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To be shocked that Mn has been branded a “hotbed of transphobia”

999 replies

Badmoonsarising · 07/12/2018 14:20

BY Vice msgazine no less!

broadly.vice.com/amp/en_us/article/a3mn9k/mumsnet-uk-mom-forum-terf-transphobia-feminism

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
Earlywalker · 08/12/2018 19:27

I have two thoughts on the subject that I would ‘fight for’ :

1- Against self ID.
2- Against transphobia

I’ve signed the consultation against self ID and continue to say that I do not support it when asked.

I comment on the transphobia as and when I see it as I was raised to believe that when you sit back and allow something to happen, it’s as bad as doing it yourself.

Believing in biological sex, not wanting to suck a lady dick, being a lesbian etc is not transphobic. But some things and people on FWR are transphobic and some say transphobic things and it pisses me off that you are all so intent on minimising some of the awful things that are said to ensure you’re always the ‘victim’.

Hyppolyta · 08/12/2018 19:29

I actually agree with you EarlyWalker but do you not realise that we have all said the same and been called terf thousands of times for it?

VerbeenaBeeks · 08/12/2018 19:30

You ok hun?

Fine thanks babe

VerbeenaBeeks · 08/12/2018 19:31

We have said they, as males, should not be allowed our female spaces.

Whoomph, there it is.

starcrossedseahorse · 08/12/2018 19:31

Early how can you say that you are against transphobia and then say a lot of very transphobic things?

You are anti self ID - transphobic.
You believe in biology - transphobic.
You do not believe in the female penis - transphobic.
You believe in same sex attraction - transphobic.

You are a massive transphobe I am afraid.

Calvinsmam · 08/12/2018 19:32

But we all report the transphobia when we see it. How do you think it’s deleted???

starcrossedseahorse · 08/12/2018 19:32

Verbeena you are happy with men being in private spaces with little children and women?
Why is that?

TeenTimesTwo · 08/12/2018 19:36

Of course people sometimes write stuff on here which are deemed transphobic by some people. MN is open to thousands of users.

But the moderators have rules on what they consider (and don't consider) transphobic, and they are quick to deleted transphobic posts when drawn to their attention.

EmpressAdultHumanFemale · 08/12/2018 19:37

Verbeena, I know you think we should just be allowing in proper transsexuals with genuine dysphoria. And that used to work in the old days. But where do you think we could even start policing it now?

Hyppolyta · 08/12/2018 19:37

Verbeena it isnt transphobic to not want males in female spaces.

It has nothing to do with whether they are trans and everything to do with their sex.

R0wantrees · 08/12/2018 19:38

Fairplay for Women, 'Rosa Freedman, lawyer and academic from the University of Reading, and Susan Smith, spokeswoman for Forwomen.scot addressed the Committee for Culture in the Scottish Parliament on Thursday. The discussion is ostensibly about the census, it's wide ranging and fascinating, covering the importance of clear definitions, intersex, a third option, and the implication of sex self ID for women and girls. If you have an hour to spare, it's well worth a watch.'

Important to be aware of the abuse, intimidation and accusations of 'transphobia' Prof Rosa Freedman has faced from some TRAs in recent weeks.
This escalated in the last week as reported by BBC:

A professor has said she faced online abuse and found her office door "covered in urine" after debating proposed gender law changes.

Prof Rosa Freedman said she feared for her safety after the reaction to her discussing a government consultation on how people can change their gender.

The human rights lawyer had raised concerns on how the changes might affect women's rights .

The University of Reading said staff and student safety was a top priority.

Prof Freedman, who has said she is against self-identification, attended debates on the plans to change the Gender Recognition Act.

She told the BBC that afterwards she found her door had been covered in urine.

Prof Freedman also said she was called a "Nazi" who "should be raped" and added it was a "tipping point" for her to "push back" against the abusers when she received anonymous phone calls.

Prof Freedman added: "I'm pretty public and open about the fact that I'm Jewish.

"I'm pretty public and open about the fact I've survived sexual violence - I have been throughout these debates.

"So obviously being told I'm a Nazi and being told I'm transphobic when I'm not transphobic and nothing I've said or done is transphobic...having been told I should get raped. None of them are particularly pleasant." (continues)

www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-england-berkshire-46454454?SThisFB=&__twitter_impression=true

& James Kirkup in The Spectator:
'Women are abused in the name of ‘trans rights’. But do MPs care?'
concludes:
"Rosa Freedman is a legal academic. Her job is to analyse and study the law and debate the law. For doing so in the context of transgender rights, she says she has been abused, followed and scared. She says she has had urine sprayed on her door and into her office. She says she has been threatened with rape and murder.

