AIBU - DP and shaving legs

[LegHair]

Am long time lurker and first time poster.

Was having a bath this evening, with DP sat in the bathroom chatting. Somehow ended up in a row about me not shaving my legs “because you know I like it and we should make the effort for each other”.

Haven’t shaved legs in some time, because quite frankly I have better things to do with my time and rarely wear shorts or dresses that show off my legs. Always shave on holiday or when wearing dresses etc.

My point is that I want to be made to feel sexy and loved no matter what I choose to do with my body which is how I try to be with DP in the relationship.

So mumsnet jury - who IBU?

The lack of hygiene, or how we dress or groom ourselves is because it is a direct comparison, in terms of how we present ourselves and what our partners find attractive. We have every right, as men or women to present as we please. Our partners can find this attractive or unattractive. The former is a choice, the latter is a physical reaction and not a choice.

DH has never commented on my body hair or anything else. However, I'm constantly nagging him about stubble - which is painful when snogging- and nose hairs which I find very unattractive.

I don't think I'm oppressing or manipulating him.

Blue lady the (ginger) qualification in your statement makes me think he is oppressed!

I have to admit I like a certain amount of stubble on my dp and have told him I find that attractive, so maybe not that different from men telling their partners they prefer shaved legs ?

I have to admit I like a certain amount of stubble on my dp and have told him I find that attractive, so maybe not that different from men telling their partners they prefer shaved legs ?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with having a preference. There's nothing wrong with expressing a preference. There is everything wrong with trying to forve another adult to do what you want to the point where you end up in a row like in the OP.

I prefer my partner clean shaven. Sometimes he has stubble - his face his choice!

Thanks, yumi, glad someone got it! So I manipulate my bloke then? Bloody hell. I think I'm entitled to not want a ginger Brillo pad rubbed round my body. The threat of withholding sex is akin to its sister threat that if he ever cheated I'd be wearing some unusual, ugly earrings, ie a joke.

Seriously though I do think it's OK to find some things more attractive than others and to express a preference.

Bluntness

How is me making observations about societal norms either offending women or an example of me being upset? You’re making no sense.

I am not, at all upset about this, I have a husband who has accepted that adult females have some body hair aha has no problem with it.

Why would this upset me?

That my observations upset you, is just that. It’s not something I feel angry about.

In a world of damaging abuses to women and girls, whether people shave their legs or not is pretty far down the list of things to get upset about. It is, however, a very clear example of how ingrained the idea of prepubescence = beauty is in our society. It’s also a very easy way to show and make radical change.

I only make social judgments. Not personal ones.

Some posts on here are surprising. Re: being undervalued/it is seen as not making the effort for your partner, if you don't regularly shave.

*Why are people trying to use lack of basic hygeine as a direct comparison for having hairy legs?! confused

Having hairy legs doesn't equate to a lack of cleanliness*

We have been socialised to believe hair - only on women- dirty, sweaty, unhygienic, fithy and disgusting.

Pp has said how armpit hair traps sweat and makes you smell bad.

Which is completely untrue. And a theory completely undone by the fact half of the population manage to walk around with hairy armpits and smell completely fine.

In the case of pubic hair, shaving is actually less hygienic, and more likely to result in infection.

But always on these threads the main reason for hair removal is that it’s “cleaner”.

Head hair must be made of something completely different then? For some reason it isn't cleaner to shave that off

It’s all ridiculous.

And a theory completely undone by the fact half of the population manage to walk around with hairy armpits and smell completely fine.

OK, well in my relationship that's not true because my partner's armpit hair was making him smell worse for sure and his shirts were getting white crusty armpits from deodorant. When you have hairy armpits and you sweat you can only spray deodorant on the hair, not the skin. He now noticeably has less BO and no crusty pits.

Leg hair is different because it is way less concentrated and not in a "sweaty" area.

Actually armpit hair is essential for not having smelly armpits

And the pube thing isn't so much for hygiene, just because we don't want them in our mouth. Also we both noticed mine smelt more straight after I'd washed when it was a full bush, that when it was shaved. I think hair traps odour to a certain extent.

Obviously head hair and leg hair are different because they're not in areas that can produce bad smells, like pubes and armpits.

Even so, the smell thing isn't such a big deal I'd think someone was gross for not doing it. We've just noticed it on ourselves so that's what we both do.

