To think some people on MN must have magic money trees?

[CoughLaughFart]

Am I the only thinking there are an awful lot of MNers who have no concept of others being less well off than they are? I’ve noticed a few times, but it seems to be getting really bad lately.

Two threads that spring to mind are the passport thread (where the OP’s partner is being pressured to get one so that he can volunteer for a work trip) and the holiday fall-out thread.

TBF most people on the passport thread seem to get that spending £75 on a new passport when you can’t afford to go abroad isn’t very sensible. However, there are quite a few posts along the lines of ‘Just get one, it’s not that expensive’ - even someone saying the OP’s partner should just ‘grow up’ and buy one and ‘that’s what savings are for’. Similarly, on the holiday thread a number of people are advising ‘Book the first flight out’ or ‘find different accommodation’, without a thought that holidays are generally expensive anyway and that effectively booking a second one might be beyond some people’s means.

These are specific current threads, but it seems to be a general attitude in some corners. ‘Get a cleaner’. ‘Get some nice wine and chill in the garden’ (to someone depressed because they’re skint and live in a rough area).

I’m grateful to be in a decent enough position financially, but I’d never simply assume anyone else was. Don’t people at least consider the potential for different circumstances before offering their ‘helpful’ advice?

People don’t realise this do they ?

I think the norm is to have some disposable cash so people assume others are medium income with £100 spare here and there

Worra has it in a nutshell, SoftSheen.

The other days “ are these boots suitable for an 11 year old”

Doesn’t really matter what the boots looked like as they cost £170.

Most people’s money tree wouldn’t produce enough for an adult to buy £170 boots let alone for an 11 year old who would outgrow them before winter had finished.

I personally think it's smart to keep your passport up to date, but some of the rest of the advice I would not consider practical at all.

@CoughLaughFart suggesting someone gets a cleaner once a fortnight isn't assuming they have unlimited funds - my cleaner costs me £36 a month. Perfectly affordable without 'unlimited' funds.

As a previous poster said, most people live somewhere in the middle of extreme poverty and extreme wealth. Driving lessons, a regular cleaner or a yearly holiday are affordable for many.

Mumsnet is not just for the poor.

To be fair, there's nothing wrong with asking a simple question about an expensive product. That's not making any assumptions or judgments about other people's circumstances.

If you're in a position to buy £170 boots for your kid, it's fine to ask a question about them. It doesn't become an issue unless you start looking askance at people who couldn't afford it.

If you cross check posts, I will appear as having lots of coats - acquired and carefully looked after over a very long time. My oldest coats (the best quality ones) were inherited and hand me downs, the rest except one, an extravagance from a pension windfall-- were all bought secondhand or in sales. So if you met me, you might think I had endless money, but the reality is more subtly nuanced. The reality is, neither brassic nor minted. After many long years of work...

Why's it smart to keep your passport up to date if you can't afford to go abroad?

I can remember reading a novel by Marilyn French called ‘The Women’s Room’ that was a massive best seller in the late 70s. In it the protagonist was described as being absolutely broke after her divorce but always found enough money for all her friends to come round on a Friday and drink wine and eat pasta. To me that was an unimaginable level of affluence - enough food for other people and wine as well. Surely these people were millionaires! It was my first realisation of the financial double standards that we often see on here

Just eye roll and move on, most of it’s bullshit anyway.

Somehow the entire 1% of the country’s high earners are on MN answering every thread relating to money.

‘How much do you spend on holidays per year?’
‘Oh 42k normally but not since DC came along’

yeah ok

A passport is only worth spending £75 on if you have the money to use it.
Driving is a life skill but it is an expensive one to obtain. £25 per hour for each lesson, cost of both the theory and practical test. Then insurance for your first years driving will be over £1000 and that is before you have even bought a car and maintenance and petrol for it.

Counselling doesn't cost minimum £45 per session if you go to a counselling centre that gives concessions for those on low incomes. There are plenty of them.

Where exactly?

The threads about living on fuck all make my blood boil. It was a very long time ago when I could buy a pint of milk or a loaf of bread but not both. My friend was equally boracic so we pooled our money and split the bread and milk in halves. I'll never forget having no money whatsoever.

Times are much, much better these days, we're comfortably off but because I can well remember how bloody awful it was to be on my uppers I want to strangle people who refuse such levels of poverty exist or that people on benefits deserve to be poor.

I always find myself astounded by the: I've had to cut back on luxuries so we can afford our £20,000 holiday this year threads.

