AIBU to ask you how to deal with idiot teachers?

[DaysDragonBy]

Fuming right now. Had all sorts of shit from the school, but this takes the biscuit. DS has broken his wrist. It is in a cast and in a sling. He is under instructions from the doctor not to hold anything in his affected hand for three weeks. He is not to take the sling off at school.

His teacher knows this. His TA knows this. He has SN - ADHD and ASD.

He had art today. The art teacher told him to hold something in his hand. He said he couldn't. She took his fucking sling off and made him hold it in his hand with the broken wrist whilst he did something to it with the other hand.

I am absolutely furious, he said he told her he wasn't allowed to and she told him he has to anyway. Half way through the class his TA came in and took it off him thank god. But why the fuck do teachers think they know better than the injured child? I've told him, if anyone ever says that to him again whilst he has his cast on, he is to refuse, be as rude and he wants and tell them to call me.

In the interests of honesty, there is a bit of conflict with the school over this teacher at the moment.
It is the same teacher who has a tendency to waffle when giving instructions and complains when DS can't follow. When I requested that she made a bullet point summary at the end of her instructions I was told it is not fair to expect teachers to change their teaching style because one child in the class has SN.

I’m a teacher and I think what you’ve done so far is the right way forward. Try not to go into the meeting all guns blazing and ascertain all of the facts first. Then, if you’re still unhappy lodge a formal complaint. I don’t think you should gossip with other parents before you’ve even had the meeting though!

With regards to what children should do if they’re not participating in PE I’m with WhiteDust. In fact we’ve been explicitly told if a child were to be seen just sitting out doing nothing, Ofsted wouldn’t be happy.

Message to the Art teacher : In future, just don't bother - let them sit at the side of the room and watch
It wasn't even his writing hand that was broken though. If the art teacher could be bothered to try there's very little reason Op's son couldn't join in but it's clear through this that she doesn't feel she should have TO even try to include the special kid cos he's the TA's responsibility.

Nanny0gg
At all schools I've worked in if there's a long term absence from PE due to serious issues (especially in the winter months when it's unreasonable to expect someone to stand outside in the cold for an hour barely moving) then usually the form tutor, head of year of senior leadership tend arrange for them to work somewhere supervised.
E.g. As a tutor I've had a member of my form sit in the back of whatever lesson I was teaching and get on with some work.

It's based on staff good will though as we don't have to (and sometimes haven't the capacity).

When dd couldn't participate in PE in secondary, they wanted her to referee which means a lot of running around - exactly what she wasn't meant to be doing! Despite doctors' letters (gp and consultant) the school insisted that she COULD referee. I almost begged them to just let her sit in the library and work, but no they wouldn't let her do that either. The library was permanently manned, and she was known to be a well behaved student. It all meant that she continued to need time off PE for far longer than she probably would have otherwise.

I have found school to be absolutely and stupidly unhelpful re PE.

Op, I'd be raging too.
I've found that many teachers (or TAs actually) in my experience are armchair doctors. I received a 'courtesy call' from DD1s former teacher to inform me that she had 'extremely contagious hand, foot and mouth disease' and that she 'isn't allowed to touch the pens or anyone or anything at school, but (I) don't need to pick her up'. I told her she had eczema, but I will pick her up to get her to a drs as there's no point in being at school.
It was eczema.

I'm a TA and also a first aider at a primary school. I appreciate what you say band but please try to understand the difficulty we face. We can be held responsible if we don't phone parents or under react. Often, we phone a parent and let them make a decision because we have had some awful situations where we have been blamed and accused of negligence because we wrongly assumed a sore wrist was nothing more than a knock. You can't win!

However as I said upthread, there would never be a time I would ask a child, whose arm was in a sling, to hold an object. whether I had been told or not. It's obvious to me.

then usually the form tutor, head of year of senior leadership tend arrange for them to work somewhere supervised.

Secondary school...?

Raging, storming, etc. Regardless who is right or wrong people who have little control over their emotions sound like utter idiots.

FFS, this is an online forum. Exactly the right place to 'vent' emotions before calmly dealing with it.

So, class teacher answered and has offered a meeting tomorrow with the TA also present. I've shifted work so I can go and she's now sent me another email asking for a few keywords so she can prepare for the meeting.

So either :
Art teacher is keeping quiet about what she has done
Or
School, class teacher included, don't see it as an issue.

Not quite sure how to answer. The TA is the only other adult who Could shed some light on the art class. I.e. did she have to put DS's sling back on or not? But I'd rather not give her the opportunity to talk to art teacher first if they genuinely don't realise it's about that.

I’d just reply saying you have a few questions but nothing that will need any preparation to answer and that you’ll see them tomorrow.

How did the meeting go OP?

