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AIBU?

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Original poster

Assistant Head told class their behavior resulted in supply teacher being fired

217 replies

Rockingaround · 04/12/2018 23:10

Ok - the class had a supply last Wednesday . Whilst there, a few pupils (grade 4) wrecked the craft area ... made slime, cut up ping pong balls, wasted resources and stole craft items.
Today the Assistant Head comes to speak to the class about their behavior. She says how unacceptable their behavior is. How in future if they see any pupils behaving inappropriately they must tell a teacher. A little boy in the class says “but the teacher let us do it”, she replies “yes but he wasn’t a real teacher and he has been fired because of your behavior.
My little girl comes home crying saying what if the teacher has kids, what if he can’t afford to live, it’s just before Christmas etc. she also said “it just as much my fault as I should’ve told another teacher what they were doing”.... so I call the school, speak to the assistant head who talks about how appallling the children have behaved for 5 minuets; when there’s a pause I say “it’s not their behavior I’m concerned with, did you actually say that their actions caused the guy to get fired?” ... “well I told them he wasn’t coming back”. I said “my little girl told me that you said he was fired because of their behavior”. She said “well yes, because children need to understand there’s consequences to their actions”. I said “well that’s just not acceptable, they’re too little to have that responsibility, plus the supply teachers confidentiality - it’s just not fair, I’m coming into school in the morning to speak to the Head”

AM I GOING INSANE!!! Am I being unreasonable, this is not okay right????

OP posts:
Original poster
Rockingaround · 05/12/2018 00:52

They’re 8 and 9 who made some slime and cut up some of the craft corner.

OP posts:
LRDtheFeministDragon · 05/12/2018 00:54

Well, I don't have an 8 or 9 year old, but it doesn't seem awful enough to justify this. And I certainly don't think it makes it ok to blame the whole class!

Original poster
Rockingaround · 05/12/2018 00:55

I’m not diminishing their behavior but the response to the kids and lack of support to the supply teacher just seems absolutely unreasonable to me. Like, I was utterly gobsmacked that a senior manager behaves in this way. The kids behavior is kind of a secondary point, the behavior of the AHT is the focus of my disdain

OP posts:
Hubbleisback · 05/12/2018 01:01

The lack of respect and support shown to the supply teacher, all children being blamed for the bad behaviour rather than the culprits. But also show some compassion for the Assistant Head who misjudged her comments this time, maybe as a result of being over stretched and unsupported herself. Education is on its knees and we have to cut the underfunded and overworked a bit of slack.

Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee · 05/12/2018 01:15

I think that’s a stupid thing to tell the kids. They will either think he is lying and think him an idiot or they will think it’s true and either be upset or amused.... I imagine the last thing it would do would be to encourage the naughty kids to behave.

OP, I think it was a really dumb and thoughtless thing of him to say but I think you are being OTT about it. I’d feel annoyed but I think you are overreacting to feel ‘very emotional’ about it. I also wouldn’t bother going in.

Also, I’m not sure why both you and your husband have to go in together. Surely this is too small an issue for that.

My kids are adults now and I can remember plenty of times when teachers have said and done really stupid things. (Luckily my kids had lots of great teachers too. )

Penguinsetpandas · 05/12/2018 01:23

I wouldn't have an issue with kids being told that but would be concerned about behaviour.

Beeziekn33ze · 05/12/2018 01:31

AHT sounds awful, indiscreet and says any rubbish to pupils.

Milkycuppa - How long did it take for you to realise you couldn't control the 17 year olds? Seems as if it would have been better for everyone if you'd asked for support and, if the situation didn't improve, admitted defeat and gone elsewhere. Why would anyone carry on if it was that bad?

abacucat · 05/12/2018 01:37

I think kids do need to understand that there are consequences for behaviour. Yes it was the kids fault.

Hubbleisback · 05/12/2018 01:42

Seems as if it would have been better for everyone if you'd asked for support and, if the situation didn't improve, admitted defeat and gone elsewhere.

Beezie really do you think defeat is the right word to use here. I think it would be more appropriate to say she made an heroic attempt to educate badly behaved teenagers!!

SilverApples · 05/12/2018 02:06

As a supply teacher, I think the AHT has empowered a disruptive minority who will take on the challenge with enthusiasm to see how many more supply teachers they can get into trouble. I get to choose the schools I go into, and if one is vile, I just don’t return.

Reedskate · 05/12/2018 02:21

I agree with Bunnyup, whole class punishments are very unfair.

