Adults who won't drive

[Homethroughthepuddles]

I'm not talking about those who have health difficulties or can't afford a car. Just those who can't be bothered to learn, or who learn but can't be bothered to sit their test.

I'm once again spending Christmas having to do all the ferrying around and staying off the wine, while my sister, who has learnt to drive and even bought a car but has refused to sit her test, has been chauffeured around and been able to drink as much as she likes.

With my mother getting older and more reliant on lifts it's very annoying.

Meh. We don't drive for multiple reasons. V. V. occassionally we will ask for a favour from a driver (and make it clear they can say no) and v. occassionally we won't be able to do something because we can't drive (drivers are always shocked by how little this happens though).

If you have an issue being a taxi, don't be. With the exception of elderly or disabled people who I can understand may be an obligation, you don't HAVE to drive people around. We wouldn't expect lifts from anyone and actually think people who do are unreasonable.

I also think drivers who see non-drivers are second class citizens or as being somehow defective are unreasonable.

I can drive but I actually sold my car earlier this year because I just don't need it. I learned to drive at 17 and had a car but then I moved abroad and sold it. I then lived in Madrid for nearly a decade and I had no need for a car as public transport was super easy, flexible and widespread (not to mention cheap!).

When I moved back to the UK I bought a car but over the last couple of years I noticed that, more often than not, I'd take public transport over the car or walk as we live in a fairly small town. I only ever used the car if I had a very early/late shift at work and was paying for a car I never used so I sold it and tbh it has not negatively affected my life.

Now I pay £45 a month on a travel pass for me and £20 for DDs pass. Even taking the occasional taxi when I do an early/late shift at work (£3.50 a time) I am still over a hundred pounds better off every month not paying for a car.

Not wanting to drive somewhere is not self-limiting. You can still get wherever you want to go. Car drivers are hugely lacking in imagination and organisational skills if they feel that's their only option.

Like, if you don't have your own car parked in your own driveway, you'll actually be unable to go anywhere under your own steam?

Sorry, but it IS self-limiting - not in a sense of being unable to do something at all but in making things much less convenient or straightforward than they could be.

Car drivers are NOT hugely lacking in imagination and organisational skills, just because they tend to automatically choose to use their cars for many personal/family journeys. They just know that they've invested in a purpose-designed tool for this very reason, so why ever wouldn't they use it?

Do you equally believe that people are lacking imagination if they automatically tend to use the oven in their kitchen on a daily basis to make dinner, when they also have the perfectly functional options of dragging a barbecue to the park in December or trotting off to the woods to build a bonfire out of fallen branches?

There are laundrettes which mean that you absolutely don't need to have your own washing machine at home. You can go to the swimming baths and use their showers, so you don't need to have one at home yourself. Public libraries have computers with internet access, so you don't need a laptop or tablet of your own.

It's up to everybody to decide what works best for them (or indeed which options are open to them, based on health and financial considerations), but most people who have the space and money for one would have their own washing machine, shower and computer, so why is a car any different?

It's all going to be academic anyway in 10-20 years' time, as fallible humans will not actually be allowed to drive and individual vehicle ownership will be strongly discouraged if not made outright illegal (think Uber but with one extra available seat, shall we say); but for the time being, I can't personally see why an adult with the health and money to do so would be content being unable to drive. Even if you don't own a car, it's another string to your bow and another form of independence that you have, should you ever want to hire a car or van.

Sorry, but it IS self-limiting - not in a sense of being unable to do something at all but in making things much less convenient or straightforward than they could be

Surely you realise there are places where the access to public transport means life is just as straightforward as having a car?

And in fact more so in some situations!

Even if you don't own a car, it's another string to your bow and another form of independence that you have, should you ever want to hire a car or van

Should you want to hire a van, you just hire a “man with a van”. There’s countless!

It's quicker where I live to get a train to the city than to drive.

When my sil was buying a house she was hugely limited by the fact that she couldn't drive. She had to walk away from really nice affordable places because the train station was too far away/the bus service was poor/she'd have to walk down a very dark lonely road to get home from the station at nighttime.

She ended up really compromising in order to get a house she could afford near and a safe walk to a train station.

Likewise I know of someone who had to turn down a really good job offer recently because the commute by public transport would have been unrealistic.

So not being able to drive is limiting unless you can afford and want to live near a city or big town.

V. V. occassionally we will ask for a favour from a driver (and make it clear they can say no)
Well if this is genuinely true then you are unlike all the non drivers and non taxi takers in my family.
DA always manages to arrange everyone's life to give her lifts and DM makes it plain that her friends WILL take her to the airport bus at 4 am etc.

Sorry, but it IS self-limiting - not in a sense of being unable to do something at all but in making things much less convenient or straightforward than they could be.

How is it less convenient or straightforward though?

I know the timetables and routes of the 2 buses that stop at the bus stop a 30 second walk from my front door. I know exactly which bus I need to get to work on time and which bus stop goes to which bus.

If I know I need to be somewhere at a specific time/place where a bus/train isn't convenient I prebook a taxi. If it's a last minute thing then I book a taxi on one of my local taxi firms apps which tells me exactly how long the wait is. I have booked a taxi and had it be outside my door before I've had chance to turn off the lights, put on my shoes and coat and pick up my keys.

