Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Just lost my sh!t! ExDP allowing DD age 7 to play outside unsupervised. AIBU?

300 replies

chickhonhoneybabe · 17/09/2018 23:10

I have lots of background sh!t with DD’s (age 7) DF whom I split with when she was nearly 2 years old. He left me after I just finished chemo and wasn’t in a good place mentally, for his wife who I found out recently he has been married to for 5 years! (He lied when I asked him if he was married a few years a go, and it’s only recently I’ve found out after a friend spoke to his wife and she’d mentioned they’ve been married for 5 years!)

The marriage actually happened whist he was still coming home and playing happy families a year after he moved out of the family home (we were never married). At the time he had moved out and was coming back and forth (we were still sleeping together), as I thought we were working on things as we’d had a tough time with me having chemo and a baby and thought he just needed some time out due to the pressure. Things came to a head one day when he had his things packed which he had at home saying he was going on holiday which I went mental about as I knew nothing about this planned holiday and we’d been discussing going on one as a family. After 2 weeks of his phone being switched off I tracked him down to him saying he was in America. After the holiday he wanted nothing to do with me and I later found out he’d moved his new girlfriend (wife) in to the apartment he’s renting (she’s American so he’d gone out there to marry her I’ve now found out five years after the event...)

Anyway, that’s irrelevant to my AIBU, I just wanted to highlight the man has form for lying and not a trustworthy character.

ExDp lives in an affluent area on a new build estate. My DD (age 7) this evening mentioned that she’d been to the local shop with her friends yesterday (apparently they’re aged 7 and 10), and that her dad lets her play outside unsupervised with them (it’s quite a big estate with lots of cul de sac roads and a play area, and the shop is on a busy main road).

DD is not trustworthy to be left on her own for more than 5 minutes at home before getting up to no good. She absolutely has no stranger danger, she’s in a world of her own most of the time and is easily influenced by others (she’d easily go off with someone even without any form of bribe, and gets up to mischief as she really has no concept of what is acceptable) she’s really not sensible at all. The shop is also next to a main road FFS!

I’ve told the ex that he’s having no future contact with DD as it’s not safe for her to be outside unsupervised but he thinks I’m mad and stopping her from having friends. That’s not what it’s about, I’m worried about her safety! I don’t give a flying fuck if the area is suppose to be nice, there’s weirdos everywhere and at that age she shouldn’t be outside unsupervised.

AIBU? How do I stop him from allowing her outside unsupervised whilst she’s at his house?

(I mentioned where he lives as I think he’s got it into his head because of where he lives she’s ok. But I’ve told him he’s a clueless idiot living in the 1980s)

OP posts:
Teateaandmoretea · 18/09/2018 08:08

On MN, usually no child under the age of 12 needs a mobile phone; now they do at age 7 so they can play out unsupervised? Makes no sense whatsoever. And what will this head in the clouds 7 year old carry her mobile phone in when she’s out playing and being care free? She won’t take it obviously and it’s a PITA.

My 9yo doesn't have a mobile phone as such. I have a really shit one that I bought when mine was being mended that she takes if needed then gives back. She puts it in a bum bag.

Oblomov18 · 18/09/2018 08:09

YABU
Everyone on the thread has literally told you so.

Playing outside in a group, in a safe cul-de-sac could be and should be done pre 7.

If she has no boundaries, then teach her boundaries. Even SN children can be taught 'some' boundaries, using different techniques.

strawberrisc · 18/09/2018 08:09

@CarolDanvers. Her needs weren’t diagnosed then. I was in the “peadophile around every corner” or “stranger danger” mindset and I took her everywhere instead. It’s sad but EVERYONE played out unsupervised in the 80s. There was more of a stigma when DD was little and therefore less kids playing out. Safety in numbers.

Toomanycats99 · 18/09/2018 08:12

My did also age 7 sounds similar. She has dyspraxia and struggles to focus and concentrate. She lives in a world of her own. I would never let her play outside even with a 10 year old. Silly stuff she is also very clumsy so she will walk right by the edge of the kerb and as she trips over her own feet on many occasions she would be in the road. She just doesn't think anything through before she does it. She doesn't mean to do stupid / dangerous things she just doesn't think about what she's doing!

