To ask if anybody on here is pro-life?

[Teeandee]

When it comes to the subject of abortion I've noticed a high number of people on here are very pro-choice and support abortion. Is there anybody else, like me, who doesn't?

Everybody is entitled to their opinion of course and I don't think badly of anybody who has had a termination and I don't judge. It's only my personal outlook and life experiences that shape my view and was wondering if I really am in the minority here?

I do find it interesting how the general consensus is that it's nothing to do with anybody else what another woman chooses to do with her body yet this entire site is made up of threads where people are discussing and judging other people's choices.

Why can't we judge somebody for having multiple abortions of healthy foetus' for no reason other than not wanting a baby but we can judge (for example on MN lately) somebodies DH choosing to have a massive skull tattooed onto his forehead?

Is DH's facial tattoo more our business than Jane up the roads 4 abortions?

I am broadly pro-choice but
a) I know there are some women (and it may be due to coercion by partners) who appear to use it as a form of contraception and it's worse for their bodies than contraception and
b) I do not believe that parents who find they are expecting a child with a disability that is survivable have real information about what life is like with such a child - it seems to be assumed they will terminate without being given this information.

Kind of just want to repeat, there are no grey areas! You're pro choice or you're not. No caveats. Women are allowed to choose, or their not.

OP are you reading the posts about many people who have multiple abortions? You must realise that it's more complex than saying 'use contraception'.

If they do stop women having abortions for 'social' reasons do you think there will be more money put into health for more addiction midwives, more mother and baby units, if someone in my town needs a mother and baby unit they have to travel a minimum of 50 miles (if there are beds in that unit, if not further), more foster carers, more social workers etc.

On the face of it a woman who knows that she can't go though post parting psychosis again, or a woman who cannot give up alcohol may seem like she's having an abortion for a social reason (because she does not want to tell you her life story).

sparklybanana

It is so easy for people to say what they would or wouldn’t do, but until a badly timed, scary pregnancy happens to you there is absolutely no way of knowing. Your post highlights that abortion is so often a decision made by women out of love for those already in their life.

@teeanddee maybe this woman seems “nonchalant” when describing her abortions to you but an abortion is not a painless procedure. If a woman is choosing to put herself through painful cramps, heavy bleeding, nausea and other possible side affects “multiple times” for “no reason” then I suspect something else is going on.

Thing is you don't know if those children will have a quality of life , plus it's very easy to say you wouldn't abort for special needs without living that life .. I'm living it and it's hard .. very very hard!

holasoydora
Of course there are other background factors and help/support can and should be provided. It still doesn't mean anyone has to morally agree with someone repeatedly choosing to have unprotected sex and multiple abortions (issues of assault, coercion are separate obviously).

I know numerous women who are lax with contraception, forget to take their pill, run out of condoms but the couple decide to risk it etc. They dont all have case files behind them. They are average people who can't be arsed to sort contraception out. Some go on to have 'surprise' pregnancies and 'happy accidents', which I always find odd given that it's hardly rocket science that unprotected sex can lead to pregnancy.

Why can't we judge somebody for having multiple abortions of healthy foetus' for no reason other than not wanting a baby but we can judge (for example on MN lately) somebodies DH choosing to have a massive skull tattooed onto his forehead?

There's not a lobby of people campaigning to deny the right of someone to have a massive skull tattooed on their head though is there? The two situations are hardly equatable.

I think there’s a problem with the discussion around abortion in this county being so toxic and black and white that it is very difficult for women to talk about how physically and emotionally damaging an abortion can be, for fear that pro-lifers will pounce on it as a reason abortion shouldn’t happen. Hi

MaisyPops - well thank god those women can get early terminations then - isn't choice great

I'm not against choice ghosty.

I have a personal opinion about adults who choose not to take responsibility by repeatedly having unprotected sex and then claim surprise at the outcome of conception. Some will choose to continue and others will choose a termination, as is their choice. I still think it's staggeringly ridiculous for adults to repeatedly have unprotected sex and then act like pregnancy was some sort of shock outcome.

1.” I used to believe that I would have a termination if I got pregnant accidentally. Once I got pregnant (intentionally) I realised that I would not be able to make that choice because the baby was real to me from the moment I got that positive test.” That’s because you were intentionally pg with a wanted baby. It feels VERY different when you are thinking “OMG I do NOT want this to be happening to my body”. I can tell you that as I have experienced both. You just cannot judge how you feel about all pregnancies when you have only experienced a wanted baby.

1. Naturally, we talk about a wanted baby as a baby from earliest embryo (really, a bunch of cells) onwards. The earliest ‘heartbeat’ is not a beating heart, it is the electrical pulse which will become the heartbeat.
2. I have respect for those whose moral absolute is that human life is sacrosanct. It is a morally defensible position. As long as you are prepared to accept for your own self that if you are in a life or death maternal crisis you will continue to say ‘no’ to the termination of your pregnancy. As soon as you start on ifs and buts, rape, disabled child, etc, you are deciding to what degree a woman ‘deserves’ to have dominion over her own body. This woman ‘deserves’ to be free of pregnancy, this woman ‘deserves’ to go ahead and bring an unwanted child into a chaotic neglectful home, and so on.
3. For the “if you don’t want to get pg don’t have PIV sex “ brigade: I got pregnant without having PIV sex. No, not a Christmas miracle, a matter of messy hands. I was so, so relieved to be able to have a termination, looked after at a compassionate, kind, woman-centred clinic.
4. No, terminating is not necessarily traumatic. An unwanted pregnancy felt traumatic, a termination was a relief. Guilt and regret free. I know many experience trauma, and for them I am truly sorry and sad. But this constant narrative that abortion is a trauma tells women that somehow it ought to be so. Why should it be? And sorry, I do not believe the 7 week foetus I terminated felt pain.

