some can't see the obvious; the kid will drop out of school and within three years will be in the pubs, calling the barmaids 'darling' and beating up women (and thanks to the gym membership, the punches will really hurt! ).

Hey, OP, why not do something before your son ends up like this? Leaving him to play on X-Box doesn't really cut it.

Gonna chuck this into the mix again........
Shouldn’t he be doing his mocks?!

Cancel the gym membership.

I know you don't want to, but you really, really should. Why? Because it's a natural consequence will be effective. He used the gym to build his abs; he isn't responsible or mature enough to have them. So cancel it and try again when he's in college.

There are many ways to get exercise which are free and don't have the "cool" factor which feeds into this behaviour. He can walk the dog (or a friend's dog), go for a run outdoors, ride his bike. He can run up and down your stairs or dance to some music.

He has shown he cannot use the results of his gym membership responsibly. Therefore he needs to lose it. You really do need to nip this in the bud. He is in an important year and you really don't want to be on here a third time.

A boy in my maths class in school started doing exactly the same thing, first it was comments, wolf whistling then it turned to flashing, all with the aim of taking 'power' off her. Took a while before he was expelled for good (just before GCSE's) and saw on facebook last month he was charged for child sexual activity, making thirteen/fourteen year old girls watch pornography and harassment charges.

Unfortunately that's probably where OP's son will end up.

This is literally the sort of behaviour that can end a teachers career.

I cannot believe you and your husband are joking about it.
Your DS should be PERMANENTLY excluded.

OMG - Your son is being a twat and you are definitely NOT minimising this. You are admitting that you are out of your depth and are completely shocked and underwhelmed by this behaviour. You don't deserve this crap. Meanwhile, your son DEFINITELY needs to understand where this can go. Perhaps a toddle down to the police station to have a chat with the local WPC about how his "harmless" behaviour can get him into trouble if it continues. I know he's only 15, but nobody is finding this funny and you can't pick up the pieces for much longer, legally either. Dad is too far away to kick his arse (literally or metaphorically) in any meaningful sense, and you have three others kids hanging off you and work as well! No wonder you're under siege!

UnknownStunstman, you have said something really horrible!

The op has posted on here because she wants help, not condemnation.

I read this thread a few hours ago, many have posted since then so if I post now, I will only be going on the original information. I'll try and come back later.

Just to say op, I am so very sorry for you. I do think (from what I read earlier), your son has just been inappropriately OTT and definitely needs to learn how to rein it in. However none of that points to him being a sex offender in the future, some youngsters lack self control in how they speak.

My adult son had a friend who used to say extremely inappropriate things to girls of their acquaintance; the girls considered him to be a sleaze ball (boys, inc my son, also saw him that way, I too found him a bit creepy). He lived with his very shy and ineffectual mother and her dad, his grandad. They were quite old fashioned (I'm sure you are not, just giving background to this lad's story).

When he was properly adult he was quite different and is now just like most other people, has a long term partner, career and quite sensible. Would probably be embarrassed if anyone mentioned how he used to be. He just didn't know the right way to say things and behave. Thankfully he did no harm - but your son has done no harm! Hang onto that thought.

No more from me for now but for you. See you later.

You clearly have STILL not taken on board what you were told on your other thread about all this.

He CERTAINLY doesn't "have to" be on the Xbox! Confiscate it and set him enough chores to keep him busy. Might be useful to set him an essay on sexual harassment!

I think you also need to take his phone and check his activity on it - and be prepared to discover he's done worse to girls his own age or younger.

"I don't actually check his phone, no. What are you suggesting I would find???" Why am I not surprised?? ANY responsible parent monitors their child's online activity. That was the rule for my dd while she was just a child and I was paying for it! Access to phone & all sm accounts, at any time.

Not just for this kind of situation (which most don't need to deal with) but to ensure THEY aren't being bullied/harassed (which is what I discovered).

She's almost 18 and for several years now has been both disgusted and bored by the sheer number of dick & arse pics, requests for lewd pics (which she always refuses - even with people she's dating), sexist, sexualised & derogatory comments... Often from men far too old for her! (Even though she has her settings quite tight they get through! She then blocks & reports).

In your case I think it's entirely possible he's making sexist comments, possibly harassing girls/women (if he's that brave in real life with someone supposedly in a position of authority I suspect he's FAR more brazen behind an anon screen! Dick & arse pics would not surprise me at all! Requests for lewd pics from girls...) "Pornography" - yep! I dread to think what "genre"!

"Another item that will more likely than not be on his phone: upskirting shots." Yep!

I actually think it could be a good thing op hasn't yet taken the phone. Chances are if she takes it in the morning she'll find he's been talking about the incident he's been excluded for - and his TRUE feelings about it - which I suspect will be along lines of "it's not fair" "I did nothing wrong" "miss X (the teacher) is a cow anyway she always hated me" MAYBE then the op will WAKE THE FUCK UP! (Not holding my breath though).

"titchy in your list of what may be on the phone, you missed a couple of things:

Suggestions the teacher's frigid / on her period / not getting enough / whatever for not appreciating his abs
Ideas shared with his mates for how to "get her back" for the exclusion" yep!

Exactly HOW was he sanctioned at home? Because you were very reluctant to even accept he was out of order and were even blaming the teacher for how they handled it!

YOU raised him YOU need to take responsibility for the fact he's apparently turning into a disobedient sex pest!

