Advice about in-laws and babysitting

[SilverBirchTree]

My in-laws love my one year old very much and he loves them. They are incredibly loving and fun with him.

However- As often as not a visit with them will involve MIL doing something I feel is a bit dangerous or unhygienic with my son. But I am a worrier by nature and it’s hard for me to judge whether my expectations are normal.

For example, in the last two weeks:

She wiped his face and hands with a soiled dish cloth she found in our sink. I’d used it to wipe up raw egg and kitchen spray earlier in the day. She didn’t seem to understand why I asked her to use his baby wipes instead.

On another occasion my son had a wooden xylophone stick in his mouth. She picked him up and play wrestled with him, rolling him around on the floor while was holding the stick in his month. She didn’t seem to understand why I interrupted and took the stick away.

My son has started thrashing around and standing up when his nappy is changed. We change him on a changing table with a seat belt style strap or on a soft mat on the floor so he doesn’t fall or smack his head. She tried to change him on our stone kitchen bench (high off the ground and right next to a ceramic vase, a wine bottle etc). My husband asked her not to.

This is just the last two weeks, but it’s been like this since he was born. I know none of these actions are outrageously negligent. I know lots of parents are more relaxed than I am. But I feel like I’ve spent the last year asking her to be more careful about safety, and she doesn’t take 90% of my concerns on board.

I’ve just returned to work and my mother has offered to watch him one day a week. We have hired a wonderfully qualified nanny for the other days. We did not ask my In laws to babysit purely because MIL and I don’t see eye to eye on safety issues.

It was launched world war three. For days now my in-laws have called DH crying and shouting. They’ve literally said that not being invited to babysit is the worst, most hurtful thing anyone has ever done to them. They say they don’t think they can forgive us and that we have fractured the family. We visited them to try and make peace but they continued to attack, shout, insult and cry. They were incredibly hostile towards me in front of my child. They obviously blame me for all of it although my husband and I are in agreement.

If you read this far thank you.

Basically AIBU about this safety stuff? Any advice for me about childcare in this situation? I hate conflict and I am just stunned by the extremity of their reaction and don’t know what to say or do. We are devastated by this rift, and just so overwhelmed.

What a ramble... sorry. Any advice would be amazing.

Grandparents are nice but such people really do need to be emotionally healthy people. Your H's parents are not emotionally healthy nor actually safe to be around.

It's also not just about them being "rewarded" by still seeing their GS.

If they're abusive to you to your face & will probably be bitching about you to your husband if you're not there-your son doesn't need to be witnessing that!

"But this? Really? It's just so stupid. I can't fathom this mindset, and so I suppose it's hard for me to see why this is can't be fixed".

These are the thoughts that people from emotionally healthy families of origin say. Its not for you to fathom their dysfunction or even worse sacrificing your own wellbeing and mental health to fail in saving people who do not want to be rescue and or save.

"PIL seem to lack the emotional tools to stay in a relationship with someone who disagrees with them. But I have those tools. I am capable of it. I want to try and help them get there too, but today it was just a series of brick walls".

And they will keep moving the goalposts so you will still get nowhere with them. They do not want you to help them and you are ill equipped to help them in any case. Such people require years of skilled therapy and they won't seek that either.

You cannot act as a rescuer or saviour in any relationship; its a lesson you may as well learn now. It is NOT your fault they are this disordered of thinking, you and your H did not make them this way. Address your own fear, obligation and guilt properly re his parents, your Dh certainly needs to do this as well.

Do not meet them next weekend, the two of you will simply be in for more of the same abusive treatment from them.

Would you have tolerated any of what they have done here from a friend, no you would not. I put it to you that his parents are really no different.

Your child. Your choice. There should be absolutely no assumption from your MIL that she'll be babysitting once you return to work. Like you say, these incidents aren't wildly negligent but really lacking in any common sense which is where I'd struggle.

OP whatever you do will never be good enough for these people

Op, you're taking on too much. This is your PILs choice...they have chosen not to respect your requests and have had an almighty tantrum when thwarted. You cannot assume full responsibility for the relative success or failure of something as complex as these family relationships. As I posted earlier, we've been there and my DC do have a good relationship with their grandparents. We didn't give in and we didn't beg forgiveness either. We just kept doing the broken record and they played ball in the end. I can't say it wasn't stressful and horrible, but you have to stay strong. In the end my DH saw his parents alone to listen again their endless grievances and complaints, and he responded "So fucking what?" He never swears and I think they were taken aback and looked at him with new eyes.

