A United Ireland

[poppiesallykatie]

Not a goady thread or to stir, but how many are against it or for it? Obviously many in NI want to part of the Republic, many in NI want to part of Great Britain, how do the British people feel about it?

If they want to be the same as the British, then they can be the same and not just the bits they like.

Cracking example of a stupid and misinformed opinion on NI.

If you don't understand the nuances of a very complex and unstable political situation, it's probably best that you close your mouth and open your ears.

poppiesallykatie And they should be allowed to explore that themselves. Not have it forced upon them by external forces.

The time might (or might not) come when they want it but it is not up to others to tell them when that is.

'missesgiggens' I appreciate your comment, but I do get all of that, I am asking what others think, beyond those who live in Northern Ireland.

A very very complex situation. From people I know who live there, continuing peace is the best outcome.

There are, literally, people on both sides who would fight to the death over this so saying it belongs here or there isn't even a possible discussion without igniting violence again.

Focus on sustainable peace first.

I think aswell when the Good Friday Agreement was undergoing the referenda it needed to endorse it that the polling showed there would be a majority for staying in the UK if asked.

Pallisers I think that's how a lot of people in ROI feel. It's insulting to be honest to both ROI and NI. You can't just say nope, sorry they are too much hassle you take them now.

Should we force Scotland to merge with England? Would that be problematic for anyone?

Pallisers, at no stage in history as NI been part of GB. It was part of the UK of GB and I which became the UK of GB and NI after partition. The and is very important here. GB is, for all intents and purposes, the mainland.

'pallisers' I don't really get your point, that everything that happened 100 years ago is just as valid now? No-one is forcing anyone into anything, no matter how passionate some people are and how non-bothered others are. I suppose I just asked to see how many are non-bothered. Obviously I have a view.

UnknownStuntman, you knew fine rightly what Pallisers was getting at without getting bogged down in the semantics of the difference between GB and the U.K. on an Internet forum.

I actually think NI should go for independence. Can’t see it ever happening in my lifetime though.
Don’t know many in ROI who’d be in favour of a united Ireland.

I'm from NI although I escaped a long time ago. My family still lives there and they want things to stay as they are, and I respect their opinion. GB would have a bloody cheek to cast them aside now they are causing them inconvenience.

I don't really get your point, that everything that happened 100 years ago is just as valid now?

Of course it's relevant.

Partition and British involvement in NI, how they reacted to the civil rights movement and dealt with republican revolution has had a lasting affect on this country.

It's impacted everything - from lack of investment in infrastructure leading to areas of low employment and high deprivation West of the Bann, to provision of 3rd level education etc etc etc.

NI is decades behind other parts of the U.K. because of this. Even as someone who leans unionist, I am furious that UK politicians could in good conscience make us RoI's responsibility without sorting the problems they caused in the 1960s and 1970s.

Hmm yes NI is in the uk not GB
Kinda sums it up for me.

I've been explaining the NI/ROI/GB situation to my Irish dc. Youngest is 7 and he seems to understand it better than Teresa May!

@PennyMordauntsLadyBrain; it is relevant but in terms of the previous posters comments it is not. That poster was basically saying suck it up, that Is what was signed up for 100 years ago, possibly under duress. I recently visited N.Ireland, the motorways are decrepit. There is a lack of investment. It's quite obvious.It is a ghetto zone and yet it is the only thing that is stopping any deal that Teresa May could have made with any autonomy. Hence the question still stands, why is a backstop so undesirable?

I'm from Ni. I think the question of unity is very valid, I think it will eventually happen and I think with their stance on brexit, the DUP have brought it closer to reality than ever, probably sped it up by 15 years.

If you are from here also and don't believe this, wake up. I'm the sort of person who would have liked the idea of a UI, but not the practicality. Not worth it. Until the morning of the brexit vote. I'd vote for it in the morning. And there are THOUSANDS of people just like me.

The general population shift towards nationalism is a big contributor too. It speaks volumes for the DUPs mandate of "British before everything, including common sense" that they are still in complete denial. The pp who said if they want to be treated the same as the rest of Britain then we need gay marriage and abortion was absolutely right frankly. Why do they get to pick and choose what parts they accept?? Why are they ignoring the fact that the backstop is economically better for NI? It also baffles me how their representatives get away with stuff that would cause a representative from any other party to have to stand down from.

The other things brexit has taught us, as if we didn't already know, is that England and Wales have zero interest in us, know nothing about us, consider us all paddies anyway and would happily cut us free in the morning. But then, the DUP are more British than the english.

A good dispassionate economist, perhaps? Surely there is someone on here to explain the money?

@ NeverTalksToStrangers; well you have kind have said my point in a verbose way, but much appreciated. I have yet to hear from anyone why not putting a border in the Irish Sea is not a good thing.

Hence the question still stands, why is a backstop so undesirable?

Because the DUP thinks it will undermine the union.

That's it. Anyone with a bit of sense was rubbing their hands in glee when the backstop was proposed- farmers and business owners thought they'd been given a reprieve from a No Deal and the effect it would have here.

But the DUP are worried that any deviation in EU status from the Rest of the U.K will put the union at risk. No other reason.

They're traitors.

NI can't afford to survive independently. Fact.

We cost the UK money. We are a financial drain as it stands. I believe that when it happens, there will be financial incentives and economic projects put in place by the uk government to encourage ROI to accept us and to make a UI viable and to encourage growth. We already cost them money. This would be like a dowry. A timebound changeover assistance.

They're traitors

This. Especially to their grassroot farmer supporters. And their voters don't have the sense to see it apparently.

No one disputes the fact (or I have never even heard plans for it~) that ~NI would be independent. You can under-read what has been promised. The Irish and the UK could work out a trade deal, but the Irish are under EU governance and the Brits if they go for a no deal Brexit are loosely under WTO rules. The 2 don't sync and if you want to go under WTO rules, then you are wide open again on immigration control, even worse than under EU.

Pallisers, at no stage in history as NI been part of GB. It was part of the UK of GB and I which became the UK of GB and NI after partition. The and is very important here. GB is, for all intents and purposes, the mainland.

Talk about disengenuous. Does this kind of parsing really help in a discussion of what will happen to the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland - otherwise known as your country?

'pallisers' I don't really get your point, that everything that happened 100 years ago is just as valid now? No-one is forcing anyone into anything, no matter how passionate some people are and how non-bothered others are. I suppose I just asked to see how many are non-bothered. Obviously I have a view.

Do they not teach history in the UK anymore? Ireland was a vassal of England for 800 years. The 26 counties finally became the new nation of the Republic of Ireland (yes I know that took a few years) after hundreds of years of rebellion, revolutions, misery and the British Government (the MAINLAND - for anyone who doesn't get it) being absolutely adament that the 6 counties (plus the ports) had to remain. But now it is like "oh no, it doesn't suit us now - you take it."

How are people so uninformed about their own history. God I am bored at having to explain this.

I recently visited N.Ireland, the motorways are decrepit. There is a lack of investment.

Oh please, what kind of ignorant views are these. NI has the same kind of potholes and lack of investment that most of the UK has. Someone is just trying to cause mischief.

@NeverTalksToStrangers; NI can't survive independently, but they will have an open market to 26 other nations under a backstop deal. Always protected. `I can't quite understand how that is not a winning situation for NI; except for the DUP propaganda.