Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

re school exclusion

516 replies

mummy207 · 09/01/2019 20:31

I posted a while back about my DS being inappropriate at school, he asked a teacher to add him on snapchat and was isolated for it. The reactions on here were split between whether this was an overreaction by the school or acceptable. I accepted it and sanctioned him at home and fully supported the school after reading all of your helpful responses. Lots of teachers responded.

Unfortunately today there has been a follow up and I have been told my son needs to be excluded tomorrow and stay at home. I totally agree he is being absolutely unacceptable , he apparently lifted his top up and asked the teacher whether she liked his abs. I know it's fucking insane, don't get me started.

They have said because this is his second "Sexually inappropriate offense" (question whether the snapchat thing was sexually inappropriate!!) , he needs an external exclusion which will go on his record. Although I agree he is in the wrong, this again to me seems really ridiculous. What is making him sit at home all day going to achieve? He will be on xbox! Also some of his peers have had several fights, bullying, etc and not been excluded. Exclusions are really rare. I am absolutely devastated. Is there anything I can do about this? It says on the paperwork I can challenge the exclusion?

OP posts:
Original poster
mummy207 · 09/01/2019 21:06

How do you guys suggest I stop the behaviour escalating?

By the way he has had no other exclusions or isolations until these events. He is not frequently in trouble, just the odd thing. I agree he has become a lot more laddish in the last year or so, which I really don't like and clearly it's in a serious way for him to be behaving like this. I agree I was probably too lenient on the snapchat thing, I genuinely believed it was a joke which went too far and not a sexualised thing. However, lifting his shirt up to show a teacher his body is clearly sexualised, so I must have been wrong.

However, I am really not sure where to go with it. He seemed to understand and accept last time that he was in the wrong,but has a big group of friends and I can imagine my voice in the back of his head clearly isn't affecting his behaviour when showing off in front of them, probably also showing off in front of girls he fancies.

Also for the PP who said he doesn't fancy her, he is threatening her, I don't really get that?

OP posts:
Greensleeves · 09/01/2019 21:06

If he behaves like this towards a female supervisor in his first job, would you expect them to move hime sideways so he didn't have to be around her? Pull the other one.

He should be moved if the teacher doesn't want to be around him. After the exclusion and profuse apologies. Otherwise, he should be showing the school, you and the teacher that he can attend her class and behave decently like everyone else.

Blueemeraldagain · 09/01/2019 21:07

I teach in a secondary school for boys with social, emotional and mental health problems. They have all been “asked to leave” or permanently excluded from mainstream school. Our behaviour policy is very different and much more lenient that most in mainstream schools due to the needs of our students. They are often (as in daily) verbally abusive, physically violent and can cause a tremendous amount of damage to school property (kicked in doors, broken windows etc). I was called a fat slag for challenging a (tall 15 year old male) student who was using his whole body weight and strength to try and barge his way through a door past a petite TA.

If one of our boys had done what your son has done he’d be looking at 2-3 days exclusion minimum and only being allowed back once you and he had agreed to him attending some mentoring sessions to unpick why he felt the need to behave in this way and how he could be different in the future.

Sexual harassment/aggression is no joke.

Nunya · 09/01/2019 21:07

He’s not being excluded for being a stupid boy he’s being excluded for sexual harassment. You’re son is intentionally harassing women. How can you not see how worrying this is.

THIS! OP, you keep saying that you thought^ exclusions were RARE so you seem really surprised, but they ARE; so what does that tell you? His behavior is not just being a stupid boy, not just “banter” with a teacher he clearly “fancies”. You guess he deserves the punishment!? I feel horrible for this teacher. Sexual harassment is bad enough for an exclusion, at the very least. You want to take him in with you to talk to her about another way forward? Keep minimizing and dismissing his behavior, eh?

Kolo · 09/01/2019 21:07

I really feel for this teacher. I’ve been a young, female teacher in a secondary school and occasionally I faced inappropriate sexual behaviour. It’s perhaps difficult for you to recognise this as what it is, OP, because generally we see teachers as the person in the classroom with power and authority. But it can be a very vulnerable position, especially when you’re a young and inexperienced teacher. At the start of my career I was only a few years older than these teenagers, and I was left for hours a day alone in a room with a group of 30 teens. It was difficult to see myself as the person with the ‘power’ sometimes. And sometimes I felt downright vulnerable; not really knowing how to react to sexual harassment from a gang of boys, maybe worried I’d done something wrong to ‘cause’ it (don’t victims often blame themselves?), worried about my superiors finding out about it because maybe they’d think I’d done something to instigate it, or that the boys might make false accusations.

I’m glad to hear the teacher is reporting it and that the school is taking it seriously. It doesn’t sound like twatish behaviour, it sounds like cocky sexual harassment.

TheZeppo · 09/01/2019 21:08

Excellent idea from Teen

Madders45 · 09/01/2019 21:08

Also for the PP who said he doesn't fancy her, he is threatening her, I don't really get that?

He’s trying to shift the balance of power in the room by humiliating her.

He’s asserting his power over her. He’s threatening her authority in the classroom.

