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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think the tide is turning with transgenderism

999 replies

abacucat · 11/10/2018 10:05

There have been a flood of articles in mainstream newspapers criticising transgenderism and putting forward the feminist perspective. It is not long ago that no mainstream newspaper would carry these articles. The tide seems to be turning.

OP posts:
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7
Earlywalker · 11/10/2018 23:27

This thread is a repeat run of another thread. Advanced search can be illuminating

Most trans threads go the same

  • OP (trans issues...)
  • regular posters (yes, oh yeah, so true, we’re so enlightened, call MP,)
  • poster gives different side of argument
  • everyone:You troll! Man! Handmaiden
  • everyone:what is your definition of a women?

And repeat.

whatsthecomingoverthehill · 11/10/2018 23:28

To address the question in the OP, on Twitter a fair few people I follow seem to have become increasingly GC. They are from a variety of backgrounds and tweet about different things so it does seem that there has been a bit of an upswing.

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:28

No you bore off. You don't appear to have a clue what gaslighting is. You wouldn't be minimising it so much if you did. THAT is offensive.

And please don't @mention when I'm here on the thread. It's completely unnecessary.

VerbeenaBeeks · 11/10/2018 23:30

And no one here is doing that. That is what domestic abusers do. I couldn't give a fuck what these people think, I'm not interested in controlling them for my personal benefit, I'm just disagreeing with them.

Domestic abusers to you being men, right? You do the exact same tactics along with others. Or doesn't it count if it comes from a woman doing it to other women? It's still gaslighting, it's still the exact same tactic.

Louislovesmud · 11/10/2018 23:30

@Ereshkigal where have I minimised what gaslighting is? Where did I say it was anything other than exactly what it is?

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:31

Gaslighting is about power relations. It's about control. Gender critical feminists don't control the narrative at the moment. We are speaking out about a mass gaslighting of us by organisations with power where we are expected to believe an untruth, and look happy about it.

VerbeenaBeeks · 11/10/2018 23:31

And please don't @mention when I'm here on the thread. It's completely unnecessary

We're back to that? You did that on the other threads to someone disagreeing too.It's a perfectly legitimate tool on MN, loads of people do it.

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:31

If I ask you to stop, I'd like you to respect that please.

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:32

And lots of people don't like it Verbeena, I'm not the only one.

VerbeenaBeeks · 11/10/2018 23:33

And people did when you pointed out you didn't like it. Nobody has since atted you.Mini bold fail from me with the quote, but no-one has.

Louislovesmud · 11/10/2018 23:33

@Ereshkigal you still need to show me where I minimised what it is. I gave an accurate definition, and I'll need you to copy and paste where I did otherwise or be forced to assume you've misread something I've written and don't want to admit to it

VerbeenaBeeks · 11/10/2018 23:34

And people did - stop, that is. See you've posted since.

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:34

You do the exact same tactics along with others.

Don't be ridiculous. I suppose that is "gaslighting" to you too, rather than robust disagreement?

Datun · 11/10/2018 23:34

Earlywalker

That's awful about your friend. Anyone who takes a razor blade to their genitals has some serious problems. The fact that his father still insisted on adding to them, doesn't sound good either.

I think it's quite evident that women transition for different reasons to men. Women seem to be escaping the way they are treated, whereas men seem to be embracing being treated in a different way. There is a subtle difference.

Stephanie Davis Arai has said she has yet to see a woman transition who isn't either autistic, a lesbian or has suffered from some sexual trauma.

So not understanding gender, gender nonconformity, or escaping gender. They all seem to have the same thread.

Women transitioning is less of a problem in terms of sex segregation. Because women transitioning are no real threat to men. So the opposite situation doesn't arise.

However, we do not make laws based on individual people.

Rape laws are not made based on men who don't rape. Or, indeed women who transition.

And no, of course people don't run up to transwomen amd say you're a man, you're a man. But it's necessary to acknowledge that if you are to acknowledge the basis for sex segregation.

People like Sophie Cook who decide that women of colour are a subset of women and we need to have a word that includes both them and transwomen (!), certainly needs telling they're not a woman. And to stop talking on behalf of them.

Louislovesmud · 11/10/2018 23:34

That was me, it's out of habit to make sure it's clear who is responding to whom. I'll happily stop - but still look for an answer to my request

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:35

Louis. I asked you to stop @mentioning me. Please respect my wishes.

VerbeenaBeeks · 11/10/2018 23:36

you still need to show me where I minimised what it is

You haven't minimised it. I can only guess this is another let's ignore and deflect everything that's being said tactic.

Louislovesmud · 11/10/2018 23:37

Ereshkigal respect my wishes and show me where I minimised gaslighting

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:37

you still need to show me where I minimised what it is.

You are minimising it, because one person's throwaway disagreement with you on a website isn't abusive manipulation of your mental health. Not hard.

Louislovesmud · 11/10/2018 23:38

because one person's throwaway disagreement with you on a website isn't abusive manipulation of your mental health

Where did i say it was?

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:39

That's what gaslighting means.

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:39

Ask any victim of it.

Datun · 11/10/2018 23:40

This is like wading through custard.

Louislovesmud · 11/10/2018 23:41

This is what I said, word for word:
^MIdgebabe

Gas lighting means trying to get people to believe something that isn’t true*

Um, no it doesn't. It means manipulating a person to question their own sanity and version of reality. To convince them that they have it twisted, that they're going mad and can't trust their own instincts.^

Can you highlight where I said because one person's throwaway disagreement with you on a website isn't abusive manipulation of your mental health within that text?

Ereshkigal · 11/10/2018 23:41

As I said, certain posters have no interest in a good faith discussion, they're just flinging shit.