To think a second Brexit referendum will not happen

[abacucat]

I am a remainer, but people campaigning for a second Referendum are wasting their time. It is not going to happen.

But Ethel isn't your view a tad biased as you reside in another country, probably through choice, and your own individual status quo might or could or will become compromised by Brexit? Is it really that you care so much for what happens to the UK (a country you haven't lived in since before the 2016 Referendum) or are you more concerned with what happens to you.

5yearplan can anyone name their MEP. I have six MEPs, they are elected by proportional representation and all or any of them can be directly contacted by me. 2 x UkIP (no I can't name them), Ashley Fox (con) I contacted him once not tempted to again, Julie Girling (another con) seems alright though, Clare Moody (lab), and Molly Scott Cato (green). Where do you live that you only have one?

Perhaps we should hold a referendum to see if there is an appetite for another referendum 😂

Bellinsurge Yes the 1970s were not great, but was that not down to various factors such as the unions having too much power and holding the government to ransom? As for Gordon Brown he sold our gold supplies at cut price and gave the banks too much power and self regulation which lead to the banking crisis in the first place. Iceland didn’t bail out their banks and they recovered faster than us. Gordon Brown is not my iron chancellor.

You don’t get to keep casting the vote until you get what you want. However, all the lies and deceit peddled by the media should not go unpunished. People were MASSIVELY lied to. I’m a remainer and I voted remain, but I can absolutely see why people voted leave with all the lies being peddled at the time

HateIsNotGood I left the UK a year after the referendum because my partner and I decided his country probably had a brighter future than mine and it was unreasonable of me to expect him to move to the UK in the circumstances.

Neweternal you may need to read this en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008%E2%80%932011_Icelandic_financial_crisis Nationalisation, receivership and liquidation are not standard measures of recovery.

Gordon Brown's handling of the banking crisis has nothing to do with the EU. Just like sone difficulties encountered in the 70s were also nothing to do with the EU. Again, I'm wondering what leavers hope leaving the EU will achieve (other tgan unnecessary complications) as most concerns listed here are the result of domestic policies.

Well that's good Ethel - hope it's going well for you in the non-UK country that you and your DP choose to live in. And what happens if a Good Deal for Everybody Brexit is negotiated? Are you planning on returning to the UK?

HateIsNotGood That's a good question. My immediate priority is to get citizenship of his country. I've seen enough stories about non-EU spouses being deported from the UK to know that sometimes even years of marriage aren't good enough for immigration authorities and that the only way to absolutely guarantee that you and your spouse can live in the same country is to share a nationality. I also want to retain my own EU citizenship. So that means I need to stay here for at least five years. Unfortunately that means our future children are likely to be born here which isn't ideal for citizenship purposes as they will only be "British by descent" and so unable to pass British citizenship on to their own children if born outside the UK. I would rather have my children in the UK, but we are living here now for the foreseeable future and I'm not entitled to use the NHS anymore. As for the future, I would like our children to live in the UK for a few years so they have the opportunity to grow up in both their countries and get to know both their cultures. All being well, we would make the move once I have secured citizenship here. For that reason, it is in my interests for Brexit to go well and for the UK to be in a decent enough state so that we could contemplate moving back in, say, five years' time. Unfortunately I think it is very unlikely that the UK will be a good place to move to at that point (unless Brexit is binned in the next six months, which seems vanishingly unlikely). I don't want Brexit to be a disaster. My family and most of my friends are in the UK and I wouldn't wish misery on them just to be proven right. (They largely voted remain anyway so they would be entirely innocent victims of any fallout.) Unfortunately I just don't see any signs that Brexit is going to be anything other than a complete fiasco.

Quietrebel. Im hoping for sovereignty. Don’t shoot me but I won’t miss Romanian beggars, Eastern Europeans here for low paid work topped up with huge tax credits and housing benefits, fudging the figures that they’re contributing, that’s a lie. Then settling here and inviting their elderly parents to stay, therefore using our public services. It happens of course I welcome immigration like an Australian style system. Our seas for fishing back would be good too.

