To think mumsnet is full of hate crime?

[Whyisthisacceptable]

The whole active thread list is always taken up by tons of trans bashing threads. How is it acceptable? Anything relating to anyone transgender is bashed. If this was against another minority of people, race, sexuality, religion it would be taken down and reported as hate crime. I don’t understand how the feminism board makes it acceptable?

If you really beleived a thought crime was in progress you would already have reported it to the police.

The current Active list shows only 1 trans thread; yours.

Baby seeing husband naked AIBU?
Being left to eat alone in a pub becau...
to worry my son will be thick?
To be fucked off by this advert??
To think mumsnet is full of hate crime?

And get ready for the spy/handmaiden/troll/man/TRA/woman-hater comments OP
No one could ever disagree with the hive and just be a woman!

Whyis

Why do we separate men and women by sex at all?

And which of those reasons isn't there if a man says he's a woman?

The fact that transpeople murder is documented in many places. A quick google will help you out.

If were talking about harm like serious sexual abuse then in the UK 85000 women a year are raped by men or transwomen.

So can ANYONE explain why females have to give up sex segregation?

Anyone?

Hate crime should not exist.

That is not the difficult question you think it is. Clearly they're saying a woman is either a natal femaleora trans woman. You know, like when in a dictionary where there are two possible descriptions for the things named in that group. It's not difficult to understand.

Right, so no more sex segregation then, despite the fact it is safer for women and girls (vagina owners to clarify) and it is highly valued for reasons of dignity and privacy in all sorts of different situations?

But Stone walls trans umbrella includes Cross dressers!? Transvestites, people who get a sexual thrill out of dressing as a woman. This type of 'trans person' i dont want in women's spaces. For, what I think are obvious reasons, but apparently that's transphobic. So yes I'm transphobic in your eyes but in others I believe I safeguarding women and girls.

I just clicked on Active. Yours is the only ‘Trans’ thread. HTH

That is not the difficult question you think it is. Clearly they're saying a woman is either a natal female or a trans woman. You know, like when in a dictionary where there are two possible descriptions for the things named in that group. It's not difficult to understand

I beg to differ - it's not at all clear that's what they're saying.

I also didn't suggest that it was a hard question, which makes it all the more puzzling that it wasn't answered by the OP. On the contrary, I think it's very simple to define the word 'woman', don't you? 'Adult human female'.

*I'll ask again: please could you define the word 'women'?

That is not the difficult question you think it is. Clearly they're saying a woman is either a natal female or a trans woman. You know, like when in a dictionary where there are two possible descriptions for the things named in that group. It's not difficult to understand.*

Ratrolypoly ,um saying natal women or transwomen is not a definition. Adult human female is the definition of of natal women.
That definition is not inclusive of transwomen. If you are wanting to change the definition of woman, its only reasonable to ask you to say what that new definition is, and to justify it. And personally, I think morally you should also explain what the implications of this new definition has for people under the 'old' definition (adult human females) and why you are okay with those implications.

Just to respond to some previous comments as a trans woman....

1. I am against self identification. I would not want to and I think it's a terrible idea. I had a hell of a lot of medical appontments to get a diagnosis of gender dysphoria and I am glad to have gone through that process.

1. Transgender as a label is too broad an umbrella. A self identified cross dresser is very different to a transsexual with gender dysphoria. Both are defined as transgender.

1. Don't assume those who should the loudest represent all transgender people. They don't.

1. Not all transgender women people want to access women only spaces. I use disabled toilets for example because I recognise how uncomfortable some people are. That's even after the fact I have been chemically castrated, am on HRT and have breasts!

1. Yes there are people who use the transgender label for their own ends. It scares the hell out of me as well ! I want the same safeguards !

@everarddigby EXACTLY. We may as well do away with segregation at all. If that’s what people are arguing for, fine, let’s have that discussion.

Otherwise tell me what the hell someone’s gender identity has to do with eg the fact when I was raped I didn’t want to be examined by someone with a penis.

Right, so no more sex segregation then, despite the fact it is safer for women and girls (vagina owners to clarify) and it is highly valued for reasons of dignity and privacy in all sorts of different situations?

You've massively overreached there; you know we all have the words "female", "natal", "legal", "genetic", "biological" and even "cis" (I know you hate it) to describe more accurately the precise "state" of women, right?

The word "woman" to a lot of us refers to women treated socially as such. You might not want to use it that way, but don't pretend it means no longer being able to describe the difference between the likes of you and me, and a transwoman.

3. Don't assume those who should the loudest represent all transgender people. They don't.

Unfortunately they kind of do though, given people are terrified of them and making significant changes to the fabric of society based on what they're asking for.

@wrexhamtrans

Thank you! Your comment should be the only valid comment on this entire thread. Any rational person (trans or not) should be able to see the issues self ID'ing causes. I hope the OP takes your comment on board.

Are you properly aware of why women want THEIR rights protecting OP? Or are you just being a goady person?

To be fair she was probably surprised you couldn't answer them yourself.

Has the OP asked you to speak on their behalf?

I think if the trans umbrella was broken down in to its separate parts again the argument would be over much quicker.

People arguing that trans people should gain unlimited access to all female spaces always seem to be using people with gender dysphoria in their arguments and statistics. They never mention the cross dressers or the fetishists that are now also included in the word ‘trans’.

So you end up with two sides arguing over a completely different set of people. Separate them and we may start to get somewhere.

"Unfortunately they kind of do though, given people are terrified of them and making significant changes to the fabric of society based on what they're asking for."

And I for one hope they don't get it !

Woman can't have a definition that includes the word woman in it ffs!

I feel this way. I'm new to Mumsnet and was honestly shocked by the feminist board. I certainly don't see it as "women sticking up for themselves". It's ignorant and narrow-minded. If your feminism isn't intersectional, it's not feminism- it's bigotry.

Look, report any posts that you think break the talk guidelines. Report to the police any comments that you feel constitute a crime. Hide threads and topics that annoy or upset you, or quite simply don't click on them or immediately click away if you come across them accidentally. Start threads on topics that interest you, comment on other threads that interest you if you like.

What I can never understand is all these posters who just want to berate other posters for what they are discussing, who want to stop people discussing, who want to force discussions into one topic of the site and so on. Just a constant barrage of bilge about how dreadful everyone is, usually from people who don't engage with the site, and don't want to discuss anything sensibly.

Ah Rat. Come on, you can’t define a word by just using the word. That is ridiculous. What is a woman?

I haven't personally seen any 'trans bashing' on here. Kiwi farms or the like, yes, but mumsnet feminist board has always seemed a place to just openly discuss the current situation with women's rights. Not flipping hate crime.