Itsatravesty · 18/09/2018 08:13

I wouldn't be happy in your shoes either OP, and I say that as someone who's child played out from age 7. BUT my child was very sensible, I'd observed him safely crossing roads for 2 years prior to going out alone. We had lots of prep, chats/roleplay about what to do in various scenarios and our street was full of his friends and I knew all their parents. He had physical boundaries of where he was allowed to go (shouting distance basically) and had to pop his head in the door every 30 minutes plus other rules like telling me if he was going into a friends etc. Your dd doesn't sound ready imo. Teaching independence is a very gradual process, you can't just chuck them out and hope for the best!

EK36 · 18/09/2018 08:18

I think it's okay. I feel like because you have been through so much that maybe asking your gp for counselling might be a good idea. Just to work through your feelings as they could be affecting your judgment.

ItWasntMeItWasIm · 18/09/2018 08:19

Well done OP for listening to posters and coming up with a plan.

IsabellaMoltisantixx · 18/09/2018 08:22

@chickhonhoneybabe

EEEEEH MY GOD!!! I can't believe some of the women on here!!! It's not the 70s or the 80s where it was common for kids to be playing outside for hours on end, times have changed. Look up the statistics, more burglaries, low level crime, attempted abductions
Just the third week in a row we've received another letter from dds school stating for parents to be wary as vans have been sighted trying to coax children in! I'm sorry but that's the reality of the 21st century atm
I'm in my local Facebook page n it's rife with gangs stealing phones, mugging etc and my area is classed as a AFFLUENT area , actually voted one of the best places to live in my city
I understand that it's outside his house but for women on here to come out and say kids should be playing out at 7 years old etc is just shocking!!

And the OP isn't being unreasonable at all by stating her worries, god ur damned if u do or don't these days, when my dd used to go to her dads I'd be on tenderhooks, he's well known for being quite carefree n would ignore her going on his phone speaking to women so I think it's damn right that op mentioned his history, for someone that had cheated period never mind someone who's cheated on you at an extremely vulnerable time in my eyes is someone that can't be trusted.

I fought absolute hell, tooth n nail to make sure he was following routines as he was just very casual when it came to parenting, he was used to me doing he majority when we were together so when we split, he must have realised how much I actually did n couldn't be assed

Th op is getting a horrible time in here, when all she cares about is her daughter! My advice to you op is bring it up n don't let it drop
Sounds to me he is just letting her play out so enjoying his ow not having to entertain! How often does she go to his? In that time, the dads needs quality time with their dd not just leaving them out to play, it's a whole change of life for them having to see one parent occasionally.

nellieellie · 18/09/2018 08:25

Well, Im gobsmacked. No, YANBU. You know your child. You know how she may react to stuff and what she’s ready for. Neither of my DCs would have been ready for this at 7. Going to shops on main roads, wandering around a number of streets. Just no way. If it was play on one cul de sac, then fine. I’m not sure about how best to deal with this, but I would really not be happy.

ArcheryAnnie · 18/09/2018 08:31

I'm going to buck the trend on this thread and say YANBU, OP. I think if you are letting your 7 year old out in a controlled environment, with friends, and you are keeping a constant eye out, that's one thing. An untrustworthy ex who you can't trust to keep an eye out is another.

Some kids do walk to school at this age, it's true - but only some of them, and again, there's a time limit, and if they didn't arrive at school, you'd know. Just around the estate when there isn't a time limit is a problem.

And whoever said it was Ok because they were with a 10 year old friend "nearly secondary age" - ffs. You cannot absolve responsibility onto another random child, so I don't see what that has to do with it.

Also people on this thread describing you as "angry", well, I don't see being angry with a feckless ex is unreasonable, really.

rainingcatsanddog · 18/09/2018 08:38

On MN, usually no child under the age of 12 needs a mobile phone; now they do at age 7 so they can play out unsupervised? Makes no sense whatsoever.

When I mentioned a phone I don't mean one that is in her possession permanently like a teens. If she doesn't know her way around her Dad's area, it might be good to have a simple PAYG for emergencies. My 3 kids (older) have gone to the shops together and there have been times when an argument has occurred and they came home separately. Would the dd know who to ask for directions? Would she know to decline a lift from a stranger?

I'm in an area where 7 year olds go out to play out of sight of parents. They seem to carry around simple mobiles just in case.

chickhonhoneybabe · 18/09/2018 08:44

It’s horribble co parenting, my preference is for her to be supervised whilst outside playing but unfortunately there’s not much I can do whilst she’s at her dads. So I’ll have to keep taking to her about keeping safe.