"it isn't like he's whacked someone in the face or been racist, which I thought was what exclusions were usually for :(" you think sexism isn't as bad as racism?! Sexual harassment isn't serious?!

"Doesn’t sound like he took it seriously when he was last told off for being inappropriate" to be honest based on the last thread I don't think op took it seriously either!

"I would put good money on there being other things he is doing and saying that fall just outside of punsishable behaviours" totally agree.

I think it highly likely these are actually only incidents 1&2, I strongly suspect more like 5/6. That the initial incidents were one word comments etc and he's escalated.

"Sorry I really don't want to sound like I condone his behaviour" I suspect you're only saying that because we're (and the school) are telling you it's inappropriate - not because you genuinely believe it to be so.

Comments like " I guess he deserves it" confirm that opinion.

And it IS the same teacher - what a surprise! STOP PUSSY FOOTING ABOUT!

Grounded for a month - he can exercise at home!
No X box
Kept busy with chores & homework (including LOTS of reading of the effects of sexual harassment on victims!)

Enough is enough time you stopped with the "boys will be boys" "banter" crap and START PARENTING!

"I really do not feel i am "minimising" his actions if you actually read the thread" I agree with that poster, you did on that thread and you're STILL doing so!

"and I am thinking about asking to have him moved out of her class?" And what will you do if he harasses that teacher too? Or a pupil?

"How do you guys suggest I stop the behaviour escalating?" Consequences that impact/inconvenience him & educating him on how he SHOULD treat women & girls. Frankly it's shameful he's reached 15 without being taught that.

,"I genuinely believed it was a joke which went too far and not a sexualised thing." Even though loads of others including teachers told you otherwise on the other thread.

"Also for the PP who said he doesn't fancy her, he is threatening her, I don't really get that?" Then maybe you should research sexual harassment effect on victims too. It's behaviour designed to undermine, to assert power. I think it's highly likely you'll find he DOESN'T like this teacher. Is it a class in a subject he dislikes? Doesn't do well in?

"Do you have ANY idea what would happen to a teacher if this incident somehow became twisted so it was a two way interaction?" Op said on the other thread teacher should have had a private word with her son, many pointed out the reasons why this was a bad idea including that it opens up the teacher to horrendous accusations.

Juells - a display of physical strength in a sexualised manner, in school, to a teacher quite possibly smaller in size. Surrounded by HIS mates laughing & joking about it probably? And with the potential issues of her word against his as to why he did it ruining her career?

Damn straight it's threatening!

"This a million times. You don't seem to understand that this is what he is becoming" she was told this on the other thread too and dismissed myself and others who pointed it out as "overreacting"

Op I have attached an image.

Your "stupid boy" is already at the 3rd tier up on that and he's still just 15!

"Off to bed in a min but thanks for all the replies (apart from people who suggest my son is soon to be a rapist. sidenote, actually text DH to tell him to get his arse back to england because our son is becoming a sexual predator, and he replied "get the fuck off mumsnet" - thats meant to be tongue in cheek btw)" wow! Defensive AND minimising! Your son doesn't stand a chance really does he? How does your husband treat women? (I dread to think!)

"Teachers have been assaulted before." This was ALSO pointed out to op on other thread - iirc she was dismissive of even the possibility that the teacher may fear him targeting her to this extent.

"and probably-at this moment-a frightened one at that." Not buying that for a second! Based on op's response last time I think he's (rightly) fairly confident he can wrap his parents round his little finger!

Teddybearbaby - it hadn't even occurred to op to do even the most MINIMAL punishment at home!

Instead op is taking issue with the (entirely appropriate) punishment the school have issued!

Wow. I have a 15yr old boy too. He has Aspergers and is very bright and would never dream of doing something like this.
Ds has lost 5st 7lb in 10 months and has transformed his body and even so I know he would deem this totally inappropriate and he has fantastic relationships with his option subjects especially.

So if this was my ds ( who also loves his Xbox ) I would be locking it away or removing the pad, whatever is easiest and assuming he is doing his GCSE's in 5 months like mine would give him a ton of revision to do, minimal attention and time to reflect.

Being the class clown will not end well.

I just thought exclusions were REALLY rare

They are. That's how serious this is.

Your son has been sexually harassing a woman. It's really not funny.

You need to check his phone to see if he has been harassing girls at his school.

You also need to check his Xbox to see if he's using it to watch porn.

You say he's become laddish in the past year. Both you and your DH need to have a serious and ongoing conversation with your DS about respect for women and how to form healthy relationships.
What do your other children think? Can they give you some insight into his behaviour?

I hope you manage to get through to your son and that he learns what is and is not acceptable.

op I think you are getting a rough ride here. While I agree that an exclusion is appropriate for your son, I don’t think you are minimising his behaviour.

At 15 he’s old enough to know that banter with mates is not an excuse for what he has done and I think this exclusion might help him see that. So rather than being worried about it I would see it as a good opportunity to educate him and to nip this in the bud now. It’s not going to stop him getting a job etc, but you can use it as an opportunity to teach him how very serious the consequences will be if he doesn’t learn right now that what he is doing is sexual harassment, and that it will be taken very seriously if he persists. I don’t think it would do any harm for you to make clear to him that if he doesn’t learn right now that he can’t behave in this way he will be on a path to suspension and ultimately police involvement.