To think that if Girl Guides is for girls, it should allow all girls to be members?

[OrchidInTheSun]

Girl guides have confirmed that if a girl identifies as a boy, they'll kick them out.

So they are no longer a single sex organisation, they are a single gender one.

Mad

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ban-for-girl-guides-who-identify-as-boys-dlj8mjk23

they are clearly now a mixed sex organisation as they are letting boys join. I am sick of the ignorance regarding the difference between sex and gender.

You have been very patient and well mannered swiss

Again the issue is cross arguing.

I understand your position. If you are biologically female you are woman/female.

I do not believe that. I believe you can be biologically female and choose to be gendered male.

You can, in my opinion a biologically male woman.

I defend everyone’s right to a belief whether that be religion or gender driven To be clear, you did mention the two in the same sentence

I don’t think it is linked to biology whilstreligion may not be gender is linked to biology - it is the stereotypical understanding of how each of the sexes is/is allowed or expected to be! Society has quite strong ideas on how men and women can and should behave! If it didn't then being trans would ever have been an issue for anyone!

I shall not be swayed. But that does not invite the debate you say you are here for!

Hmmm rufus. No idea if that is sarcastic or not. But I’ll take the pat on the head.

So, this is how it goes?
There are boys who don't want willies and girls who want willies. A lot of the girls who don't want willies don't want boys who don't want willies in their group because they do have willies. The boys who don't want willies want to be with all girls, regardless of whether the latter want willes or not.
The girls who want willies want to be with the boys who have willies, but some of the boys with willies don't want williless girls in their group.
Has anyone read Seuss "The Sneetches"?
And to think, there are people starving in the world...

It wasnt a pat on the head or sarcastic if that helps

You can, in my opinion a biologically male woman And that is where we will have to leave it.

To me your opinion is, erm, batshit, fruit loopy.

Just as I assume my opinion is, to you, stultified, regressive and nasty!

I live the sneetches

They had stars upon thars

Fact...

Live????

Love!!!!!

Fucking hell!!!

I like it better the first way

They seem to be a single gender organisation and I admire them following through with their beliefs.

As always, it's the apparently liberal left who don't actually like the idea of free speech. hashtag politics.

curious

Just found this...

Interesting.....
In a nutshell basically.

Sex.... sex is the protected characteristic that has been steamrollered!

Gender, as a standalone term, is not a protected characteristic, no matter how often Stonewall and Mermaids etc say it is!

Curious I mentioned the two I’m the same sentence as a response to being told if I was pro one I was against the other.

I will not be swayed by simply being told I am wrong and being expected to solve every issue by myself. I may be swayed by debate (although I suspect I will always maintain my live and let live start
Point so can’t realistically be swayed that far).

I am a feminist and believe women have and continue to be given a raw deal. I agree that there are social stereotypes and that these should be challenged both in terms of male and female traits - it is bullshit.

However, I don’t believe fighting the trans community as a whole is the best way of going about things.

I do believe that gender is idiosyncratic and so if John wants to be forever more known as Joanne I will accept her as a woman and an equal. Not as an other. If Joanne starts acting like a prima Donna I’ll tell her to back it up in the same way I would a biological woman or a man throwing around privilege.

Rufus: In which case I suspect the correct response is thankyou.

Take the whole post curious.

I believe you can be biologically male and gendered female.

We don’t have an agreed position on gender.

That’s the disagreement.

I don’t think your opinion is nasty or regressive curious. I honestly think we are not that far apart.

As you identified the issue is definitions.

Ryan is used as a name for natal females in the USA anyway... Changing your forename and others using the new name doesn't mean they think anything else except your forename has changed...

swiss

You are very welcome

Ryan is a boy's name, too. Have you ever heard of the actor Ryan O'Neal?

Woman it's a boys name with a masculine meaning but gets used for girls sometimes in the USA. It doesn't say "I'm a man" trys not to channel Bros the 80s boy band so much as "my parents were trying to be edgey when they named their daughter"

^ if someone who is patently a woman uses it as her name

I believe you can be biologically male and gendered female.

But being 'gendered female' (whatever that means) doesn't make you a woman if you are a man, and so women's sex based rights should not be changed.

You can believe what you want, it doesn't make it true.