Please can we do away with these euphemistic terms? And talk of ‘anti-abortion’ and ‘pro rights to abortion’ ?

I am pro-choice in terms of a woman's right todecid3 about her bidy but my personal choice, unless my life was at risk from the pregnancy, would always be pro-life. That's because I think you only get one chance at life - another sperm, another egg would be a different life- and I don't feel I should be taking that chance at life for that potential baby.

Body not bidy. 🙄

I think sometimes here on MN there is a bit of a bubble in which the answer is black and white (with all the shades of grey thrown in) because the spectrum of what poster's ideas of an unwanted pregnancy are is limited to those poster's experiences. So it's a debate about unreliable contraception/ rape/ medical problems. In my own personal and professional experience:
A- I am an alcoholic in my 20's. I use drugs regularly too. I've been homeless and live chaotically. I don't use contraception, or do but if I'm off my face I often don't know who or where I am for days on end. I don't want a baby, can't look after one and don't track my periods at all which has just caused me to discover I'm 18 weeks pregnant. I'm not going to stop drinking, I don't want a baby and will not stop using drugs, will not attend antenatal appointments and have no concern about this baby when it's born.
Should A be denied an abortion? A baby being adopted with possible difficulties like FAS caused by the mother who won't/ can't stop? Or kept by a mother who gives no fucks?
B- I'm 17, drink, use recreational drugs. I've been arrested a few times. My mum said she'd help me look after the baby but she is also looking after my siblings and is not particularly against my lifestyle, she thinks it's funny. My dad is in and out of prison for drug related offences and assaulting my mum. I was ok after finding out about the pregnancy, decided it was a girl and named her at 8 wks but now my boyfriend's fucked off, I've met another boy and I don't want it. I'm 13 weeks.
C- moderate learning difficulties, very vulnerable but hands washed of her by LA once she was 18, lived with various 'foster carers' and supported living but preyed upon by predators. Had one baby, taken away at 2. Horrendously distressful to her. But as soon as no little one's on the scene she'a back to mostly her own devices, no real support. Contraception advised but not enforced, no real protection from men up to no good. Pregnant again, doesn't realise until quite late on, is in absolute shreds because she was allowed to keep her last baby until they were literally torn screaming from her. Wants an abortion rather than go through that again. This was a horrific failing- but it is not unique.
I've known all 3 of these women. Should they have been denied abortions?

Having an abortion is killing a baby - I think it's dishonest to pretend otherwise. However there are still times when abortion is justifiable - because there are two lives - the mother as well. Therefore I am pro choice (although I can't imagine having an abortion myself, there are many women whose lives are unimaginably different to mine). I don't know anyone who's had one so I don't honestly know how I would react. It would probably depend entirely on the circumstances.

In fact I agree with stickman

eightoclock “I don't know anyone who's had one so I don't honestly know how I would react”
Or
You don’t know anyone who has disclosed to you that they have had an abortion....

1 in 3 women in the UK has had an abortion.

Why is this even an issue in this day and age?
Of course a woman ahould decide . The only thing i don't like is if a woman didn't use contraception and was flippant but again...her choice. It's not an easy choice either.

Tbh i think if we were more supportive of women in general and more supportive of single mums, there would be far fewer abortions.

If women had more financial power and support perhaps they wouldn't have to make such difficult choices.

But is an abortion a murder?...no way...under a certain age.If it could survive outside the womb then it could be adopted instead if mum couldn't cope.

Thank you for that post stickman, very thought provoking. I can't imagine how anybody could think forcing any of those young women to continue a pregnancy is a good idea.

Since the question was asked, I will say I am pro life. I think humans are humans from the moment of conception. I saw my DD moving at her scan at eight weeks, so deliberately bending and stretching her legs. She was a person. All babies are people therefore we should not kill them.

We shouldn't kill them even if we think they'll have crappy lives or if their very existence will cause inconvenience or pain to other people's lives. There are plenty of people who have crap lives or make my life worse but I am not allowed to kill them.

We kill babies because we can and because they can't stop us. If we truly understood as a society that babies are real people, right from the beginning, I think our whole attitude and culture around sex would change.

I don't hold out much hope for that though. For those who have already had abortions or supported abortions, the reality will be too much to face. It is easier and more comforting to hold up the virtue of bodily autonomy above the sanctity of human life.

Also, I would never put my views so bluntly in real life or try and shame a woman who has had an abortion. But this is what I think.

I wish I could've found the right response to a red faced man handing out anti abortion leaflets outside the bus station today.

I think our whole attitude and culture around sex would change.

Despite being pro choice (as it currently is) I think this is sadly true. People do not take enough responsibility for sex. In evolutionary terms this is very recent and unprecedented.