AIBU in Saying Cancer isn't a Battle That You Win or Lose

[NicePieceOfPlaid]

I heard this morning that the mother of a young friend died over night. She'd had cancer for a while but had not responded to treatment.

Friend has posted a brief message on facebook to let friends know. Among the first messages is one saying that the person is sorry she lost her battle. Cancer isn't a fight or a battle. You can't buy a gun and shoot it.

Sometimes the treatment works and sometimes it doesn't. I had cancer and so far the treatment has worked for me. If it comes back I'm not going to blame myself for not fighting hard enough.

It's down to luck. If you die from cancer it wasn't because you were too weak to fight it. It really gives me the rage when it's talked of as a battle. I no longer give to charities who address it in that way.

Why make terminally ill people feel even worse by implying they haven't fought hard enough?

YANBU. My dad died less than 3 months from diagnosis, rare cancer as a result of a rare chronic condition. Infection after his first and only chemo. Without the pressure to battle he would have probably lived for several months longer.

My mum said she was surprised he didn’t fight harder. I thought it was sad she felt let down by him when he was just very, very sick.

Please don’t call us cancer sufferers. It doesn’t define me, I’m a person who had cancer and a person living with the long term effects of cancer. Thankfully most organisations ditched the phrase “sufferer” a long time ago.

@minmooch I am so very sorry for your loss.

I had cancer 6 years ago and yes, I treated it and thought of it as a battle. I had an unforeseen allergic reaction to my first chemo, which almost killed me. My mum was looking after me at the time (wasn't in my home country, DH was on probation in a new job) and I fought for her, because I knew that if I let go during those few hours that it would have broken her heart.

I thankfully made a full recovery, but as PP mentioned upthread, the battles are over but I am fairly sure that the war is still being waged. And if the way I think of it helps me, then I will continue to think of it like that.

V unMN hugs for everyone who has experienced loss

Marypoppins isn't the bully here, Hen.

High emotions on the thread. When I was having chemo I met some patients who were extremely aggressive to others patients. That was disappointing! You'd think we'd all club together.

As I said upthread I found the war/fight/battle talk aptly described the physical toil of the treatment, even tho I didn't want some bod somewhere to call it a battle who hasn't actually experienced it.

Mind you I can't STAND all the cancer advertising. Maybe I just had a bellyful of the cancer world and can't tolerate a drop more? Or maybe I feel patronised by all the fucking jollity of it. Or something.

Marypoppins isn't the bully here, Hen

Fair enough. I politely disagree and have refrained from posting until now.

The words from my eulogy at my husbands recent funeral;
"People now refer to my husband as I fighter but i don't. This was not a fair fight and we certainly did not have time to prepare. Fighter suggests that there is a winner and a looser. My husband did not loose, he handled himself with strength and dignity so he's no fighter he's our warrior."

Also annoys me when people who were not that close to said person immediately say that the person battled/ fought and they actually had no idea what that person has been threw.

I do think you become (well I have) bitter about the whole cancer experience. I didn’t use or find the battle terminology helpful. I also never refer to myself as a survivor. Because unfortunately the whole ‘all clear!’ is a myth and the cancer could come back at any time. So I just plod on. Grateful to be here for now and so sad for those who haven’t made it.

Hate all the cancer adverts. Hate pink ribbons. People posting gratuitous pictures of their perfect boobs in the guise of ‘awareness’. It all pisses me off.

@Delatron I agree with you on the whole pinkwashing thing. I find it really upsetting and as for the display of perfect, unmutilated boobs as some sort of awareness? Just no.

Yes Pursefirst. Nobody seems to get the irony of this or how it may upset women who have had mastectomies. Or I guess we don’t matter as we are well aware of breast cancer.

I saw a really helpful post the other day, highlighting how breast cancer lumps can often be found under armpits or right above the breast on the muscle (mine was). So things like this are more helpful than crappy ‘awareness’ wishy washy posts. Anyway I’m digressing from the original AIBU slightly! Though it’s a discussion on how cancer terminology, advertising and social media is used I guess.

Delatron it’s a good derail! I completely see what you’re saying. It’s so insensitive.

Actual awareness campaigns that teach you something you didn’t know, great. Perfect boobs and pink glittery hearts everywhere not so much.

I totally agree with the OP, my dad died of cancer. He had stage 4 bowel cancer that had also spread to his liver, he died within 4 weeks of the diagnosis. We hadn’t even got some of the test results back when he died let alone started treatment.
He didn’t ‘lose’ anything. He was a wonderful man and behaved as a loving father and husband with his usual quiet dignity through those horrendous weeks. The whole ‘battle’ narrative really upsets me.

YANBU. I lost my dad to cancer many years ago and I have always hated this way of looking at it. Yes it’s a fight for survival but it certainly doesn’t mean that the people who lose that fight haven’t fought just as hard.

Thanks namechange I do get a bit ranty about this subject! Especially the Facebook stupid games about pant colour or even the no make up one (just an excuse for people who looked good without make up to post a selfie). I think we need to be careful not to downplay the seriousness of cancer with all this pink crap.

