Macron's behaviour is despicable

[Snowymountainsalways]

I am a moderate remainer, I say that because I do feel we should respect the vote. I am not a remainer who think a second ref will help. A second ref won't help regardless of the outcome, because the other side will simply demand another one, and another and so it would go on indefinitely and it is utterly futile and pointless.

I had come to the conclusion that a good deal would be the best outcome in the end. However I am just appalled at the behaviour and language coming out of the EU, and particularly Macron.

I am now even thinking what is the point? What is the point in continuing with any 'deal'? They are clearly not remotely interested.

May (for all her faults, and she has many) should gather her dignity and call it a day. We were there in good faith, the chequers plan is not perfect but it was a starting point. I had hoped it would work. It would have offered a solution of sorts.

I have cancelled our holiday next year to France. I don't want to go anywhere so openly hostile, despite the fact we have been holidaying there for my entire living life. I can't support Macron's comments that were both needlessly humiliating and rude to our prime minister.

Thoughts?

Blitheringidiots
No deal is better than a bad deal
Have you read the impact papers of "no deal" ?
Have you noticed that the one on Air Travel has very conspicuously been left till the end ?
Do you really think that being under the control of the WTO will be a good thing ?
The UK will be the only country in the world trading on wholly WTO rules - 480 technocrats in Geneva will control our trade terms

Ta1kinpeace I not sure if anyone knows if A50 can be revoked, I think I read somewhere that a Scottish case is taking it to the ECJ for a ruling, but that could take years

I assume it's the same 'high on emotion, low on reality' rhetoric that seems to be popular amongst a section of brexit voters.

TBH i'm surprised the EU has stuck with the negotiations, we must be so infuriating to deal with.

They're obliged to, so they just send Barnier to meet Davis and Raab every week. Davis never showed up. Raab keeps forgetting his homework, so as every new paper appears on his desk, Barnier just repeats;

Does this proposal give the UK better terms outside of the EU than inside? Does this proposal give the UK better terms than any member country enjoys?

If the answer is 'yes' to either question, he just screws it up into a ball, lobs it in the bin and goes home for the weekend, having offered some words of encouragement to Raab and the Press.

Hesta
The man who wrote it says it can.
I'll believe him to understand it better than most.
www.newstatesman.com/politics/brexit/2017/11/i-wrote-article-50-and-i-know-government-can-reverse-brexit-if-it-wants

I think Theresa May deserves a medal. She has demonstrated a truly astonishing ability to flog a dead horse. She should at least make the Guiness Book of Records for 'longest time clinging on to power despite being utterly useless'.

The EU leaders must have the patience of saints for putting up with the UK's bullshit for so long. I'm surprised that anyone is surprised they finally cracked. I'dve sent her packing a long time ago. Her angry and aggressive statement from Downing Street today is an embarrassment.

He called the Leave Campaign liars. We all know they lied - even leavers know they were lied to. Macron didn’t say anything inaccurate.

I thought Macron was quite polite about it. They did say it would be easy. And that was a lie.

I really cannot get my head around people complaining about the EU doing what they were obviously going to do and what we would have insisted on if it were any country other than us doing the leaving ie. not agreeing to anything that would affect the structure of the EU in its current form.

Genuinely do not understand how this can be portrayed as bullying, I remember discussing this on here before the Referendum. It is just common sense, nothing more and nothing less. I’m starting to doubt my own mind as feeling I must be missing something obvious as Teresa May was earlier today accusing Junker of not explaining things that most of us who have bothered to read up on it already know and I really don’t understand what TM is going on about.

Ta1kinpeace

The only thing keeping my spirits up with this insanity is the common sense being showed by the majority of posters.

PostNotInHaste hear bloody hear. I was scratching my head over that one. Clearly her speech was dashed off very quickly but is she seriously confused over why a cake and eat it deal could be compromising for the single market?

If someone is unhappy in a relationship and it doesn’t work for them, the dignified way to behave is to allow them to go, wish them well whilst reminding them of the commitments that arose during their time together.
Like joint custody of the children etc.

The EU has to take a tough stance with the UK so no other member nations decide they also want out.

I have a home in the Haute Savoie region of France and the locals I know Were glad the UK voted to leave, and are taking in keen interest in how it plays out. They are sick of the beaurocracy and being dictated to by a rich, privileged and isolated few.

The UK are the best service providers in the world. Our legal system is in huge demand across the world. Our pharmaceuticals and medical research is revered, the work we do in technology is setting global standards and our intelligence capabilities are envied. The UK has an educated and healthy population, and our currency is trusted and stable.

This is why the UK can decide to leave the “club”. We attended the party and found it wanting.

Also people saying we neeeed the EU for our economy, we could solve that by sticking our middle finger up to macron and adopting a Monacco/Singapore tax free status.

(Yes i am aware that is a very provocative statement)

Macron was merely speaking the truth, bluntly but TM doesn't seem to listen to softer spoken words.
The EU has been clear on its rules from the start of this process but the current government has just chosen to ignore these for the sake of internal party politics.

Also people saying we neeeed the EU for our economy, we could solve that by sticking our middle finger up to macron and adopting a Monacco/Singapore tax free status.

(Yes i am aware that is a very provocative statement)

No, just a comical one.

Have all those complaining about Macron's rudeness not noticed that various EU bods make digs constantly about cakes and cherry-picking? The rudeness of British politicians is really unprecedented in international negotiations. I used to think it was only Unionist politicians who'd insult everyone on principle, but people like Boris and David Davis are exactly the same - they prefer to play to their home audience than actually work at trying to get a deal.

FrankUnderwoodsWife - how does a tax free economy work for everyone and not a privileged few? I'm not trying to be provocative either but that smacks of something working for big business but not us mere mortals :

www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-singapore-british-economy-new-model-really-bad-idea-a7535226.html

Short term pain

Poverty. Children without enough to eat. Rising prices for essentials and perhaps difficulty getting hold of medicines.

When people articulate the 'short term pain' brexiteers dismiss it as 'fear mongering'. Yet they're happy to allude to it in a blitz spirit sort of way.

But it's not the blitz, where bombs rained down indiscriminately. It's a cruelty that will affect those who are most vulnerable, with no guarantee of it being short term.

Are those poorly informed Brexit supporters aware that the leading lights of Brexit have been quietly transferring funds and opening companies outside Britain (e.g. Dublin) for some time now? Have they considered that the people encouraging them to do this are taking steps to avoid being the ones suffering 'short term pain'?

Hesta54 Your post doesn't make much sense. I was describing the ways in which May has been disrespectful in public.

This is a very sad day indeed as far as I'm concerned.
TM seems determined not to listen to
a) her own MPs
b) the EU (although they are meant to listen to us)
c) the British public (whose will she keeps harping on about protecting- although the general disapproval of her Chequers plan seems not to matter).

I was really disappointed with her speech. I had hoped TM would do the decent thing and either step aside or (better) call a general election.

And btw I've always voted Tory.
Never again.

I'd be happy for Northern Ireland to have different arrangements for goods if it is part of a deal.

That's good of you. Would you be happy to read in the news that innocent people have been killed when loyalists sound off about it?

There will be a deal. The EU just don't want to be seen to be a pushover for when all the other countries start voting to leave

Low tax, low wage economy
It would suit the likes of Jacob R-M
For most of us the loss of public services and workers rights would be devastating.

Anyone who thinks that a Singapore style economy would be good presumably has a laissez-faire attitude towards employment rights. I can't imagine why anyone who is an employee would think that it would be a good idea to be at the mercy of an exploitative boss.