For me, having armpit hair (and using natural deodorant) is enough to keep smells at bay after/during CrossFit etc.

When I am not training, I don’t need deodorant at all.

However, without armpit hair the sweat gathers on my skin and makes it really stinky. For me, armpit hair is an essential part of keeping clean and odour free.

We have been socialised to believe hair - only on women- dirty, sweaty, unhygienic, fithy and disgusting
This. 100%.
We are so conditioned to provide what men want over the years we don't even notice anymore.

If Armpit hair makes your armpits smell why don't men shave their armpits?

Society is infantising you. No one is blaming you for going along with it, radicalism is not an easy choice

Camel. How is this statement you made only about society and not the individual woman, and not offensive? Accusing women of agreeing to be infantilised, going along with it, of being radicalised if we shave.

It's a bonkers statement, and I suspect your attempt to wriggle out of it means you know it.

I have every right to shave my legs if that's what I prefer. I will not pay any heed to women like you who hurl insults in my direction that I am going along with society in being infantilised or that I am radicalised because of it.

There is nothing about me, shaved or unshaved, that is infantile. I am not like a little girl because I choose to remove my body hair. I am an adult and more than capable of making my own decisions on my own preferences. I am not incapable and going along with societal norms nor am I radicalised or brain washed and incapable of making an intelligent decision. The suggestion I am is laughable. And yes offensive.

The fact my choice is different to yours is not worthy of your insult.. It's my choice. Accept that. As I accept yours without insulting you.

Fair enough, everyone is different. Everyone's bodies work in a different way. The only thing I object to is people telling others they're gross. It's just fucking rude and unnecessary - like the people on the washing threads telling people they're gross because they don't wash their towels or clothes after 1 use! Seriously?

Most of the beauty industry is a complete and utter marketing scam.

why don't men shave their armpits?

Quite a few men do nowadays I think. I know some. My mum said it helped with my dad's BO, so I asked my partner to try it too.

The only thing I object to is people telling others they're gross

Interesting, because I too object to people telling others they are gross. But I object also to people telling others they have been radicalised or infantilised if they do shave. I see neither as acceptable.

We have been socialised to believe hair - only on women - dirty, sweaty, unhygienic, fithy and disgusting

We are so conditioned to provide what men want over the years we don't even notice anymore

This. And the conditioning is so complete that it's got women calling other women names for not complying with the aesthetic standard demanded by the beauty industry and men.

It's really important that we pull apart and identify this kind of shit for what it really is.

why don't men shave their armpits?

Probably because women don't have that significant a preference for it, or at least they are not being that vocal about it if they do?

Nothubg wrong with having preferences, and if someone's preference is not that out there then yes it would be nice to 'make the effort' for your partner.

And the conditioning is so complete that it's got women calling other women names for not complying with the aesthetic standard demanded by the beauty industry and men

And women calling other women names for shaving.

Why do folks keep ignoring that the abuse is going both ways?

And there's the crux of the matter. The beauty industry has a huge amount to answer for.

When I was a young woman it was almost unheard of to depilate pubic hair, in fact we all hated and objected to it when it was shaved in early labour. Now it seems to be the norm.

Equally men left their body hair alone until the beauty industry saw an opportunity to capitalise on an untapped market and offered waxing for men too.

Had to post this. All credit to the amazing Sarah Anderson (Sarah Scribbles).

I'm amazed people can shave every day! If i shave more than once every two weeks or so I get SO red raw and itchy and end up scratching in my sleep and bleeding.

Embrace the fuzz - it's nearly winter!

On one hand I don't think anyone should shave if they don't want to BUT on the other hand I also think you can't expect your husband to find you sexy if he doesn't find hairy legs sexy. You don't have to shave and he shouldn't ask you to but if you want him to find you sexy then you know what he likes

You see I don't believe humans are that stupid and do exactly what the beauty industry tells us. The beauty industry has tried many things, that have tried and failed, things that take hold are becayse we like them. Things that fail are becayse we don't.

You can't take out choice, we have experienced both, we can make our own minds up, if we chose to do something it's because we like the result of it. There is no two ways about that.if we chose not to do something it's because we don't like the end result. Hence why some trends fail and some perpetuate. We have choice.