Neweternal you grasp of sovereignty is as weak as your grasp on Icelandic banks.

We have sovereignty and our government is free to tighten up immigration anytime they can be bothered.

The EU makes directives and our sovereign government incorporates them into UK law as it sees fit.

I do know professional Eastern Europeans I have no issue with that. It's the huge amount of unskilled labour that I have an issue with.

I don’t understand the remain argument for a second referendum ...... how can it be that on the hand the referendum should never have been allowed because the public didn’t (due to “lies”) or could (due to lack of information/stupidity) understand what they were voting for BUT on the other is non binding/shouldn’t be actioned because we elect representatives to make these decisions for us. The same people who apparently lied and fed us misinformation??? The Tory party Won an election with manifesto of having a referendum on Europe - it wasn’t a surprise? People voted for that. It wasn’t the worlds greatest secrete that a sizable proportion of conservative (& some labour - most obviously Corbyn) MPs were eurosceptics ..... people knew this. It really shouldn’t have been a shock that the result was in balance. The referendum has to stand ....it wasn’t a single vote. The fact it existed in the first place was voted for when the conservatives got in. The question and how it was asked was put forward ages before it actually happened without any protests etc ....... it is disingenuous to suggest that it was a single vote with no subsidiary agreements/approval that bought it in to being.

Why are you hoping for sovereignty? What positive effect do you think it will have on your life? Genuine question.

It seems like a really dangerous precedent to set, even if the potential outcome is extremely tempting.

The Tory party Won an election with manifesto of having a referendum on Europe - it wasn’t a surprise? People voted for that. Yeah and then they ran another election on a manifesto of Hard Brexit and lost it, but are pretending they won it and still going ahead with it no matter what the cost.

Thank you for your explanation and isn't it good that you have the choice of a non-UK country to live in and also don't have to factor in the existing costs and needs of any existing dc in your 'planning'. I understand that we in the UK are really terrible in regards to childcare costs and towards children generally when compared to our European neighbours so if you plan to have dc maybe you should stay where you are irrespective of Brexit. For some reason MN won't let me write paragraphs! Have you found a job yet? Just you said earlier that some posters must be paid trolls as they can't have dc or jobs as they are on MN so much. You haven't any dc so maybe not a job either? Maybe you are homesick and maybe regret your decision to move and can only blame Brexit for that? So, really a Good Deal Brexit is what you need and everybody else does too. Once you accept that you will find it easier.

Sorry to be thick Ethel but which election did they lose?

The one in 2017, where they had a majority before the election and didn't have one afterwards, Noname99.

EthelThePiratesDaughter, do you honestly believe the Brexit part of the Conservative manifesto was even the leading cause (let alone the only cause) of their having to enter into a coalition government?

HateIsNotGood Not quite sure what you're getting at with that post. Each country is different in its approach to children, families and healthcare (and how it structures and pays for them). Childcare is cheaper here but paid maternity leave is much shorter and most women go back to work when the baby is less than 3 months old, for example. (I guess the EU can't be dictating how each country runs its affairs after all, otherwise everything would be the same across the board. Funny, that.) I have a good job (better than the one I left) and I don't regret my decision to leave at all. It was the right choice for me at the right time. I obviously miss my family and friends, and some other things about the UK (pubs, some shops, the countryside, some food you can't get here), but I have no doubts that my decision was the right one.

Gronky I do! Lots of people started to vote UKIP before the election. Hence why the Tory party hand it in its manifesto.

Gronky or do you mean the coalition with the DUP?

Thank you Gronky - really Ethel, I’m very accepting that you have a completely different view to mine but don’t lets start being absurd. The fact one of the most unpopular govt of all time - having imposed 10 years of austerity and veering more right than Gengis Khan - even had a shot a forming a coalition says far more about state of the opposition (there’s an oxymoron if ever there was one) then any version of Brexit they may have been peddling. Like everyone else tonight, the paragraphing won’t but imagine one here ....... remainders need to try to understand and perhaps believe that leavers are not idiots and voted for what the believed was right (just as remainers did)