Travisandthemonkey · 09/01/2019 21:09

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Quartz2208 · 09/01/2019 21:12

OP sexually inappropriate behaviour particularly one designed to make a woman in charge feel embarrassed is definitely at the very least on a par with physical assault and racism

Bloodyfucksake · 09/01/2019 21:12

Mummy207 at least you get it now. Your 15 year old is still growing and maturing so all is not lost.
I'm a teacher, I've seen boys do these things and actually with a team approach from school and parents, it can be quickly turned around. Lock the Xbox up and set him to do the garden/ clean out your old cupboards and write an apology to the teacher. Tell him that you are a woman and it makes you uncomfortable and sometimes scared when men do these things. Ask him if he wants to be this kind of man.

Otherwise let him stay home playing Xbox, believe that it's banter, and watch him turn into the kind of man who thinks they can do whatever they want to women. He's 15 and harassing teachers. How will he treat a younger girl?

SillySallySingsSongs · 09/01/2019 21:12

Also for the PP who said he doesn't fancy her, he is threatening her, I don't really get that?

Seriously?!

WizardOfToss · 09/01/2019 21:13

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheZeppo · 09/01/2019 21:13

I too have experienced inappropriate comments from teen boys in the classroom (banter, showing off, genuinely flirting and threatening Sad)

You know how it makes me feel? Sick. It’s beyond uncomfortable to deal with and there is always that underlying threat.

And all I want to do is teach them!

SmileEachDay · 09/01/2019 21:13

Do you have ANY idea what would happen to a teacher if this incident somehow became twisted so it was a two way interaction?

I hope she’s contacted her union and I hope the school has got it in writing that this was your lad behaving terribly. Hopefully the exclusion will prevent any rumours of “Miss said I was buff and...”

I have seen it happen, and it’s awful.

AnotherPidgey · 09/01/2019 21:14

I remember the initial post and at that time it was a bit grey as to the severity of his intentions. This follow up to the same member of staff is very serious.

No wifi/ phone/ X-Box during the exclusion. Is he picking up "lad culture" also known as being an intimidating mysogenistic pest from somewhere? Gym? Social media?

He needs to understand what the consequences of this kind of behaviour are on his victim and why it is serious.

Knittink · 09/01/2019 21:14

i have said I am too furious to look at him and I am thinking about asking to have him moved out of her class?

How is not looking at him any help? And you don't get to decide which class he goes in. You need to impose sanctions at home. Removal of Xbox, grounding, extra jobs at home etc.

Fiveletters · 09/01/2019 21:14

If he’s excluded, he should be provided with work to do. He can do that instead of being on his xbox. And if he’s in Year 11, surely he can be doing revision for his GCSE’s?

Wolfiefan · 09/01/2019 21:15

You don’t get how he’s trying to humiliate and undermine her? It’s not laddish. It’s completely twattish.

Original poster
mummy207 · 09/01/2019 21:16

His Dad works in the US a lot (we are in the UK) so not currently here to speak to him about it.
However I will be telling him and asking him to speak with DS tomorrow while he's at home over Skype.

Currently I'm here with 4 kids though, sorry if sometimes a little slow on uptake. Hadn't really thought about taking xbox to work for those asking about that.

OP posts:
Wolfiefan · 09/01/2019 21:18

Too cross to look at him?
Thinking of having him moved out of her class?
How are either of those things going to change his behaviour?

ElizabethBennetismybestfriend · 09/01/2019 21:18

Totally justified. No excuse for sexual harassment which is exactly what this is. As a HOY I would certainly be asking for a student to be excluded for such behaviour and my HT would have no hesitation in authorising it. I agree with Madders45 and this sort of behaviour should not be tolerated.

Juells · 09/01/2019 21:19

I didn't have boys, but must admit if a 15-year-old lifted his top and asked me what I thought of his abs I wouldn't find it the least bit threatening Confused I accept that everyone else thinks it's sexual harassment, but to me it would just be a boy being silly and showing off Confused

Soconfusedbylife · 09/01/2019 21:19

Really??

I’d be taking tomorrow off for a day long lecture including looking at sexual harassment and sexual assault victim testimonials if it were my son. The gym would be gone. The X-box would be gone. He would also be writing numerous apology letters.

Madders45 · 09/01/2019 21:21

I didn't have boys, but must admit if a 15-year-old lifted his top and asked me what I thought of his abs I wouldn't find it the least bit threatening confused I accept that everyone else thinks it's sexual harassment, but to me it would just be a boy being silly and showing off confused

I take it you’re not a teacher, @Juells?

Try imagining a boy doing that while you’re a young female teacher trying to maintain control and authority over a room of 30 rowdy, laddish teenagers.

titchy · 09/01/2019 21:21

He will be unwanted sending dick pics in a year or so.
Sadly he will just be one of those types of guys, no respect for boundaries, what’s appropriate or what a woman clearly wants or doesn’t want. And we all wonder where these men were when they were children

This a million times. You don't seem to understand that this is what he is becoming. I think that's why posters here are frustrated with you - you don't seem to make the link between the 15 year old that sexually harasses his teacher, and the bloke that sexually assaults women because he doesn't regard their boundaries as theirs.