But teacher knows what it's about, surely. You've spoken to TA and one of the teachers already. Can you just say it's further to conversations had last week?

But teacher knows what it's about, surely. You've spoken to TA and one of the teachers already. Can you just say it's further to conversations had last week?

Given the apparent lack of communication and what seems to be a desire to hide the incident I wouldn't be to sure about this

I sent Bumsex's reply.

I started off by asking what exactly the mean when they speak of collaboration between school and home. Blank looks. So I asked if I was allowed to raise issues about things that concern me without it negatively affecting DS. Class teacher immediately was "yes, of course." TA horrified. Wanted to know where I got this idea from. Did I seriously mean if I came to the school with an issue, they would say amongst the staff "don't bother with DS, his parents complain a lot". I explained it was about the art class. Glances were exchanged. TA said she was present in the class so I said I would be happy to hear her version. She corroborated that DS was quite distressed when she got there and whispered to her that A had removed or repositioned his sling, she couldn't remember which. Convenient that, but leans towards DS's version being true.

TA said she didn't feel comfortable discussing Art teacher. I said I'd already discussed with A and didn't particularly see the need to discuss with her again. Said I wasn't sure who to go to, you, head, above and I'd been advised by a couple of people in the first instance to contact C. She said it was the right thing to do, and sat back down.

C apologised. Said she'd talked to A because the situation had bothered her. (So they did know what the meeting was about!) Now, wait for the genius stroke: C couldn't remember if she had told A about DS's arm or not. A couldn't remember if C hadn't told her or if C had told her and she had forgotten. Mighty convenient!!

Will post later.

the genius stroke for me makes it much worse - the school should not be reliant on a class teacher passing that information through. Such information should be disseminated to everyone who teaches him. A not knowing is not an excuse

I have spent 6 years dealing with teachers who think they know best and you know what I’ve been right 10/10 and that’s with a child with relatively minor additional needs.

Maybe parents of special ed kids get incredibly frustrated when we see our kids getting more and more anxious

On this one it sounds like a communication cock up.
If the class teacher is normally ok and she wasn't the one whoe moved his sling then I'd be inclined to run with it on this one and focus on the issues surrounding the art teacher as from your other thread there are multiple things to be discussed with the SENDCo.

Though it's much easier to offer advice if there's one thread with all the information. Based on all the info put together today from the 2 threads then my initial advice would have been a meeting with the SENDCo possibly including a senior member of staff straight away.

Yes, definitely a communication cock-up. I explained that I understand that, but to me, it didn't happen in isolation.

TA was seething that A tried to blame DS for reveling in causing conflict, C didn't believe it either.

We have the fact that A has never asked DS if he has understood his tasks. I checked three times and received the same answer. No. I was uncomfortable that she was happy for him to do nothing because he was "special". I asked if the same would happen to the other children. If they would be ignored if they weren't doing anything and that I couldn't believe this to be the case. I asked why he shouldn't be accorded the same courtesy as the other children, just because he's "special". They were genuinely horrified, I think my over use of the phrase "he's special", clearly quoting how A spoke to me. I said we'd already had this exact same situation in previous years, except then the teacher described him as "different" and it seems to me a lack of communication trough the years and not something I should have to be re-iterating every year.

They did say DS needs to ask if he doesn't understand. I said ok, but look at it from his point of view. You're asking him to put his hand up and say to the class "hey look, there's yet something else DS doesn't understand." Because he knows he doesn't understand, he knows the others do understand and he knows that he should too, but doesn't. So imagine how that makes him feel. They hadn't thought of it like that and can see why he might be reluctant to ask. So will make a point of going to him to ask him to explain what he has to do so they can be sure he does understand.

I said I understand from A that the staff spend a lot of time and energy on DS, and thank you for it, but then I can't reconcile that with not having time to ask him if he's understood.

I explained about how I'd had the meeting with TA about summarising etc and she was adamant that she has discussed it with A. I believe her. Either giving a short summary to the class or one to DS after. He should be getting this, as well as a more limited choice of what to do, but clearly he's not.

We have discussed giving him a pictorial/written to-do list. The TA is going to ask if she can switch lessons (she currently helps in A's husband's classroom first lesson) so she is there for the first art lesson and can make him a list, go through it with him rather than coming in half way though and playing catch up.

TA is off on holiday in 2 weeks and her DIL is coming to stand-in for her wonder if it's the headmaster's daughter!! but she will brief her on what's going on.

They have admitted to glaring deficiencies in communication and will be looking to rectify it. I said I'm not interested Knowing what happens internally beyond wanting an assurance that things will improve for DS. A will be the art teacher for the rest of the time DS is at school and in two years A's husband will be DS's form teacher.

Hurrah! You've handled that so well! I hope that even A gets the message now, and that you never have to go through this again.