As pps have said, a supply teacher can't be fired. Explain to DD that they won't be returning to her school but they will get work elsewhere and part of being a supply teacher is that you find some schools work for you and others aren't such a good fit.

Imho it was wrong to tell the class the teacher was fired!

Flowerpot2005 · 05/12/2018 03:55

For me, I think you're right to be concerned but I dislike the way you're handling it too.

Your description of the conversation with the AHT makes it sound like you were rude & demanding 'I'm coming in to speak to the head teacher', 'did you really say...' You complain about the way AHT handled the situation but your behaviour is questionable too. It's fine to be upset & concerned but it doesn't give you the right to be quite so aggressive.

I hope you're able to be more constructive in your approach with with the HT.

OnlyJoking1 · 05/12/2018 04:14

It is giving a lot of power to the few unruly children, which may mean that they compete to get rid of any further supply teachers.

MozzieMagnet · 05/12/2018 04:49

Headteacher will have you pegged as one of those parents...
Expect to be humoured but little else.
The deputy was presumably trying to teach them about civil courage rather than being a bystander.
Sadly at 8 that's probably going to fall on deaf ears.
The little sods responsible will go on to treat supply like blood sport and the inept supply who allowed the situation to escalate will give all other supply a bad name.

MrDonut · 05/12/2018 05:58

It sounds to me that the AHT is furious about what happened in class that day and thinks it was utterly unacceptable. I don't think they should have said what they said, but I don't understand why you are so upset and emotional about this. If the supply teacher was struggling to control the class, they should have asked for help. The kids do need to understand that their actions that day had consequences. It sounds like they were utterly out of control.

Original poster
Rockingaround · 05/12/2018 06:31

Yes but should their consequence be that their behavior resulted in the teacher being “fired”?

OP posts:
ohreallyohreallyoh · 05/12/2018 06:32

As far as I know supply teachers are trained in the same way as other teachers

It should be the case. Increasingly it isn’t. Budgets etc.

The comment about ‘real’ teachers was unacceptable but sadly much of what supply teachers experience on a day to day basis. Undermined by our own profession says it all really.

Original poster
Rockingaround · 05/12/2018 06:33

I agree the teacher should have been given support and asked for support. Instead he was dismissed. The whole class were then made to feel like they had lost him his job. Do you not this this is disproportionate?

OP posts:
continuallychargingmyphone · 05/12/2018 06:36

I don’t see a problem with this, to be honest.

gamerwidow · 05/12/2018 06:39

It’s right that kids learn actions have consequences but the consequence should be detention or similar punishment with a chance to re-earn their privileges and make amends. They are only 8/9 and they shouldn’t be given a terrible consequence that can’t be undone no matter how contrite they are. It’s too much pressure and there will be children in the class who take this to heart.

CaptainsYuleLog · 05/12/2018 06:40

They were told the consequences of their actions. I struggle to find a problem with that.

gamerwidow · 05/12/2018 06:41

P.s. They’re too young for criminal responsibility because they can’t be expected to properly understand the consequences of their actions so why would anyone think they’re mentally able to cope with being responsible for losing someone’s job?

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 05/12/2018 06:42

If the whole class contributed to him losing his job, yes they should know about it.

How the hell else do they learn the consequences of their actions?

I think you’re wrong OP.

Babysgotyoureyes · 05/12/2018 06:46

It's really not your place to take on the case of the supply teacher. I'd let that one go if I were you, to be honest. I'm also pretty sure there are 2 sides to this story and while it may seem unfair to you that the entire class has been spoken to, the only adult in the room at the time is no longer there so can't give their version of events. I know from many years of teaching experience that kids love to see a supply teacher coming. They'll test the boundaries, that's for sure. With regards to the Head teacher's comments I don't believe there is anything wrong with making children accept responsibility and seeing that actions have consequences. From my experience, it won't have long lasting detrimental effects on them. In fact the majority of the class will be looking forward to moving onto the next supply teacher. Perhaps you could have a chat with your daughter and explain that although it may seem unfair and that the Head Teacher seems to be taking it out on the entire class, unfortunately that's how things are sometimes in highly pressurised school and even work environments, but you trust her and know that she cooperated and is respectful during all her classes. Sometimes we have to teach resilience to kids. It's not always a good idea to jump in to intervene.

chocatoo · 05/12/2018 06:47

I think you should be more concerned with the childrens’ behaviour.