Bloody hell manipulation central!! They're serial manipulators and clearly over rubbish if your example is anything to go by

A child's safety cones above everything, including their hurt feelings and messages of cutting you off

E warned, on their eyes this is all on you - your DH now needs to find his back bone and tell them straight it's unacceptable and even if you weren't in the frame he would t allow their unsafe behaviours either

You'll be a scape goat I guarantee this - your family in law will get a very different story to the truth / get ahead of this!!

@flumpybear now the adrenaline is wearing off I am wondering how much of the hurt and emotion they had on display today was real vs. a performance meant to manipulate us.

I usually cry snowflake parent in these situations. However the dishcloth face wiping is disgusting and I consider it commen sense to remove a stick or any object from a small child’s mouth. Tbh The changing thing is OTT hes not gonna fall as you should be holding him at all times and not leaving him unattended even if he’s strapped on. When kids get to the wriggly age I just use a changing mat on the floor.

On another occasion my son had a wooden xylophone stick in his mouth. She picked him up and play wrestled with him, rolling him around on the floor while was holding the stick in his month. She didn’t seem to understand why I interrupted and took the stick away.

People are concentrating on the dirty cloth as if the OP was being unreasonable and seem to have missed this bit.

This could easily have turned out badly, who wrestles a baby when they have something in their mouth?

OP, your PILs are at best self centred bullies, and it isn't generational. I'm 50 and certainly wouldn't be doing stupid stuff like this. And neither would my mum when she was alive.

Also I’m a nanny and actually my job is similar I do 4 days and grandparents do the Friday. And I know that one set of grandparents are considered to be more capable then the other and that’s perfectly acceptable it’s your child and you must be comfortable when leaving them.

@JellyBears thanks. It's more that her pattern of behaviour shows a lack of common sense. I can't assume she will hold onto him during a nappy change. Also my son is used to flailing about on a soft surface, and could have really walloped his head on the stone counter.

@JellyBears yeah I think that's one of the reasons why I am so shocked at their nuclear response. I know lots of people who for whatever reason only have their kids babysat by some family members and not others. I think it's pretty common, but they are acting like we've invented this concept to wound them, and that they have a natural right to do it

I had a junior nanny removed because she had no common sense and put an old charge in danger so I think your completely in the right and if you ask your nanny I’m sure she’ll agree.

OP, you're trying too hard to fix something that is not your responsibility.
You can't make them change their thinking or actions.
What you can do is be clear about your boundaries and the consequences for violating those boundaries....and then leave it up to them to decide how they choose to behave.

I did not see this tantrum coming. I am feeling bullied and manipulated by it. It is in keeping with the way they've blown up other relationships with people who deviate from their world view in the past.......It's clear to me that they aren't capable of seeing their role in this. They aren't going to be sorry.....And now this, this toxic, irrational, punitive, cruel, dramatic reaction......I did not expect them to still be so enraged and to feel entitled to speak to me as they did. It was so truely irrational and extreme that I was stunned by it. I left my body, it felt so bizarre and unreal.....PIL seem to lack the emotional tools to stay in a relationship with someone who disagrees with them
Sounds to me like they're full blown narcissists.
If they are then it's no wonder you can't understand the severity of their reaction or why they behave the way they do.
What you've experienced is 'narcissistic rage', it isn't a rational/logical reaction esp given the context hence why you're stunned.

Google narcisstic traits/parents and it will give you a better insight into their mindset and behaviour.
You can't have a 'normal' relationship with a narcissist, they either 'hate' you or use you for their narc supply.
They 'love' through their narcissistic filter so you will only ever be what they want you to be....and right now they've decided you're the 'enemy' and must be vilified.

From my experience the best - and only - way to deal with narcissists is to assert strong boundaries and follow through with any consequences if they cross them.
DON'T allow yourself to be 'blamed' for anything when the fact is that your dh agrees with you....you're basically putting yourself on a plate for them to victimise you.

I feel guilty that when he was a newborn, I let them do whatever they wanted with him even though it made me sick to my stomach sometimes....I dont want my husband to lose his parents over something this trivial....I don't want the whole family to take sides, or worse- blame me for the downfall of their family. I don't want their Christmas traditions ruined. I don't want my son growing up hearing that his mother is a b$&ch who broke the family.
I don't want them accusing me of withholding their grandchild....I need to find a way to help them overcome that
You've done all you can and left the door open for them.....the rest is now down to them. So no more notes, flowers, offers of counseling etc, stop trying to please them and stop taking responsibility for them.
You sound very level headed and a confident character, but it's very easy to fall into the F.O.G trap (fear, obligation, guilt) and i think that's what's happening here.

