Macron's behaviour is despicable

[Snowymountainsalways]

I am a moderate remainer, I say that because I do feel we should respect the vote. I am not a remainer who think a second ref will help. A second ref won't help regardless of the outcome, because the other side will simply demand another one, and another and so it would go on indefinitely and it is utterly futile and pointless.

I had come to the conclusion that a good deal would be the best outcome in the end. However I am just appalled at the behaviour and language coming out of the EU, and particularly Macron.

I am now even thinking what is the point? What is the point in continuing with any 'deal'? They are clearly not remotely interested.

May (for all her faults, and she has many) should gather her dignity and call it a day. We were there in good faith, the chequers plan is not perfect but it was a starting point. I had hoped it would work. It would have offered a solution of sorts.

I have cancelled our holiday next year to France. I don't want to go anywhere so openly hostile, despite the fact we have been holidaying there for my entire living life. I can't support Macron's comments that were both needlessly humiliating and rude to our prime minister.

Thoughts?

surferjet, aren't you on another thread denying white privilege exists?

So OP, you don't agree that the leave campaign lied and spread deliberate untruths about what would happen after Brexit? The whole thing is a fucking mess, and I truly believe leave would not have won had they needed to stick to the facts.
The UK has been told many many times what the EU's red lines are, but continue to believe that they can keep pushing and the EU27 will just give in. Our government (and most leave voters) are utterly delusional.

May is an ostrich

On the contrary. The EU are flexing their bully muscle to discourage other countries from trying to leave. In the run up to yesterday there was teasing talk of a starting point of a working deal. Yesterday was a deliberate ploy to humiliate, nothing subtle about it. No one seems to be able to come up with a working plan for Ireland which is a major problem. Many are frightened of the difficulties of a no deal but the EU showing bully boy tactics will make hard leavers even more determined. This is a strategic game. The EU will also have difficulties if we run with a no deal. I try to keep my head down over Brexit but By God, MN is way out on one line and very free with the insults.
Hardly a balanced discussion. I think and hope that the UK is in a stronger pace that Greece who were right royally shafted. May was treated appallingly. There might be a better plan in the pipeline, I don't know, but I can only hope that we dont roll over to the beaurocrats and the wealthy. We entered the Common Market late and many things were already decided, like the agricultural policy that largely favoured the French

Like I said, I don’t think you’ve understood how it works.

Could you please elaborate on the great deal that will be lost by the EU?

That is what it looked like to me, tons of white men in black suits with May in the middle being savaged.

It was awful to watch, it has upset me a great deal.

Ultimately I thought they were friends.

Juncker's parting shot was 'no deal - don't worry be happy' was the final straw (I am not sure how many drinks he had sunk by that point)

Calling any country 'liars

I think he called the Leave vote based on lies.
Which is just fact.

Good people who voted leave were just fibbed to.

Is your local hospital swimming in the extra £350m a week?

Darling Nikita
Oh yes they do

I don't know about a general election. I would think a leadership contest looks the most likely.

I am a remainer and have been horrified by the EUs stance - I think the EU member states should consider their treatment of the uk as this is setting a precedence for any future exit of any other state - and there are states that are not entirely happy with the EU as it is.

Of course the EU stand to lose a great deal over this. You are absolutely right Snowy The idea of losing over £8 billion pa from the UK's contribution is terrifying. They are seriously worried other Nations will follow. I am not a huge fan of Macron and I find his attitude very unstatesmanlike.

A hard brexit now looks inevitable.

But they probably thought we were friends, until we had that ridiculous toxic referendum. Why should they now feel friendly towards us?
Arrogance.

And completely agree with SaucyJack. May needs no help from anyone embarrassing herself.

She is, nonetheless, getting it from the Johnston and Davies and Rees-Moggs, and other man-without-a-plan leavers, who have no idea how to make it work either, but are enjoying sitting on the sidelines throwing rocks.

I'm beginning to believe that our best way forward is to say "fuck you, then" to the EU. Leave without a deal and play serious hardball. That's what the EU has been doing, basically saying no and we've been trying not only to appease them but our own electorate on both sides of the debate and getting splinters.

Well said OP. I completely agree with you. This is similar to how Cameron was treated by EU leaders when he attempted to renegotiate our relationship with the EU. He was shown the same arrogance and intransigence May now faces. How could the UK possibly stay when the EU has made it clear it’s disinterested in anything but its own agenda?

No one seems to be able to come up with a working plan for Ireland which is a major problem.

By 'no one' do you mean the rest of the EU should be helping us out with the Ireland issue? If so then that's rubbish. We've decided to leave, we sort it out. May has tied herself and the country into impossible knots by getting into bed with and making herself dependent on the DUP and by insisting on leaving the CU and single market. It's a self-created problem.

Ultimately I thought they were friends. Please. Grow up.

maddening Thank you I am glad there are others that feel the same. I am horrified too. I thought the EU were better than this.

PerkingFaintly
No. I’m saying it does exist. I just don’t know what I can do about it. But I’m mainly talking about women’s experiences as this is a mostly female site.
Male privilege is alive & kicking & always will be. The EU ‘club’ is a prime example.
& it’s ironic that most people moaning about ‘privilege’ are remainers, yet you’re
happy to lick the feet of white powerful men.

Interesting.

horrified by the EUs stance
We'd have won the world cup without those pesky football rules too.

But that's precisely the problem with the UK attitude of Us and Them with the EU when we were meant to be part of it.

The issue is that people are realising how little power we have. The ridiculous patriotic rhetoric has filtered into public consciousness to the point people began to believe that simply be making fanciful demands demands we could have our cake and eat it. That was never going to be the case. We're a minor EU economy that is about to fade into obscurity and we're being treated as such.

A no deal would be absolutely catastrophic for the most vulnerable in the UK. I'm fortunately in that I have the education and finances to simply move to a different country in the event of a massive crash in the UK economy and social care system. I feel desperately sorry for those who don't have that option.