To think military families should be offered extra funded childcare provisions?

[PFB1]

I am a military wife and although being a soldier is a choice and in my opinion, you're not automatically owed anything for making that choice, I really feel as though child care is such an issue for military spouses.

The problem is, we move frequently, which makes it harder for spouses to have a successful career. We often live hundreds of miles from family so we have no offers of free childcare there, the communities we live in are so transient. Our friends move away, new people arrive. When a friendship reaches the point where you might be comfortable asking for help with childcare, it's likely one of you will end up being posted miles away.

On top of these issues, your spouse can be sent away at a moments notice for anything up to 9 months.

I think so many military spouses underachieve from a career point of view because it feels like there are just so many hurdles in your way. I think extra funded childcare for military families would be a wonderful idea to give spouses more opportunities to succeed.

I appreciate childcare is a touchy subject and difficult for many families to afford/juggle. I just think it would be a huge help to service families to have some additional support in that area.

I'd love to try to contact relevant organisations to discuss whether this is something we could propose but I firstly wanted to get an idea of if the general public would be unhappy about this.

Let's say I'm in that region - and I've often wondered the same. I reckon the fees the MOD pay keep this particular school afloat. And the families in question are sitting pretty and not moving anywhere!

Rufus - we had exactly the same insecurities (can't name the industry - too identifying!)

If the army think it is a good idea, they can prioritise it within their existing budgets. Everyone struggles managing 2 jobs when the kids are wee, I don't see why any one profession should be favoured over another, with the possible exception of medicine, where we really will have a skills shortage when we leave the EU.

The CEA (school fees) are currently
Education allowances per term from 01 August 2018:

CEA Board – Junior: £5,845
CEA Board – Senior: £7,407

The service person has to pay at least 10% of the costs, so if the fees are £10k per term, you take off the allowance, and the service person pays the rest, plus the incidentals.

Oh come on, I live in a town with lots of military families where both spouses are in the forces. They have kids, they manage. It sounds like you are in quite a luxury position to have one spouse at home for childcare/home duties. It’s personal choice. I also happen think lots of the military is a shocking waste of money as it is.

I think unless you are a military spouse you won’t really understand in order to comment.

To be fair to OP though I do think army families move more than Naval families. The ones round here have kids who have been to the same primary and secondary schools and return from uni holidays. And dads (mainly) have remained 'behind the wire'. I do sense army families are more disrupted

Asmuchuse and thereallife You both need to read the post earlier where it is explained in some detail how hard it is to get your CEA claim signed off. What people boast about, and the reality can be very different when you know enough to start asking the right questions.

If the families in question are RN, and living in MQs, and the service person is sea going, then yes, they may still be eligible for CEA. It is difficult to relocate from Portsmouth to Portsmouth if someone has moved from a job at Fleet HQ to an appointment on Big Lizzie for example, especially given the dearth of MQs there. Also, if they are appointed to a job at MOD, it is cheaper for the MOD to not find housing for the family and move them, but to pay Lodging Allowance and for the service person to serve married unaccompanied. CEA can still be payable then.

You might to look at this thread www.mumsnet.com/Talk/education/914655-Abuse-of-CEA-Forces-families?pg=4 to see that CEA tightening has been ongoing for some little while.

Vehivle thanks for clarifying that. As my Dad was paying rent on Married Quarters back in the 60s when I was born, I was a bit shocked that one could get it free!!!

Nope. You have made a choice. We made a choice and we were serial expats for many years, living all over the world. You've got to take the crunchy with the smooth.

DH is in the military. I wanted a career and stability for my DC so we bought - 180 miles away from nearest family so no support there (but our choice to buy here)

He has had postings nearby so could commute daily but last two postings he has only been home at the weekends.

The last MQ we lived in was a huge 4 bed detached. We paid less than £300 for rent and CILOT! So loads extra to pay for childcare.

Depends on what trade, what rank and where you live regarding the wages.
There are many forces families really struggling. The rent is going up to become in line with the civvi rents around them. The houses are poorly maintained so often incur extra costs.
The pay doesn't go up the closer you move to London but the cost of living does. Bonus? What bloody bonus?! My dh has not had a pay rise in years in fact the last pay rise meant we were worse off! It's pretty shit to be honest and the fact the house we live in has asbestos is the icing on a very sad cake.
But! It's steady work and he's got a chance to join a civvi company when he finishes that will be double the pay which because he's taken lots of courses and earned a degree whilst being in the forces he wouldn't have had otherwise.

Yab a bit u. But I understand where you are coming from.

The reality is some of us require a job where, due to the partner/spouses working pattern, they would only work 9:30-2:30 term time only. Those jobs are like rocking horse poo.

I have one child diagnosed Sen and another going through the diagnostic process so add into that many, many appointments where I would need time off (dh does his fair share too).

I am not an attractive prospect to an employer. So we suck it up and make changes elsewhere.

If the provision of childcare is that poor, have you and other spouses thought about getting together and organising your own base nursery?

Rufus - we had exactly the same insecurities (can't name the industry - too identifying!)

Oh absolutely

As i said the same issues do exist on civvie street.

To be fair to OP though I do think army families move more than Naval families

I agree, i think navy can depend on your job but RAF people ive known get moved on after two years

A lot of the navy people have been here for donkeys years

Here in Canada, you can get help with child care on the bases, at the Military Family Resource Centres, as well as a provision for emergency child care in your home if something happens to you while your spouse is on deployment.
They also have contact lists of child care providers, usually other spouses, that cN help out too
I think I like this method, as you still pay, but there isn't the same challenge of finding a childcare provider

I don't think it's a simple as saying this is just a problem for military families.

