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Original poster

Would you consider me transphobic?

349 replies

TheSkyisAlive · 26/10/2018 05:54

First of all I believe that gender dysphoria is a mental illness and should not be treated with hormones and surgery. Having said that, it's their body and their choice and if that's what a person wants, they shouldn't face abuse or live in fear.

But just because you identify as a female does not mean you are one. Even after surgery.

You do not understand what it is like to be a female and the problems we face. You do not get to speak on behalf of women. You should not compete in female only sports.

Does that make me transphobic or simply someone who does not want the females to be second class citizens?

OP posts:
PinkSparklyPussyCat · 26/10/2018 14:59

Rat, what you don’t seem to understand is that if I turn round and say I don’t want the trans nurse doing my smear then the likes of you will be saying I’m transphobic and saying it’s a hate crime

JaneJeffer · 26/10/2018 14:59

My gynaecologist is a man and I have no problem with that. However, if he told me he was a woman but looked exactly as he does now I would be very wary of him and wouldn't want him anywhere near me. Does that mean I'm transphobic?

DisrespectfulAdultFemale · 26/10/2018 15:01

Does that mean I'm transphobic?

No. But you would be accused of being so by TRAs and allies because your right to make a choice about your healthcare provider is invalidated by a man's feelings.

ShotsFired · 26/10/2018 15:14

I've been very much more vocal on Facebook recently and had no disagreement at all. Lots of support actually.

me too. i recently found out that a whole bunch of my friends are of like mind, when one posted something that broke the dam of silence.

I have also had two people say to me in person they appreciate the information and links I am posting - one cannot say anything as she is in academia and her role would severely at risk for even breathing a word of dissent; and the other said she had no idea but I have inspired her to go away and read more on this issue.

Courage calls to courage.

RatUnholyRolyPoly · 26/10/2018 15:14

Of course I won't pink! If you go to your smear having asked for a female, and the person you're presented with you don't want touching you for whatever reason, be that because you think they're genetically XY or for whatever other reason, that is completely your right. Honestly, I wish more people knew they could do this, particularly with maternity care! Not specifically re: trans, but so many women submit to medical procedures they don't realise they can refuse, or to HCPs doing things they don't feel comfortable with; for any reason at all.

Jane I actually think it sort of does... don't you? Have you wondered why you might feel that way about someone you otherwise know and trust, that you might suddenly have a problem with them if you found out they were trans? That they believed themselves to be "a woman trapped in a man's body"? Does it not make you think to yourself, just a teensy bit that having a problem with someone you would otherwise be fine with just because they're trans might be... you know... prejudiced??

RatUnholyRolyPoly · 26/10/2018 15:16

me too. i recently found out that a whole bunch of my friends are of like mind, when one posted something that broke the dam of silence.

It's mad isn't it, my Facebook is the same. I recently messaged over 100 of my friends with a petition against Trumps anti-trans legislation and I've never sparked such unanimous agreement! It's almost like we make friends with people sort of like ourselves...

ShotsFired · 26/10/2018 15:21

Well I also have a friend who is determined to trans her son whatever it takes (full on Mermaids spiel), so I also have friends who think differently to me.

What of it?

JaneJeffer · 26/10/2018 15:22

But Rat the reason I'd be uncomfortable is because I'd question the motives of someone who has not transitioned in any way except to say they are a woman. That to me is not a trans woman but a man.

Sammymommy · 26/10/2018 15:22

Just because the racists have crawled out of the wood in the last few months and are more open about it on social media doesn't mean they are not racists.

Just because you have found like minded people on Facebook doesn't mean...

Sammymommy · 26/10/2018 15:25

How many times have anyone on Mumsnet encounter a man, doctor or not, introducing themselves as woman? Like seriosuly, not on Facebook pr heard about. How many time have you met a man in the toilets or anywhere who just said "meh, I am allowed to be here, I am a woman"?

It sound like fear mongering propaganda about trans people, based on nothing but ignorance...

Sammymommy · 26/10/2018 15:30

*has anyone

RiverTam · 26/10/2018 15:36

Sammy you know that's exactly what TRAs were saying about transwomen in women's prisons, don't you?