Re the mobile phone, i’d prefer her not to have one but a cheap pay as you go might give me some peace of mind that she can be contacted and use it in an emergency

OP posts:
chickhonhoneybabe · 18/09/2018 08:45

I don’t mind being called angry, I agee I was. The man makes me angry but I try not to rise to it the majority of the time.

OP posts:
PARunnerGirl · 18/09/2018 08:48

I think YABU. It’s important to teach our children independence, the ability to sort things out for themselves, confidence and social skills such as persuasion, empathy and so on. This starts, in my opinion, with allowing unsupervised play sessions where the child knows where an adult is, should they need one. The age is of course not set; 7 years old sounds about right to me.

This has definitely been lost as more children have almost 100% of their time supervised and guided by adults. I don’t think they learn these skills properly as they don’t have a chance to try, fail and try again. An adult sorts disagreements, tells them what to say or do, where to be, how to react etc.

This manifests itself in ways that are quite stressful when the young adults leave school/ college/ university and begin to work. I hire young adults and can see an increasing trend of them requiring more and more guidance, having less confidence in their “gut feeling” and struggling to deal with office politics or people in general! Of course this is not EVERY young adult I hire, but an increasing percentage seem to be often looking over their shoulder for the “grown up” to tell them what to do or guide them in situations where I believe they should have the social skills to know what to do, or the social confidence to do what they think might be right.

I’m not saying going to the shops at age 7 solves this, but I think less supervised time and more time to build social and inter-personal skills as a child is becoming more and more important.

Badhairday1001 · 18/09/2018 08:54

My 7 year old plays out with her friends. I just reinforce the rules and keep on checking on her. I think YABU. Giving up control is really hard but he is her other parent and hopefully loves her as much as you do.

NiamhNaomh · 18/09/2018 08:56

Good post PARunner. I am a guide leader and I have noticed the basic life skills that most of our girls are lacking as they approach 14 that were absolutely taken for granted in previous generations. I include my own dds in that. It is a curtyral thing with this generation that we step in far more as adults than previous generations and in my opinion often than we should. While I think 7 is very young and I can see why the OP would absolutely have concerns I think ultimately her daughter will benefit from these learning opportunities afforded to her by playing out.

LittleLionMansMummy · 18/09/2018 08:57

Op, well done for trying to take on board some of the advice here, I know it must be very hard to get over what a shit he's been to you. And fwiw your dd does sound like a 'young' 7 yo, so I understand where you're coming from.

As far as child safety is concerned, it's worth remembering that we can't expect our dc to behave in a way that is alien to them as they just won't be able to do it if they ever need to.

Social norms are that you're not rude to people, you speak when spoken to, under no circumstances must you hit, kick, pinch or bite and we teach our dc this from birth.

So, we haven't taught our ds to be scared of strangers, or not to talk to them. We've given him scenarios and asked him what he might do in certain situations. We've said that the vast majority of people are good and that most adults like children and like to pass the time of day with them and are not to be feared.

The absolute 'no go' line is that he, under no circumstances, goes anywhere, with anyone (either known or unknown), without asking us first so that we know exactly where he is, or we'll worry if we can't find him. He finds it easier to comprehend that he could say to someone, politely "let me ask my mum/ Dad first" rather than shout "No, go away!" (Who says this in RL?)

We've explained that if he's ever playing on the green nearby and a car pulls up and asks him to approach, he stays exactly where he is and says "I'll stay here, thank you." But he also knows it's unlikely that anyone with good intentions will stop a car and speak to a child, so he should make his way home, with a friend, to tell us.

He knows he never goes anywhere alone, only ever with someone else. He knows he can play in our cul de sac or on the green and that he goes no further. While he's socially very aware, he's not quite ready to cross busy roads (his judgement of speed and distance is not quite there), but that will be the next step.

He has a watch so he knows what "15 more minutes" is and he uses it when we go camping.

And most importantly, he knows that if he's ever grabbed by one of the very few bad people out there, it is perfectly ok for him to break the rules we've instilled in him - he can kick, punch, bite, pinch as hard as he possibly can, and he must also shout "I don't know you/ you're not my dad!" So that other good people nearby know he's not just misbehaving and will intervene.

We've also spoken openly about 'good' secrets (birthday parties) and 'bad secrets' (anything that makes him feel bad), inappropriate touching and that he should never, ever, be expected to keep a secret by any adult (including us). There is nothing he cannot/ should not tell us.

