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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

A United Ireland

580 replies

poppiesallykatie · 13/12/2018 00:13

Not a goady thread or to stir, but how many are against it or for it? Obviously many in NI want to part of the Republic, many in NI want to part of Great Britain, how do the British people feel about it?

OP posts:
EmeraldShamrock · 13/12/2018 09:34

Monky1234 Get a grip. How rude and untrue, trying to shut voices down with your snobbery. Many many rich educated Irish people have family who have been affected by the trouble and can see a future of growth from reuniting.
Ireland could easily expand and become better.
I guess that is one thing people from NI will hate about the Republic, the sense of entitlement, class division in the mind of the affluent to class. Oooohh I am middle class, really well I am upper middle. You all wipe your are the same way, who d fuck cares.
Yes I an working class but from a working family Grin

Heyjudas · 13/12/2018 09:35

and yes, reading back up, culturally Northern Ireland and Ireland are polls apart.

theymademejoin · 13/12/2018 09:35

@Monkey1234 - Anyone who says they do, have idealistic views of days well past and would have grown up in a very working or (non working to be more exact) class - reject any type of authority type environment.

That's very insulting. I'm as middle class as you get. I, and all my family, have always worked. My parents and their siblings are all qualified at 3rd level and, before retirement, held professional jobs, as do I and all my siblings and cousins. We are all very law abiding. Yet we mostly support a united Ireland.

PoshPenny · 13/12/2018 09:37

I think that the UK should leave with No Deal because of the NI issue. I can't understand anyone who thinks it's OK to sell them down the river like this. If it was Scotland or Wales it wouldn't have been allowed to get this far.

I know I'm in a minority here anyway and expect to be flamed.

LadyGregorysToothbrush · 13/12/2018 09:39

No Deal is catastrophic for NI, PoshPenny. Polls show that the people of NI largely support the backstop arrangement by a 2/3 majority. They also would support staying in the customs union and single market but that doesn’t appear to be on offer yet. THe DUP don’t speak for the majority in NI.

derxa · 13/12/2018 09:39

the only difference the IRA brought the fighting to the mainland as they were sick of it only being irish people suffering Shock

dippledorus · 13/12/2018 09:44

So the IRA didn’t kill anyone in Northern Ireland?

Come on. There were murdering bastards on both sides. That’s why almost 4000 people died during the Troubles.

PineapplePower · 13/12/2018 09:46

would have grown up in a very working or (non working to be more exact) class

Wow that’s news to my family who are professionals from one of the poshest parts of Dublin and are definitely for reunification if it ever came to a vote!

Twinningsloverbutnotanymore · 13/12/2018 09:46

NI girl here too - I have grown up in a Unionist part of NI and I would have voted likewise. But since all this Brexit stuff has started I really saw how mainland UK felt about NI. Some didn't even know we were part of the UK. Personally, I always saw the UK as the better option, healthcare system etc, but since this, I have thought more about being a united Ireland. Ireland doesn't really want us and the mainland UK don't want us so it's been hard to see but they have to keep the Good Friday agreement in place. No hard boarders!! Noone wants to go back to that.

ErrolTheDragon · 13/12/2018 09:47

I think that the UK should leave with No Deal because of the NI issue. I can't understand anyone who thinks it's OK to sell them down the river like this.

The other obvious solution being to stop brexit now we've all had a chance to realise that most people were badly under-informed (or misinformed) at the time of the referendum and simply hadn't thought about this (and many other) issues.

Since the OP asked, you bold sections by placing between a pair of asterisks. There are instructions on markup, emoticons and links at the bottom of the talk page in the browser version, under the Post Message button. The app also has icons for emoticons and text styles.

bellinisurge · 13/12/2018 09:50

The complex issues raised in this thread should show anyone that fucking with the GFA is stupid and dangerous. As utterly imperfect as it is, Brexit needs a backstop to keep a lid on things. If, during the transition period brought through TM's Withdrawal agreement, we find a way to work a border without messing up GFA, then we won't need the backstop. If we can't find it in tbe transition period, the backstop is there.
Or we could cancel Brexit

Eenymeeny123 · 13/12/2018 09:52

I'm from the ROI and to be honest the talks of a United Ireland bugs the crap out of me. Very few in the North, Catholic or Protestant wanted a United Ireland until Brexit, they were happy with the status quo. They were also happy with the benefits that they received that are not available in the republic. Now a United Ireland seems to be on the cards just to deal with Brexit!! No, we are not a get out of jail free card. I have been on many Facebook pages based in the North and I can tell you the hatred and contempt that is felt for the Irish government and its people is appalling. So many are happy to see Ireland suffer over Brexit. Yes they may be the minority but they are still there. There is no way in hell that we should have to deal with this crap just because it's an easy solution for England. I'm sorry for all those people from northern Ireland who feel upset that those in the rest of Ireland are not welcoming them with open arms but but honestly as a country we can't afford ye and how do we deal with those who hate us. There is no way I want to go back to the violence of the past. Also for those who scoff at the money factor, I was charged a hundred euro for acne solution for a month's supply. Would people in Northern Ireland be happy to pay for stuff they never had to pay for before? If a United Ireland becomes a serious option then it can only happen if it's not at the detriment of the rest of Iteland. I'm sorry if that sounds heartless but Ireland had a serious recession that left many people on their knees and is still affecting so many now.