This is not shocking. This is not surprising. To people familiar with this area, this is pretty much par for the course. And that is shocking, or should be.

How did this come about? How did the abuse and intimidation of women for simply talking about the law come to seem almost routine and mundane? That’s a question that should be asked more, and answered by anyone who mouths those words about respectful debate and a conversation free from abuse. That includes the people who run universities, who should ask academics who preach that “trans women are women” whether they are encouraging students to take an intolerant approach to women who happen to have differing views.

And most of all, it should be addressed by any politician who says they believe in free speech and civilised politics free from fear and abuse. If those words really mean anything, Rosa Freedman’s case will outrage and appal MPs of all parties, who will want to debate its implications – and demand action to prevent such things ever recurring – at their earliest opportunity.

After all, MPs and ministers have – quite rightly – taken time and trouble to debate and address the wholly unacceptable abuse and discrimination that transgender people sadly face all too often. In that, they were doing their jobs, representing the interests of people who need someone to speak for them.

Will that happen in the case of Rosa Freedman? Will MPs do their job and ensure that she can do hers without urine on her door and calls in the night telling her she should be raped and killed? Don’t bet on it. After all, she’s only a woman, and who cares about them? Who speaks for them?"

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/12/women-are-abused-in-the-name-of-trans-rights-but-do-mps-care/

Datun · 08/12/2018 19:39

The 'hotbed of transphobia' isn't the one or two comments that get deleted. It's no to self id, recognising biology and women refusing to comply to men's (and some women's) demands that their boundaries are not theirs to determine.

sackrifice · 08/12/2018 19:40

We have said they, as males, should not be allowed our female spaces.

Whoomph, there it is.

Do you think men can become women somehow? If so can you explain how this happens please. Thanks.

Datun · 08/12/2018 19:44

Prof Freedman also said she was called a "Nazi" who "should be raped" and added it was a "tipping point" for her to "push back" against the abusers when she received anonymous phone calls.

A professor has said she faced online abuse and found her office door "covered in urine" after debating proposed gender law changes.

That's a law professor discussing the law.

Transgender ideology is a man's sexual rights movement.

If anyone of you women who think we are transphobic said what you say on here, on Twitter, you would be subject to the same treatment.

starcrossedseahorse · 08/12/2018 19:46

Datun is so on the money here.

VerbeenaBeeks · 08/12/2018 19:49

Datun is so on the money here

To coin a datun phrase - lolz. Datun being the one that has nooo issue patronising or talking over anyone who disagrees.

starcrossedseahorse · 08/12/2018 19:51

Verbeena can you please answer my question?

VerbeenaBeeks · 08/12/2018 19:51

You are anti self ID - transphobic

To the extremist end. Can you really not see that?
No bother. You probably can't.
Neither extremist end good.

starcrossedseahorse · 08/12/2018 19:53

I don't understand your post. Do you mean that a person who is anti self id is the extremist or that calling them transphobic for that belief is extremist?

Hyppolyta · 08/12/2018 19:54

Verbeena you just answered a post talking about Professor Freedman being stalked, abused,sent death threats and having her office pissed on with lolz

So quick to accuse others of abuse, yet finding actually abuse funny.

RedToothBrush · 08/12/2018 19:55

Being blunt and to the point isn't talking over someone. It's being blunt and to the point. And because it gets to the heart of the matter the only response people have if they don't like the blunt point made is to resort to ad hominem attacks rather than rebut the point via a genuine argument.

And again that's what vice doesn't seem to like. Women being blunt and to the point. And they resort to calling women nasty for doing so.

Some of us know how the internet works.

Earlywalker · 08/12/2018 19:57

Being transgender isn’t exclusive with Male to female, there’s a lot of female to male transgender people too. This is not just men vs woman.

datun I’ve seen you say that being transgender is a fetish. And as you’ve just said it’s a men’s sexual rights movement, I’m assuming you still hold these views. Do you think that for some people, who’ve been through hell feeling ‘trapped in the wrong body’ your comments might feel incredibly insensitive and transphobic?

VerbeenaBeeks · 08/12/2018 19:58

Verbeena you just answered a post talking about Professor Freedman being stalked, abused,sent death threats and having her office pissed on with lolzSo quick to accuse others of abuse, yet finding actually abuse funny.

Take from it what you like. If you look outside of your viewpoint you'd see I didn't mean it like that at all.
Abuse isn't funny.

Hyppolyta · 08/12/2018 20:00

You are right. It isnt funny.

So why the hell should we have to share spaces with the males doing this who think it is?

VerbeenaBeeks · 08/12/2018 20:00

datun I’ve seen you say that being transgender is a fetish

THIS with a million bells on. This is why I lolzed (their words against others saying anything different to themselves)
The datun is on the money bit. Not anything else.

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