Do they want a no make up selfie of me after chemo? suspect not. I think I’d break Facebook and not in a good way

Namechange one of my good friends did chemo selfies, before and after. She wanted people to see past the pink and fluff and bullshit.

She showed it all, scars, op bandages, pre and post reconstruction, all of it.

I thought it was very brave of her, given the reaction some people gave her. Why should she hide because it makes people feel uncomfortable?

Equally nobody should feel any pressure to do it, I don’t mean that. I just think that if someone chooses to they shouldn’t be made to feel it’s wrong.

That is mega brave! She sounds ace.

I don’t think it’s wrong in the least and I would have been cheering her on. I just know I’m way too vain’

She is ace! I was cheering her on, loudly

To be fair I don’t do selfies in any way so I’m with you on that one! (Mostly because I’m the size of something very large that I can’t think of specifically at the moment)

Completely agree with you. If was down to a fight or a battle my mum would’ve won that’s for sure. So pleased you responded well to treatment ☺️ and sorry for your loss 💐

The no make-up selfie thing bothered me unbelievably.

When I was feeling my shittiest and had a steroid moon-face, yellow skin, no eyebrows or eyelashes (basically a giant egg), I doubt very much people would have "liked and shared" compared to Susan down the road with her swishy locks, peaches and cream complexion, and y'know, eyebrows and lashes. It boils my piss to this day.

Exactly Purse. I was a good bit out of treatment but I shared a photo of me in treatment because it wound me up so much 😂

Hiya MN, I've lurked for a while but this thread made me join. mostly because cancer has ravaged my family these last few years. Honestly if I told the whole story it would sound exaggerated, so I wont but I think the whole survivor/battle thing is a coping mechanism. for both cancer patients and their loved ones. IMO Cancer is the most evil, indiscriminate of bitches, it doesn't care how rich/poor, strong/weak, healthy/un-healthy, good/bad whatever you are, it can turn your world upside down at any time and however mny times it wants to. but I think whether you see it as a battle or anything else, we should let people talk about it in any way it helps. We're only human and cancer is too cruel for most people to easily comprehend. Let people cope however they cope. Let's not judge what strangers are going through, because, trust me, there are alot of 'swans' out there

You're kinder than me, Angel.

That is what I think of as a battle - not against the cancer itself as it's in the lap of the Gods what happens with that - it's living life as normal and not letting cancer affect the lives of everyone else around you who depends on you.

I'm coming late to this thread, but this comment earlier on struck me, and as someone who's been living with cancer for over 6 years (you could say I'm very "lucky" to have lived this long, I would agree) I have to address this, particularly this bit it's living life as normal and not letting cancer affect the lives of everyone else around you who depends on you..

Do not say that to someone with cancer! It's not up to us patients to minimise it's effects on the members of our family. We have enough to deal with, just getting through the treatments and various side effects. If we can't "live life as normal" to the detriment of those around us, then it's up to those people to deal with it. (Caveat, obviously small children will need help. I'm talking about adults here.)

We can try to live as normally as we can, and don't think we don't want to, but we often just can't.

That statement is actually really offensive.

OP I agree with you, I really hate the rhetoric, and everyone I know who has/had cancer, or a close loved one with it, hates it too. So many cancer patients have complained about the terminology used in these campaigns, I don't understand why the charities don't listen to us, and it's a kick in the teeth every time a new campaign uses it, as if our opinions don't matter.

Another term I hate is "brave". When people tell me I'm so brave, I'm fucking not brave at all. Inside, I'm a little girl again who wants to curl up on her mummy's lap and have mummy make it better. I'm terrified. All. The. Time. And I have no choice. Being brave is having a choice and choosing to do the hard thing. Refusing treatment is being brave. I'll take whatever they can give me, if it means I'll live longer. I hate having chemo, even though so far my side effects weren't too bad (with the exception of the constant infections, one of which landed me in a hospital ward full of confused elderly men for over a week). I had to have it weekly for 5 months last time. It seemed like an eternity.

Anyway, I've waffled on enough. I just wanted to support the OP and those posters here who are, or have, experienced it, especially those like me who are living with it. to you all.

it's living life as normal and not letting cancer affect the lives of everyone else around you who depends on you

Oh wow I missed this! Yes absolutely I think that is what we are all trying to do I imagine but if someone said that to me I’d be a a bit upset!

I don't care that this thread hasn't been posted on in over a year and that no one will probably see this – @YeTalkShiteHen I bloody love you. You know why? Because TwitterQueen is my Mum. She died 2 months ago, she didn't "win" or "lose" any kind of sodding fight with cancer, her body simply failed her. You'd think this thread would have upset me but all I've done is laugh at how bloody-minded she was in sticking to what she believed in and how fantastically you defended what she was trying to say! Sending huge hugs to everyone on this thread who has inevitably wound up here because they either have cancer or love someone who has it.