This article might help you understand what you're dealing with www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/communication-success/201807/8-signs-narcissistic-rage

OP you are the most calm, forgiving and rational person I’ve ever come across.

I’m so impressed.

I second that you are absolutely not being unreasonable at all. You are his mother, you’re the matriarch now. Not your MIL. People are asked to care for our children because we trust them, not because of genetics.

@HeebieJeebies456 thanks for that article. Some of that really rings true, for example when my newborn was sick they threw a series of smaller tantrums about how they didn't get enough alone time with the baby. It was all about them. They didn't seem to have any sense that the focus should be on the sick newborn, it was all about how they weren't getting to enjoy being new grandparents. My husband dealt with this series of tantrums alone and didn't tell me how they had carried on until months later when the baby was better.

I agree with everything HeebieJeebies said.

OP, I think you're far too kind to these toxic people. Unfortunately it doesn't look like there's a way to resolve this as obviously their way is to drop people from their lives if they don't "behave".

They're not hurt, they're enraged, but they are such damaged and toxic people they put it across as hurt.

My mother does this, she escalates minor things into "you've hurt me so badly". I just do "grey rock" with her now, but with the way your in laws have behaved to you I don't know if that's even a realistic option for you.

Don't let your DH bring DS next weekend, that will encourage them to abuse you in future so they can see DS without you. Awful situation for you.

I think the only way to have a relationship is to set out clear boundaries and consequences, e.g. "if you insult OP, we are leaving, and will not see you for a week", "if you scream at me on the phone I will hang up and not call you until next weekend." Then you need to follow through. Given that they have just cast aside people who have upset them in the past, you run the danger that they will do this to you too. But the alternative is your parenting choices being ignored and you being insulted and abused for the foreseeable.

Thanks @Thehop but I don't feel calm. It's 1:43am in my country and I am up crying and writing to strangers on the internet. In this moment I am FUMING at how MIL spoke to me today. I am so angry.

But my reaction to problems is always to look for a solution, so I am trying to put my feelings aside and do that.

But please don't think I am a saint. Im having some really angry conversations in my head while planning as best I can to never have them in real life

@HelenUrth I've never heard the term 'grey rock' before but you're the second person here to mention it. Googling now

Your concerns over safety are not OTT and sound pretty sensible. But it seems to me that there was a silent power struggle for the past year with regards to MIL, where she disregarded your parental rights to establish some sort of dominance over you. It’s about getting their own way with your child being more of an accessory to their ego. They want things on their own terms and it has all come to a head when you refused to allow them to continue that way. It’s kinda some primeval struggle between ageing alphas who refuse to acknowledge that the next generation now has their own family unit and wont kowtow to them. Also, as someone else pointed out that as parents you are in that constant frame of mind to spot any safety hazards and their own parenting days are pretty long ago, so they are not as switched on. Changing nappies on a high and hard surface when not that vigilant is mad, it takes a split second for the baby to fall off and could cause quite serious injuries. I reckon that you probably let a lot of things slide for peace sake and they aren’t used to anyone standing up to them. Kids do not need grandparents if they are toxic.

No to the flowers and card. i'd bet my shirt on the ILs dumping them straight in the bin and feeling like they'd scored a point over you for doing it.

Look OP I mean this nicely but - your complaint against them is that they won't see your POV. But you aren't seeing this from theirs either, and I don't mean what you might think I do with that sentence.

Your perspective is to be nice. To keep the relationship going. You've said yourself that you have the emotional tools to do that, but you've also said that you can't fathom their mindset. And that's your problem here.

This isn't trivial. It's your baby's safety. And you need to see this from their POV. Which is simply that they want everything to be done to suit them, and unless they get their own way they are entitled to scream and cry. So you can't smooth this over, and that's not your fault. If you can accept that unlike you they don't play nicely, this will be a lot easier.

Unfortunately you can't reason with people who think they know best as my own MIL recently reminded us.

Your in-laws have displayed over a year that they think they know best and will blatantly ignore what you and your husband say regarding taking care if your son. Then treated you horribly during their dual adult tantrums. Not sure how they expected this to end. 🙄

I find it helpful to say things like "oh I know we all turned out fine, it's just things have changed now and I'd prefer if you did it like this. I bet my kids will be horrified about things I do now when they're parents as the advice is constantly changing!"