To think the tide is turning with transgenderism

[abacucat]

There have been a flood of articles in mainstream newspapers criticising transgenderism and putting forward the feminist perspective. It is not long ago that no mainstream newspaper would carry these articles. The tide seems to be turning.

In terms of the OP, I think it probably is.

There is no respectable argument in favour of self ID. Believe me, we would have heard it on here by now. But, many people are still resistant to the arguments against it. Despite having no counterargument. It's some kind of emotional response that I've never quite understood.

But as more articulate people grasp the implications and write about them, and predators nail the point home, self ID is beginning to look dangerous as a legality and a bit daft as a concept.

More and more people are becoming gender critical, there is no doubt.

spannablue

I'm supportive of women and women's rights and I don't think they have anything to do with men, trans or otherwise. And I've been talking about it for years. I understand the tiredness, though.

Ohello From the early 1970s until self-ID, I also supported transwomen, including their right to come into our single sex spaces
Much for the same reasons I supported gay rights

However, that was back when transwomen were a tiny number who hated their genitals and just wanted to quietly live as women.
They didn't push boundaries, threaten violence or try to "erase" us
All either had, or wanted to have, the full surgery.

They are what most people still assume all transwomen are.

However, the number of predators being convicted has helped raise awareness that this new trans phenomenon is totally different
The more extreme activists show all the typical behaviour of aggressive, abusive men who just want to change the law to make abuse easier

If Parliament abolish that dreadful law, I hope we can return to that former "gentlemen's agreement" for the tiny number of genuine transwomen ... who are "truscum", according to those same extremists

Verbeena I think what we really established on that FWR thread about why you and a few others hate FWR is:+ We have far too many threads on self-ID So you wanted us to accept self-ID and stop posting about it

For those just arriving to the thread, and to those who didn't see any other threads, just for the record, I have NEVER EVER EVER said we have too many self ID threads and you should accept self ID and stop posting about it!
NEVER, anywhere. In fact I have said the complete opposite, in that people have valid concerns about self ID.
Jeez, that is some serious gaslighting twisty shit there. I know I have never said anything of the sort.

Another here who always happily advocated for and supported so called truscum. Truscum welcome here.

Yeah verbeena has said that there are valid concerns over self ID

Newsnight last night was about the use of the word 'womxn' instead of woman. I don't know how you pronounce it but 'womxn' was preferred because it was inclusive of trans people and others (?).

And to talk around the question: "Why are women cross about the term?' they invited a transwoman to answer it.

Funnily enough, the transwoman couldn't see why silly women were bothering their silly little lady brains about it.

When transwomen replace women to speak about things that affect women, on Newsnight, then I would expect a couple of hundred thousand people go: WTAF?

Verbeena I said you and some other posters on the FWR thread.

There were definitely posts requesting we accept self-ID and stop creating such threads
I didn't say you personally said that - Sorry, I should have made it clear that I couldn't remember the names

Since you don't share that, what do you want exactly ?
Is it just language ?
Do you disagree with the facts and statistics posted ?

Yeah verbeena has said that there are valid concerns over self ID

Yes but she can't tell us the difference between a transwoman and a self IDer that she would have 'concerns' about.

Again, someone on this thread asked me my own opinion on the above so that 'maybe we can start from there' and I took the time to give it. Did I get any more engagement on that particular point? No.

It's just a waste of time.

Where do you differ from the "mainstream" view on FWR ?

Wouldnt argue with that elephant

Either of your points

I think what we really established on that FWR thread about why you and a few others hate FWR is:+ We have far too many threads on self-ID So you wanted us to accept self-ID and stop posting about it

Typical example here of gaslighting. I don’t think I’ve seen anyone ever on these threads say we should all just accept self ID. I see you.

I agree. I am not against trans folk at all. But I am getting tired of how it's all gone too far the opposite way. They get offended by everything, they throw their toys out of the pram if they don't get their own way, and they insist they get all the same things that female born women get!

IMO, it's not the only thing! Rights for other certain parts of society have gone too far the other way too; so much so that people are afraid to speak their mind, for fear of being accused of being a bigot.

I know I'll get flamed for saying that, but that's how I feel. Everyone should be treated equally and fairly, but that doesn't always happen. Sometimes the ones who claim they are persecuted and treated badly, get preferential treatment.

Another here who always happily advocated for and supported so called truscum. Truscum welcome here

Truscum? Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's code for transwomen who accept they're biologically male, is that right?
If so you're saying you're OK with transwomen as long as they don't think they're women?

I agree. I am not against trans folk at all. But I am getting tired of how it's all gone too far the opposite way. They get offended by everything, they throw their toys out of the pram if they don't get their own way, and they insist they get all the same things that female born women get!

Who's "they?" Replace the word trans folk with for example Muslims and that's a rant worthy of the EDL.
jeez. That's why people are disengaging. They're PEOPLE!!

earlyWalker I remember it. Now I've got to go through a 1000 post thread to find one of the posts

I thought "truscum" were those who had had surgery

don’t think I’ve seen anyone ever on these threads say we should all just accept self ID. I see you.

Didja not want to maintain the high ground there?

Typical example here of gaslighting. I don’t think I’ve seen anyone ever on these threads say we should all just accept self ID

Isn't it just? Presumably saying I have just because they'll know it's hard to go back and check especially if threads have been deleted.
I know, without doubt, I have never said anything of the sort and that is some epic twisting to say I did.

Truscum is a slur used by transactivists and autogynephiles, generally to refer to transwomen with gender dysphoria. The accepting that they are men, comes usually with the diagnosis. Historically you didn't get a diagnosis, unless you could accept that you weren't actually a woman.

Most of the time they don't make a political point of it (unlike Miranda Yardley), but they will acknowledge that they are men.

We even had a poster who called them self Truscum. Several transsexuals in fact, all relating their experience of being diagnosed with gender dysphoria.

I thought "truscum" were those who had had surgery

Not sure, happy to be corrected if so.
Seems only some get a pass whatever it means though.

Thanks for proving my point verbeena.

IMO, it's not the only thing! Rights for other certain parts of society have gone too far the other way too; so much so that people are afraid to speak their mind, for fear of being accused of being a bigot

I know right, bloody rights being given here there and everywhere? Once upon a time, women asked for rights too. Look where that’s got us - they’re even allowed to vote now! We should just stop giving people rights unless we think they’re worthy.

Thanks for proving my point verbeena

What would that be then?