A United Ireland

[poppiesallykatie]

Not a goady thread or to stir, but how many are against it or for it? Obviously many in NI want to part of the Republic, many in NI want to part of Great Britain, how do the British people feel about it?

@NeverTalksToStrangers; NI can't survive independently, but they will have an open market to 26 other nations under a backstop deal. Always protected. `I can't quite understand how that is not a winning situation for NI; except for the DUP propaganda.

You do understand that NI thought it was an integral part of the UK ? Would you discard Sussex or Wales or Yorkshire if they became a problem?

I think a significant number of English people would be quite happy if there was a united Ireland because they see NI as nothing but a nuisance that costs GB money. They also are angry that active members of the IRA were given "get out of jail free" deals instead of being brought to justice for the murders committed by them in GB and elsewhere.

Don’t forget the changes made to the Irish constitution to reflect the GF agreement- would these have to be reversed so that roi legislation and constitution could reflect the needs and rights of ni?

I think that Brexit is the biggest step we’ve seen in years towards the possibility of a United ireland but I don’t see it happening at this juncture.

They also are angry that active members of the IRA were given "get out of jail free" deals instead of being brought to justice for the murders committed by them in GB and elsewhere.

Yes. Lots of people in the Republic of Ireland equally angry about this. It was the price paid for peace.

I have no doubt that lots of british people would love to lose NI now it is a "nuisance that costs GB money" Unfortunately it doesn't work like that. A colonial past does leave you with some tricky situations, doesn't it?

@pallisers;
If you reread your first message on this thread, it actually reads a bit ambivalently. Or at least I read it that way; the 'your' bit. I do apologise, I get your point and it is the exact reason why I initiated my post. Suddenly the thick Irish are now "the problem'. How dare they, how dare they dictate a thing? That is what I have seen on message boards over the last few days. I am wondering, still, where NI lies here. Nobody wants them.

A colonial past does leave you with some tricky situations, doesn't it?

As an aside, for a United Ireland to happen both NI and RoI would need to vote in referenda to accept the new state.

Given how things have gone so far, I'm experiencing pre-emptive embarrassment of NI voting in favour only for RoI to (pragmatically) reject us.

poppie I was answering the pp who said we should become independent.

Pallisers, I have never been under the illusion that we were an integral part of the UK. It's like the emperor's new clothes. The Tory leadership daren't say what they really think.

If there was an obvious / workable solution to the issue, it would've been solved a long time ago.

Coming from a colony myself, I don't really understand the steadfast, blinkered allegiance to a 'parent' country, that barely even knows you exist. Let alone cares much about you.

I understand having sentimental thoughts for that 'parent' country, and links because of tradition. But the steadfast, heels-dug-in allegiance that takes precedence over the actual soil you're on is, I admit it, strange to me. I appreciate I don't get it.

It must also be pretty shit to think that - if push came to shove - neither 'power' genuinely really wants you.

Coming from a colony myself, I don't really understand the steadfast, blinkered allegiance to a 'parent' country, that barely even knows you exist. Let alone cares much about you.

Northern Ireland is very different from other colonies. For one, it doesn't consider itself a colony. for another the colonisation is more than 800 years old. Also for most of its history Ireland sent MPs to parliament unlike other colonies. You really do need to know the history to understand that "why can't there be a United Ireland to solve the brexit fuck-up" is really incendiary.

Amused though at any british response to bexit fuckwittage being "oh can't we just give back NI and then it will all be fine". really they should post that in relationships.

It would be lunacy for the ROI to take on Northern Ireland and thankfully would need a referendum to try and make us.....
"Given how things have gone so far, I'm experiencing pre-emptive embarrassment of NI voting in favour only for RoI to (pragmatically) reject us."
This made me laugh,heres hoping it doesn't come to that...but I do agree its a likely scenario.

Pragmatic though it may be, I just cant see there ever being a united Ireland in the next 50 years anyway. There is no benefit to the ROI in taking on N.I that I can think of. It just means civil unrest as half the population will be in uproar over the rejection of unionism and economically its not a boon.
There just isn't enough nationalistic feeling in the republic to risk economic downturn again.The shinners are thankfully not the majority. Irelands only just about recovered from the last downturn and no one wants to deal with austerity again.
The country is already at risk of being destabilised by the UK leaving europe as they are out biggest export market. While Dublin is likely to boom from a lot of the european companies moving their english speaking headquarters here and thanks to the corparate tax rate temping int companies it is just one section of the country...we essentially have one large urban area -Dublin and its commuter belt,some larger scattered towns/cities but the vast majority of the country is still agriculturally based...and most of the country is still feeling the affects of the last recession.

