to be unhappy about DH taking our baby abroad?

[SummerForever]

Have name changed here.

AIBU to be unhappy & uncertain about allowing DH to take our 3 month old baby abroad without me?

He’s a fantastic father and there is no issue there.

Trip would be to see his family/my PILs. Short haul flight of 2hrs.

Also his grandmother is going to have her 90th birthday, she has been in poor health for a number of years now so he is concerned that it will be the last time he will get to see her and spend time with her etc.

Also he would like to introduce DS2 to her as it might be last chance. Lots of extended family would like to meet the baby, DH is one of 3 brothers and he has many aunties & uncles.

PILs obviously very keen to see baby again (they came to stay for 1 month when DS2 was a week old).

DH has some leave left and so would like to use it, I’m still on maternity leave so I could technically go as well.

The issue is that the trip would be later this month and so DS1 (aged 6) is in school and would need to be taken out for this.

We have already booked a holiday for next Easter and he will miss 10 days of the school year (long haul trip to USA).

My parents live 4 hours drive away and they both still work so would not be able to come down to look after DS1. More importantly, I would not feel comfortable leaving him here while the 3 of us go off abroad.

AIBU to be telling DH that I just don’t feel comfortable or happy with him taking DS2?

DH is quite upset that I feel this way- I am shocked that he has reacted like this and he is disappointed with my decision etc.

But for me, I think it’s just too soon for the baby to go away without me.

Am I being too clingy? or should I just let him go with DS2?
My gut tells me no but his reaction is making me question my judgement.
DS2 was an IVF baby after a number of years of TTC & miscarriages- I think I might be more over protective of him as a consequence.

What do others think, especially those with a similar aged baby?
I can’t see the wood for the trees!

I wouldn't want to be seperated from my 3 month old for a week. I'd be really uncomfortable about it.
YANBU

@absofrigginlootly

You say that you have postgraduate quals in psychology but you posted this: Surely you’ve read or been taught the heartbreaking research with rhesus monkeys?
You must know that this research studied monkeys who had been removed from their mothers at birth or within hours of birth. Can you explain how this is relevant?
You must also know that up to 6-7 months would be the BEST time for a trip like this. Babies of the OPs age tend to be quite indiscriminate and respond fairly equally to their caregiverS.
You've referenced links that don't have anything to do with babies of this age so I'm not sure whether you are projecting or simply unaware of current theory?

At babies age, it is all about mums feelings. Nothing wrong with that. Accurate information instead of scaremongering would be a much better response

Babies of the OPs age tend to be quite indiscriminate and respond fairly equally to their caregiverS.

No they don’t. There’s lots of research to show they show a preference for their mothers.

www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/HealthyLiving/trauma-and-children-newborns-to-two-years#

The attachment bond between a mother and her child is first formed in the womb, where fetuses have been found to develop preferential responses to maternal scents and sounds that persist after birth, explains Myron Hofer, who was director of the Sackler Institute for Developmental Psychology at Columbia University until his retirement in 2011. These rapid early-learning processes continue during the newborn stage of development, in which children begin to recognize their mothers’ faces and voices.

From this point on, early maternal separation can result in a series of traumatic emotional reactions during which the child engages in an anxious period of calling and active search behavior followed by a period of declining behavioral responsiveness.

www.psychologicalscience.org/publications/observer/obsonline/how-mother-child-separation-causes-neurobiological-vulnerability-into-adulthood.html

Plus all the research about newborns in nicu etc and how they do so much better on all health outcomes when they have more contact with their mothers

Unless long haul trip to USA is for an important reason, this should be cancelled and you should all go together for the family occasion.

I don’t think it would be fair on a nearly newborn to separate them from their mother (and primary care giver) for a week. OTOH, the family trip sounds really important to your husband. So something has to give and the holiday seems the easiest.

I was just mentioning the rhesus monkeys to show that attachment research in human babies is difficult because it’s unethical to deliberately separate newborns and young babies from their mothers precisely because it has negative consequences

I think you are being unreasonable although O understand why. Is the baby formula fed? There is lots of support there. He's staying with family. Some may not ever get the chance to meet the baby otherwise. I get that your instinct is the baby should stay with you- but he is a parent too. He loves the baby too. I think it's selfish, and more related to your anxieties that you've said no, and I understand why he's upset. You're basically saying only you can be trusted with the baby and he can't.

I wouldn't even allow it now and my DD is 2!! What would you do if something happened ? you can't jump in your car and drive there !! It would be at least 6 hours before you could get to her, she's a baby I would be way to scared

So you went through ivf, carried the baby for ten months and then gave birth and now he thinks it's reasonable to separate you from your newborn?
He sounds great.

YANBU - your baby is only 3 months old and still currently partly bf. Even if he wasn’t bf, I’d still say no. It’s too young to be separated because DH wants to take him away to visit family.

Anyone saying it would be fine if it was the mother, well, yes, of course it would. She’s the one who carried him for months, who breastfeeds him and who is the primary carer.

I’d take DS1. Fly out Friday, call DS in sick with vomiting Monday/Tue etc plus the 48 hours, job done. Anyone asks, yes you were in Italy for the weekend, couldn’t fly back until he was well. He’s 6 not 16.

I’m more concerned about you/your DH tbh. The fact he’s suggested taking DS1 for a whole week without you, to me, shows a complete lack of care about your feelings AND DS2’s welfare. It seems like he just wants to show DS2 off and stuff how it affects you both.