He's totally comfortable with all of this. He would not be happy to break society's norms and expectations around children's behaviour without our express permission or suggestions around how to deal, within his comfort zone, with different situations. We still give him scenarios to make sure he's not forgotten and have conversations about trust, who his trusted adults are and that knowing someone a little does not mean he can trust them in the way he would trust dh and I.

Small steps for your dd I think - too much freedom at once could expose her naivete and perhaps you could start a conversation with your ex along those lines. Agree together (if you can) some clear initial boundaries. And if you're not comfortable with something you're entitled to feel that way and voice those concerns constructively. Coparenting is indeed hard, and even when parents live together you have differences of opinion in how to deal with dc. It's very hard to let go when they're visiting the other parent and are out of sight.

Good luck op. Flowers

Gingerivy · 18/09/2018 08:57

If she has no boundaries, then teach her boundaries. Even SN children can be taught 'some' boundaries, using different techniques.

A bit of a blanket statement. Every child is different. Mine are 9 and 12 and cannot play out unsupervised due to their SNs. We do get together regularly with their friends and play at various safe settings, but playing out unsupervised is simply not on the cards right now. My dd (who has no SNs) was perfectly fine playing out at age 7yo.

Oblomov18 · 18/09/2018 09:08

Ginger, it's not a blanket, and I deliberately used the word 'some' highlighted.
Boundaries are very hard to grasp for SN children, but for most, with some persistence, and different techniques, you can teach a bit: 1%, 2%, 5%, 10%, 20%, building it up, bit by bit.
Or at least you have to try.
We all have to try. It's our parental duty. To at least say we've tried.

Oblomov18 · 18/09/2018 09:13

I completely disagree with Isabella, re children shouldn't be playing out because there is more danger, band driving around in affluent areas.

I agree with PARunner that we are failing this current generation by not allowing them the gradual boundaries and independence that were afforded them in previous generations. Now they constantly look to a parent/other for a confirmation because they haven't been used to that independence of failing, in their own.

I see this as an issue.

BitchQueen90 · 18/09/2018 09:14

I wouldn't let my DS play outside on his own at age 7. Definitely not safe to do so where I live.

Gingerivy · 18/09/2018 09:17

My children with SN have been taught "some" boundaries, but they still are unable to retain or put into play the boundaries that will keep them safe when playing out. So therefore they do not.

I'll ignore the "parental duty" comment as I think you know that "some" parents of children with SN get that "parental duty" and other parenting comments thrown at them on a regular basis - by professionals, by relatives, by other parents - and frankly it just induces nothing but annoyance in me at this point.

RB68 · 18/09/2018 09:18

Every child is different as is every area - I think there is alot of fearmongering that every adult not with a child is a paedo and frankly there is alot of ridculous scaremongering. Life is not risk free - yes we try and reduce risk but honestly blocking a 7 yr old from walking to the shop in a group with older kids and from playing out ... craziness.

Part of the appeal of living on a newer estate with lots of families is friends to play with. I would just be annoyed he didn't consult me and also want to know he put limits on it e.g. an hr and they check back in or if its a trip to shop - there and back straight away and he checks for her outside in that timeframe she is due back. I know there is risk but kids have to learn somehow.

Racecardriver · 18/09/2018 09:18

I would never leave a seven year old on the street even if they were with a ten year old. What a stupid thing to do. I saw this all the time in the area I used to live (also a new build estate) and it was dangerous. This children were perfectly happy to talk with strangers, they frequently ran out onto the road with checking properly first (I used avoid driving through because of this). And so on. Re it being a nice area: firstly it can't be that nice if it has parents who let children 'play out' and secondly that doesn't make it safe (in the city that I grew up in the nicest part of town had a serial rapist who would travel from his own less affluent suburb to thus very Naice suburb just to grab women in the dark and rape them, it took the four years to catch the bastard). Obviously you will have a lot if people moaning at you about how in the good old days they would stay out alone all day until the street lights went on but the truth is that in the good old days parents just weren't that careful with their children. It's not reasonable to allow such a young child to roam around on their own. If sonething happened to her it would take him hours to notice.

ItWasntMeItWasIm · 18/09/2018 09:24

Re it being a nice area: firstly it can't be that nice if it has parents who let children 'play out'

😂😂

Swipe left for the next trending thread