We don't need the North. They don't have anything of particular use to offer as an incentive...as a neutral country the ports and location that caused them to be essential to the UK aren't of benefit to the ROI...and theres so many negatives..

But the North cannot stand independently either and is not economically viable as a sole country....its border is going to cause issues with the EU and the UK..... and this is an entirely predictable scenario that the people in power should have discussed before the vote and considered the implications of before putting Brexit to the people.

Brexit's just highlighting the fact that the UK like's to try and forget the mess they created in NI and that the average person in the UK doesn't care or know a lot about that section of the union.

As an English person, I think it’s up to the people of Northern Ireland how they are governed. It has to be their decision.
I’m perfectly happy with NI as a valued part of the Union but it’s their call.

OP, bore off with the goadiness, there’s a good girl. Are you seriously sidelining the views of the Nothern Irish people who’ve identified as such on the thread while seeking some ‘dispassionate economist’ who will furnish you with support for some position on the backstop you already have? Because if you think that ‘dispassionate economics’ is all that’s at issue, you should do some reading.

I’m Scottish, and voted to remain part of the UK in our independence referendum. I think Northern Ireland has a complete right to self determination. If there was a referendum, whatever they decided they should be free to do. But my understanding of the situation is that it would be too fragile to sustain a referendum.

As an English person - I have no issues with the idea of a united Ireland. My parents and grandparents were affected by the IRA bombings (as in, know people who were injured / died) so their views may be clouded by those experiences, I don’t know.

I’m from N.i. Grew up in the Troubles. I am Irish and have duel citizenship., 2 passports. I want whatever DOES not re-start the conflict. I would be happy with A united Ireland becuase I think that the utter contempt that Westminister hold us in is clear. I’m fine with N..I. Being separate too, but for the love of god can we get some parties strong enough to give Protestants and alternative vote - those who could NEVER bring themselves to vote for SF regardless of how much they agree with their standing on social issues - to the bunch of corrupt, crazed, evangelical half-wits that make up the DU fecking P

I am in favour of the 32 countries being one country, but doubt if there is support in the Republic, and especially in the north. Unfortunately the representatives of the Unionist cause have been indulged far too much over the last century, most recently with the DUPs arrangement with the Tories.

The concern that a united Ireland would be a Catholic majority country and effectively 'Rome rule' is an outdated one, when you look at the results of recent referendums in the Republic.

Just read the comment about N..I. being a colony! Brilliant. You should pop over and bandy that thoughtbabout and see where it gets you!

This is a very interesting thread, placemarking

I can’t undersatad how the ‘we don’t want NI were all right jack’ people in the south can justify leaving 1000 s of IRISH people in the north to the tender mercies of Westminster and the DUP. It’s shameful

I'm from NI. I'm Irish ie I have an Irish passport and call myself Irish. I've no strong desire to see a united ireland.

Firstly, RoI don't want us. We are "takers" not contributors. Totally dependent on handouts from UK.
C60%of employment is in the public sector
There are some Protestants who are genuinely afraid of what they see as Irish catholic Ireland.

However if I hear the term "our precious union" being used one more time I'll boke.

The confidence and supply has given Arlene Foster delusions of grandeur.

Also RHI = corrupt, self serving leaders / hangers on abusing power and Paisley jr and his holidays to SriLanka and the Maldives!!! Should have been out long ago. See also Gerry Kelly and his bolt cutters.

Our political class have no respect for the electorate but conversely we're generally apathetic too.

All the opinion polls suggest two-thirds of NI are in favour of the withdrawal agreement and the backstop. This is a great solution for NI as it recognises that it is both British and Irish. The DUP will never be forgiven by moderates if they mess this up.

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A United Ireland will only be by consent of both NI and ROI. As NI moves more in favor it seems to me the ROI moves away (I live in ROI). If a United ireland is rejected in referendum no one is left at the mercies of Westminster. The GFA remains in place.

Of course you would be. This place is a basket case- we cost a fortune, why would a small country like Ireland want to take us on for any other reason than nationalism?

If the UK can find a few billion for the DUP, I'm sure it can find a few tens of billions to offer as a dowry to RoI ?