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 26/10/2018 15:41

It's already happened, Sammymommy. Presumably you didn't see the news story.

The NHS has apologised to a woman who was left “embarrassed and distressed” after a nurse with stubble and a deep voice was going to carry out her cervical smear test

The woman requested a female NHS nurse to perform the intimate procedure but was dismayed when a staff member with “an obviously male appearance” greeted her.

When the patient pointed out the mistake, the nurse replied: “My gender is not male. I’m a transsexual.”

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 26/10/2018 15:49

I have no problems with my GP doing my smear, because I trust him. I don't have a problem with male gynaecologists. My DF was a GP obstetrician and I know how highly he held our sex.

However I might well have a problem with anyone whose presentation told me they have big issues concerning their own sex and their body.

I might have been less concerned ten years ago, but in the years since I went down the gender rabbit hole I have learned many disturbing things about some of the men who identify as women and I wouldn't want one to perform an intimate examination on me.

RatUnholyRolyPoly · 26/10/2018 15:50

Wow, that's a completely unbiased news source isn't it! Is that someone's pet project from FWR?

Anyway, you gloss over the fact that the only reason that nurse saw the patient was because of a clerical error. It even says so in the article. It isn't because she was being presented to the patient "as" a female HCP, they mis-recorded the patient's request. The HCP accepts they didn't handle it well and the trust apologised for the mix up.

Terrible, terrible trans person. Or terrible, terrible NHS computer systems. Now which could it possibly be?

RiverTam · 26/10/2018 15:53

Prawn excellent example - if the falsehood that a man could ever be a woman wasn't supported, that would never have happened.

RatUnholyRolyPoly · 26/10/2018 15:53

Oh hang about, it's a perfectly reasonable source, I only read the word "project2 in the link and saw the next few lines of a subsequent article - LOL! Long fucking Friday getting too stressed with people on Mumsnet Grin

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 26/10/2018 15:56

It sound like fear mongering propaganda about trans people, based on nothing but ignorance.

I'm not basing my concerns on ignorance but on evidence. All the things women were told "will never happen" have happened, and multiple times.

And it's not trans people that women worry about. It's transwomen because they have male strength, male bodies (90%+ have a penis) and commit male pattern abuse.

greendale17 · 26/10/2018 15:58

But just because you identify as a female does not mean you are one. Even after surgery.

^I agree

papayasareyum · 26/10/2018 15:58

Rat, why do you put so much effort into coming on these threads and spending a great deal of time telling women that they’re silly, paranoid and prejudiced Hmm for having genuine and understandable and very logical concerns about very serious and real issues? Why??Hmm

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 26/10/2018 16:06

That's a question I'd guess a lot of posters have asked themselves, papayasareyum.

TitOfTheIceberg · 26/10/2018 16:08

The current crop of vocal TRAs won't rest until a person's self-declared gender is all that makes them a woman or a man in law. If that is allowed to happen, all sex-based rights and protections go out the window - so an HCP with an 'obviously male appearance' would only have to say "I'm a woman" and anyone requesting a female HCP for whatever reason would not only not have a leg to stand on when it came to protesting their request had not been adhered to (you asked for a woman, we gave you a woman, what's your problem?), but would be at risk of being accused of discrimination for even trying to do so.

TerfedOff · 26/10/2018 16:11

TBH I never read what Rat says.

It never reads like something a mum or a feminist would write. Or even someone who likes or understands women.

GatheringHerBrows · 26/10/2018 16:15

Not transphobic; gender critical.

The terms transphobic / transphobe are just designed to silence people (women, usually).

TulipTuva · 26/10/2018 16:15

Frustration. Men are not told they shouldn't be in a position to give smear tests because of rape victims. Trans women, it would seem, are.

Because if a male HCP is working at where I am having my smear, and I request a female, I will not be presented with that male. No problem. Only people who don't mind a male HCP will have him.

But if I request a female, the male transwoman HCP who is legally female but not actually female, could be given to me, even though I asked for a female. As in a natal one.

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