Every time I read one of these threads I am amazed and frustrated at just how stubborn non drivers are in their refusal to admit that at times it's essential to have a driver in the family, or that life for elderly people and those around them is so much easier if more than one person in
the family is available to bring them places.

Also, no matter how often it is explained, some will still refuse to believe that relying on taxis for every time an elderly parent has to go or be brought somewhere is just-not-practical.

Owning a car would be more "self-limiting" for me - I would be spending a LOT more money, which would limit opportunities to spend that money on something else! I live in London and currently only spend about £20 per week on travel as I walk to work. Congestion charge alone is £10 per day!

My elderly DGF had no relatives (drivers or otherwise) within 100 miles. He had to manage his own journeys. I can't help but notice how the elderly conveniently are more likely to become frail and dependent when they have family available to run around for them.

Every time I read one of these threads I am amazed and frustrated at just how stubborn non drivers are in their refusal to admit that at times it's essential to have a driver in the family, or that life for elderly people and those around them is so much easier if more than one person in
the family is available to bring them places

Not everyone is in that situation though. Which is why sweeping generalisations as per the OP never work!

It would be better for elderly people who can no longer drive if we were a little less car-centric as a country, so that public transport and even subsidised taxis were a practical choice everywhere.

If you’re proud to be a driver but want to live your whole life somewhere that isn’t accessible without a car, have a think about what you’ll do if/when driving is no longer an option for you, beyond “my children will just have to buy a car and give me lifts”.

My mum does have a taxi number and she's not afraid to use it.

Works well tbh.

What annoys me most is people who drive but won't do motorways so take a lot of public transport and then spend forever moaning about the crap public transport. When you're journey would take an hour in the car but you moan about spending 3 hrs on trains and buses you won't get any sympathy from me.

You don't even have to be elderly. A good friend of DH who has happily driven for years has recently been diagnosed with epilepsy. Luckily he doesn't live in the middle of nowhere because it's a difficult adjustment as it is.

She combines it with the free bus pass and makes relatively few taxi journeys. But it's not a big deal for her to use a taxi when it makes sense to.

MIL is able to drive, but refuses to. For years FIL has ferried her around everywhere, but now it's getting to the stage where he's not able for it anymore so she expects my DH to chauffeur her instead, and fool that he is, he never says no despite the fact that he has 3 other siblings.

These threads are so common on here...cue how non drivers are CFs, lazy, immature etc. As if we didn't feel bad enough about it as it is.

You can't drive unless you pass the test and the DVLA grants you a license. Many people can't pass the test and not through lack of trying. What are they supposed to do? It's not socially acceptable to tell people that you struggle with driving (the flippancy and judgment on this thread is a testament to that) and so from the outside, it may look as though the person 'can't be bothered' when in fact they may have spent hundreds on lessons and failed many tests, and still be no closer to their goal.

And yes, it can be inconvenient, and it is annoying at times, but no one understands that better than people who have to live with it on a daily basis.

I also find it interesting that people are so quick to complain about nervous and slow drivers on the road, and yet if you don't drive you get even more judgment!

at times it's essential to have a driver in the family, or that life for elderly people and those around them is so much easier if more than one person in
the family is available to bring them places.

Being old doesn't automatically oblige other people to drop everything to ferry you around.

My grandmother is now in a residential home but before that my grandad used to drive her everywhere. They used to live in a little village where it was essential that you drove as there was literally one bus a day that passed by. They had both lived there since they married 50 odd years ago but as soon as my grandad had to give up his licence on medical grounds they didn't expect anyone to start taxiing them around, they moved into a little bungalow near my mum and uncles. Even then they preferred their own independence by using their bus passes and taxis to get around.

The only time driving became an issue was when my grandfather's dementia developed to the point he needed specialist care and the only specialist care home was in the middle of nowhere. My grandma wanted to visit daily so my mum and uncles arranged an account with a local taxi firm so if none of them were available to drive her she could call a taxi and they would take her to the home and back whenever she wanted.

My mum and uncles had cars and were capable of driving my grandma every day but that didn't oblige them to do so. They ensured she had access to transport when and where she needed it but there was no obligation for it to be one of them that was driving her.

I think being a non driver is fine if you accept that running a car is expensive and that money you save on not running a car is therefore to be spent on taxis. Taxis seem a lot at the time but if you add up insurance, car purchase cost and fuel and servicing they work out much cheaper for people not needing a car for work.
My dad now can't drive and I keep hassling him about getting a taxi rather than 3 long but free bus journeys that he moans about as he isn't short of money and isn't rural but he's just never got in the habit of using taxis (I'm 8 hours away)

SIL hasn't learnt how to drive but DB drives her everywhere.He doesn't mind!!! Except for recently when they thought he had epilepsy ..... Then they were fucked !!!

The idea of getting a taxi in our past was a crazy expense but my mum has adapted and lives frugally as ever really, just adds in the occasional taxi.

I don't drive because I don't want to and don't need to. I don't rely on people for lifts.