As others have mentioned, some of the most important jobs in our society, the ones we rely on - doctors, nurses, paramedics, police officers, firefighters - are all expected to do horrible shift work, often with overtime and unreliable finishing hours.

For example, DP works the truly shocking current police pattern: two 6am-2pm days, two 2pm-11pm days, two 10pm-6am night shifts, four days off. A ten day rota that means I can never say "yes, I can do that on a Tuesday". It's a bloody nightmare for normal childcare, not least for planning what we do if something kicks off and he can't actually leave work and collect the children when it is his turn.

What we need as a society is a greater understanding that a huge number of parents don't work 9-5 with a fifteen minute commute, and to look at what possible provision can support the necessary working hours of essential workers.

Sorry but I don’t think shift work is really comparable, not a narrative on which is the most important as obviously there are plenty of jobs which are vital to the country. But, these don’t tend to involve one of the family unit being deployed for 6 months plus and the expectation to either move around every few years or remain in one place and just see them weekends when they aren’t on duty or exercise etc. I agree with those that say you don’t know exactly what you are getting into until you are living it. Still I think unless childcare is made more affordable for everyone then it’s not really fair.

As others have mentioned, some of the most important jobs in our society, the ones we rely on

We rely heavily on the armed forces. They step in when other services go on strike, they're there at the last minute when the Govt fucks up with contracts and cuts and they step in to help, and sleep on floors when the country gets flooded. Round here last year, when the Beast from the East hit, it was the armed forces taking nurses to work and on their rounds in the community.

Okay... obviously my idea is very unpopular with the majority.

For those of you discussing frequency of moves, DH and I have been married for 7 years and are in our 5th house. The shortest time we have spent in one place was 9 months. We are currently based 450 miles from where our family live.

Those of you suggesting to buy our own place and for me to not be a "trailing spouse", let me give you the reasons why that's tricky. There are not any job opportunities for DH near where we are originally from with quite a big percentage of the jobs available being in the garrison we are in just now. We DO NOT want to/can't buy here because of house prices & the fact we are so far from family. If we buy where we grew up, our children will very rarely see their dad. Just the other night my 5 year old woke up inconsolable in the middle of the night because she "misses daddy so much" as she hasn't seen him in 4 months. I couldn't consider moving 450 miles away so they would see him every other weekend when he's home rather than 7 days a week. I think that would be very damaging to our kids. We do have the option to send our children off to boarding school but that's not something we would like to consider either.

The rate of divorce in the army is huge. Families struggle to cope with the demands of military life. My husband's working hours can not be compared to shift work. In our first year of marriage, we spent less than 3 months together. That's been similar this year. He's deployed 5 times in our marriage and that doesn't include training exercises which result in a lot of time away. Imagine how little time we would have spent together, as a family, if I didn't move with him? Maybe only 4 days a month together for the months he's in the UK? That's hopeless!

I think it would be amazing to see more being offered to support spouses. It's absolute drivel to say that I knew what I was getting into. When you start a new job, move to a new country or start a new career, it's impossible to know what it's actually going to be like until you do it. I was 22 when I got married. I had never been on an army base, I had never been to Germany, I had never met an army wife. I married DH and moved to Germany, left my good career behind and 3 days later DH went on a 2 month course in the UK so I was alone in a foreign country. I had to take a leap of faith. I had no idea what it was going to be like.

I think giving spouses support in having some stability in their career would be a fantastic step forward and would allow many more people to work and potentially earn more money and in turn, paying more tax.

I appreciate many don't think this is a priority but military life can be extremely hard for the spouses who are left behind so very often, to hold the family together.

I have made a handful of amazing friends but, guess what? None of them live near me anymore. It's the nature of the beast.

I'm not hard done by or entitled. I just think the army could allocate their budget in other ways in order to offer more support with childcare to the spouses who are so often left alone.

YY Puggles. I have great sympathy for all shift workers, but it's a whole different kettle of fish dealing with a partner with shit/unreliable hours when you're in a new place potentially hundreds of miles away from friends and family. Repeat that every three years, factoring in settling kids into new schools, sorting out admin and practicalities of a move to yet another crap army house (if you're lucky), all whilst thinking about your lack of pension/NI contributions and dealing with your DH being away for six months at a time.

My DH has done ok and is on 33k year (including uplifts), so the idea that an army wage makes up for all that and is enough to raise a family comfortably whilst preparing for post-service life is laughable.

. I just think the army could allocate their budget in other ways in order to offer more support with childcare to the spouses who are so often left alone.

Whilst this is a nice idea it is incredibly naive. The defence budget is stretched to breaking point as it is there is no flex to allow for luxuries like this. You have subsidised housing, travel and relocation expenses allowances. If you think its tough now wait until you hit civvie street You have choices but they don't suit your plans. Unfortunately you can't change the system for this reason. Not criticising you on that btw just its not realistic.

My DH and I did over 4 decades services between us so do know the life. I'd be questioning why your husband is moving so much, that doesnt sound right tbh.

I work in car sales and finish at 7pm most nights, work every Saturday and opposite Sundays. Should I get better childcare options? After all, I'm an adult who decided to make this my career.

No - as said by a naval wife! I have two children and a well paid career. I choose not to follow my husband when he moves base. I'm not in the navy, I've got my own life, so I've stayed put and husband is sometimes a weekend dad. You make yours choices, no one else should have to pay for them.

And how do they work out this spending of the defence budget on childcare? Is it based on rank? How many hours is it for? Do I get it because DH is married unaccompanied? Do you get more/less depending if DH/DW is deployed? It just wouldn’t work.

There are solutions. My DC don’t see their dad during the week but it’s small price to pay that they have stability and that I can carry on my career.