Is DH pushing you to stop bf DS to get your fitness (aka figure) back?

People saying ‘My 3 month old baby did xyz and is fine’ cannot know that. They cannot know how it affected them. It’s not like they would grow a second head or something. These things change your thoughts, feelings, security - no one else knows how it changes your ability to trust, form good bonds in relationships etc.

It is not simply about whether the Dad can change a nappy and if the Mum minds. It’s about what is BEST for the BABY and at 3 months that is NOT being taken from it’s Mum for a week.

Yes whitches and there’s always report bias at play too. My MIL was kid tell anyone who would care to listen what a wonderful mother she was - and how (seriously!) putting them in their own room and shutting the door until morning and leaving them to cry it out from birth never did then any harm when the reality is all her children have mental health problems as a result of their childhoods

*will not was kid

But apparently babies are like a sack of potatoes and don’t care who looks after them. The mother is entirely interchangeable in the eyes of the baby and millennia of evolution that has designed mother and infant pairs to be a hormonal, emotional and physical (BF) diad is irrelevant in 2018 when “equality” for the parents is more important

If it was a different scenario ex wanted to take tiny baby for a holiday I'm sure the voices would be No tell him to go to court.

Views are being blured because of a 90 year olds birthday. Actually im quite sure she'd be happy to see GGC anytime not just on her birthday.

Yeah but if it was Dad taking the baby for a 48 hour break from a harassed and tired mum everyone will be ‘yay, happy baby, happy mummy.’ Or if a mum with PND said ‘I am going to my mother’s house 6 hours away for 3 weeks so she can help me cope.’ Again the ‘do it, happy mummy happy baby’ would be trotted our. So happy mummy is clearly top of the list and actually in the MN universe trumps all. And babies can be transported like a sack of potatoes if it is helpful for the Mum.
Which I don’t actually disagree with because Mums do the bulk of the caring in the early months. But all this hyperbole is obscuring the fact that there are double standards here based on what the MUM wants (ie here she doesn’t want to let her kid go, whereas in my scenario she does or wants to take the kid away from the other parent) so all this handwringing about ‘think of the baby’ is a tad hypocritical.

Or if a mum with PND said ‘I am going to my mother’s house 6 hours away for 3 weeks so she can help me cope.’ Again the ‘do it, happy mummy happy baby’ would be trotted our. So happy mummy is clearly top of the list

The key point here being a mum with post natal depression. Which is serious.

Take your child number 1 out of school and all go this sort of event IS more important then bloody Disney land for gods sake and at 6 they will not be doing anything massively important

Ffs its not the seperation thats the problem its the OP unwillingness to take 6 year old out of school for a few days as they are going on holiday for 10 days to Disneyland and that holiday is fine to take child out of school for but not to see great grandmother for last time OP prioties are not in the right place ill and old relative is more important than Disneyland yet you think its ok to take him put of school for Disney land yet cannot convice taking him out for last important family event.

@worridmum
Quote from op 'Our tip next Easter is to the east coast USA- nowhere near either Disneys, not sure where that came from??- we have two weddings to attend and decided to make a big trip of it'

Rtft.

Thank for you all your thoughts, opinions & suggestions.

As I stated upthread- we are going to to the USA next Easter, 2 weddings (DH best friend from university and the other is one of his cousins).
Why do people keep talking about Disney??
The trip is paid for, it's going to be our main holiday next year.
No scope for cancelling the whole thing- why would we?

I think this subject is clearly very personal and certainly divisive in terms of differing opinions. I've found it very reassuring that there are many women out there who feel the same way as me, and that it's not just me being over the top, precious etc

Equally, there are other opinions that have made me think and reflect- thank you for this. However, I still cannot get round my gut feeling that this is not right, for me, for our baby etc.

DH and I will clearly need to discuss this further- he is away abroad on a work trip this week- but will be able to talk face to face at the weekend.

To clarify- it is my decision with regards to getting back into exercise/fitness. I'm very much into sports and exercise e.g. going to the gym etc and struggled to keep this up during my pregnancy with DS2- with DS1 it wasn't an issue as obviously didn't have a young child to run around after as well!

Maybe I need to change my perspective on things, but I feel that this proposed trip has come up just very recently and that we have spent a lot already on our holiday next year.

It's just not something we have budgeted for and TBH feels more like DH would like to take DS2 by himself, as he is equally keen that DS2 does not miss anymore school than he has to this academic year.

There are so many replies, sorry if I've not answered specific questions, am going to look back through the tread now.

Thank you to everyone who has contributed, I appreciate ALL the opinions and it's been good to get a different point of view about things.

*that DS1 does not miss anymore school than he has to

Op seriously ignore those posters asking you to ignore your gut instincts which is to protect your tiny baby. I can't imagine the stress to you both.

A psychologist has commented on the thread about the seperation anxiety that the baby could end up with and long term damage.

Even women in prison aren't seperated from babies because of the damage to infants.

I see you post about DH being away on business and I've no doubt he will trott out the line but I've had to leave baby for a week. The big difference is Baby grew in your tummy and You are the primary carer.

TBH if he is away for the week on business he is not seeing the baby every day at the moment and not an ideal candidate to look after the baby, on his own, with 2 plane journeys, for a week.

This trip is of no benefit to your baby.