Hell, if I'm lucky I can afford a £69 Park Resorts holiday every two years, and even that means I don't eat for a week!

I’m sure there are bullshitters on here but hundreds of thousands of people in the UK are in the top 1% of earners. It’s not that inconceivable that quite a few of them post on mumsnet. Nothing about having high earnings automatically makes you classily demure and discrete about it either.

I also think it’s easier than a lot of people think to end up one of them IF it’s your intention from before you go to university and don’t have some kind of disability. Pick the right subject, have a modicum of smarts and at least 4 times as much determination and the jobs are there for the taking. Of course if everyone did it that wouldn’t be true because supply and demand would drive down wages and your safe bet would turn out to be a dud :p I can see how I could have earned a lot of money if I’d made different choices earlier in life. I actually think the number one thing holding a lot of people back is the piss poor state of career guidance in the state education system.

Most of these responses really do reek of jealousy.

If a suggestion isn't suitable, don't try it. Simple.

We're not talking about a billionaire mocking the poor for not having their own helicopter ffs!

Why should people who work hard to afford little luxuries be made to feel bad about themselves because someone else can't afford the same?

That should have been "refuse to believe".

@DieAntword

Thank you, that made me lol so hard! She did once offer to pay for half a £120 ticket to the ballet, apparently the cheaper seats aren't worth sitting in!! I thanked her but said no.

She did say she was very careful about inviting people to her home because she'd had piss takers before, but tbh the home wasn't really the giveaway, it was the general attitude. Telling people money isn't important when you are rich is...insulting? Not sure if that's the right word.

Most of these responses really do reek of jealousy.

I'm 100% happy to own the fact that I am insanely jealous of anyone who has hundreds and hundreds of pounds burning a hole in their pocket every month, or even thousands. Money is important. Being broke is shit.

If you're in a position to buy £170 boots for your kid, it's fine to ask a question about them

I'm well off. In theory I guess we could afford that if we really wanted to. However the idea of £170 on a kids pair of boots makes me feel deeply uncomfortable. What the hell do those boots do?! Fly?

I'd certainly wouldn't discuss it on MN because I'd consider it grossly insensitive and rather crass to do so.

For me it's about how deep your lack of self awareness would have to be to do that.

It's fine to buy them if you want them. To discuss buying something of that value in the presence of others who won't earn that in a week? Less so.

Ask a sales assistant instead. Or a friend who you know is your economic equal. Asking on MN is asking for the assistance of people who couldn't afford them. The fact you don't recognise that is the crux of why it would bother me.

I think double standards is a red herring, Loonoon. There's no double standard, just different standards. Some people will prioritise food over clothing, and will feed friends above anything else. But if their invitations are never reciprocated, even for a vegetarian pasta meal, then they dry up. Since I had enough to invite people without worrying, I have become very aware of people who only accept invitations.

Retraining for a better paid profession or studying for a degree are very good suggestions for people with no prospects. Yes, it will take time and no, it won't be easy, but it would improve their futures.

What if yoyr nearest college is 40 miles away or nearest uni.is 50 miles away. If you are on minimum wage and already struggling how the hell do.you get there? How do.you afford the books? Take time off work? Yep that will.help no end.

Same with driving lessons - it is a life skill and definitely worth having. My first car cost me very little and changed my life massively.

Yes cos if you are struggling with finances you can easily fund £25 a week for lessons, plus theory and driving test plus a car plus tax and insurance of £1000 for a new driver!
Most people dont have a magic wand. If they could afford all that they wouldnt be struggling would they?

Ffs spectacularly missing what being actually skint means.

I was raised to treat people as equal unless I knew differently. This was more specifically supposed to apply to intellect/cultural awareness (so that you aren't mansplaing or trying to hard and getting out of your depth) but I think some people take this to also mean assuming that someone has the same finacial means. It's always worth querying when a thread implies that there is a good income because a lot of people spend money on stupid things instead of things that will actually help them.

Retraining for a better paid profession or studying for a degree are very good suggestions for people with no prospects.

I have a degree, I'm still in a low-paid, dead end job. My degree has not helped my career one bit.

Someone recently advised me to go and get another degree to help my career. FUCK THAT. It was a complete waste of time and money the first time, I'm not going to repeat my mistake. Degrees are often worthless, especially if you are lacking confidence and self-esteem. Counselling would probably be more profitable for me, but I can't afford that either.