ErrolTheDragon · 13/12/2018 09:55

So the IRA didn’t kill anyone in Northern Ireland?

That's nothing like what that poster said.Hmm point is, I think, that some (ignorant) British people only think about republican terrorism because that was what affected the British mainland.

worridmum · 13/12/2018 10:00

That is not what i said the IRA did murder people in NI but as a group were the only ones to bring the troubles to mainland UK.

I was attempting to say the IRA were the only ones to bring the murdering to England.

Avegemitesandwich · 13/12/2018 10:04

Yes, I would say there are a lot of British people who totally believe that the violence during The Troubles was exclusively from the Republicans.

FishesaPlenty · 13/12/2018 10:05

Under the terms of the GFA the only people that have a vote on whether NI remains part of the UK or unite with the rest of Ireland are the people of NI. ROI citizens don't get to vote on this.

You're wrong @Dulra. The people of NI can vote to leave the UK and become part of a united Ireland but it requires a majority in the ROI to also agree to it for it to happen.

The Irish Constitution (amended to take account of the GFA) reads: "a united Ireland shall be brought about only by peaceful means with the consent of a majority of the people, democratically expressed, in both jurisdictions in the island".

worridmum · 13/12/2018 10:05

Errolthedragon got the meaning of my post that most of the UK only know about IRA crimes because they bought the troubles to them because the rest of the UK seemingly cared little for what was going on until it was actively brought to them.

(I am NOT condoning it just trying to inform people)

dippledorus · 13/12/2018 10:10

cain.ulst.ac.uk/ Conflict Archive on the INternet - part of INCORE at Ulster University

See also Accounts of the Conflict accounts.ulster.ac.uk/repo24/index.php

For anyone who would like to read more about the Troubles.

MQv2 · 13/12/2018 10:19

As an Irish person I'm genuinely worried that we're going to sleep walk in to a United Ireland by default.

If it were done by referendum I might be able to stomach that at least it was a stops choice by the majority of the population.
If it were foisted on us then I think it might genuinely make me move.

theymademejoin · 13/12/2018 10:20

@Heyjudas - Sinn Fein are the only party who want a United Ireland. No other party does. Sinn Fein doesn't hold anything like a majority in Ireland.

I have never, and will never, vote for Sinn Féin. That is because of their economic policies, which would, in my opinion, destroy the country. I still support a united Ireland. There are many more like me.

Melliejellie · 13/12/2018 10:24

A ghetto zone? Bit goady OP. Did you tell the people you met in NI that?

Sakura7 · 13/12/2018 10:25

As an Irish person, I really don't think it's true that ROI wouldn't want unification. It's not a main priority and there would of course be economic concerns, but I think in a situation where NI votes for it, and a realistic plan is put to the people for how to manage it (unlike Brexit), the Irish people will support unification. It's one of those head v heart questions, and it could be a once in a lifetime chance. There would undoubtedly be a transition period where the UK gradually pulls away, and I'm certain we'd have significant support from the EU to make it work. I'd be amazed if a united Ireland were to get less than 60% in a referendum in ROI.

MondayTuesdayWednesday · 13/12/2018 10:34

A united Ireland is really not a realistic solution or likely to happen. All this talk of it like it is viable solution is just silly.

Besides the economic costs, which would be huge for the Republic, the standard of living in Northern Ireland is much lower than the republic and would end up being much lower when they don't have the NHS or have to pay for more educational things. In ROI, most people unless they are on very low incomes, have to pay for books, copies, pens, pencils, art, photocopying etc which can amount to hundreds at the start of each year. There are no school dinners and if you can't afford to pay for something in school like a trip for example, you just don't go.

Besides the economic costs, Northern Ireland is so culturally different to Ireland that it would cause huge issues.

The majority of people in the Republic do not want a united Ireland. People in the UK speak as if all that NI has to do is decide to unite and it will happen. That is not the case. The people of Ireland will also be given a vote and it won't be in favour.

EmeraldShamrock · 13/12/2018 11:09

The people of Ireland will also be given a vote and it won't be in favour.
You might be surprised. No one believed the UK would vote to really leave the EU, hey ho it is happening.

Auntiepatricia · 13/12/2018 11:11

Also the people in NI (ie. me and my family) will get a big shock when we discover what we have to pay in tax and charges and health insurance with no NHS. And the cost of groceries is almost double. And housing is triple. I’m from ROI but I’m hiding up here in the North hoping everyone doesn’t find out how little everything here costs. If I wanted to be fleeced of our money I would have lived down South with the rest of my family (who are being fleeced).