To be appalled at how most couples share childcare of a newborn?

[lmcc13]

I’m in a same-sex couple with my wife, together for 7 years and married for 2. We were delighted to add to our family four weeks ago when my wife gave birth to our beautiful baby boy. Becoming a parent, I’ve noticed lots of people (friends, colleagues and strangers) sharing anectdotes about their own parenting experiences. The thing that has shocked me most is how unequally caring for a newborn seems to be shared between the couple. We don’t have any other gay parent friends, so I don’t know if this is different in same-sex partnerships, but amongst straight couples it still seems the norm for the stay at home parent (exclusively mums in our social circle) to do the lion’s share of the work; during the day, in the evening and at night. I keep hearing “well of course if she’s breastfeeding, there’s not much you can do to help” and “well, I have to get up and go to work in the morning”. I find both comments infuriating! My wife is exclusively breastfeeding, and I am now back at work, but the list of things I can contribute towards raising our son is long. I clean and tidy the house, get shopping in, load and unload the dishwasher, change 95% of the nappies when I’m home (including all the night nappy changes), sterilise the breast pump when she expresses...etc etc. I’m up in the night every time the baby cries to change the baby, help my wife into the feeding chair, then later burp the baby and settle him back into his cot. And, like most of our friends and colleagues, I have an office job - I might be tired and incoherent at work occasionally during the day, but I’m not solely responsible for a human life! Unless the working parent drives, operates machinery or cares for others (nurses, teachers etc.) I refuse to believe that they can’t share in the exhaustion too. Very long rant, sorry! I think I’m just a very disappointed feminist to realise that parenthood seemingly transports many women back to be 1950’s. Why are women allowing this to happen, and why aren’t men stepping up more?

It is a generalisation to say that straight couples usually stick to gendered roles, but from seeing my fellow parent friends, it does seem to be the case. We (a straight couple), are the only ones I know who have alternated nights/man has done a significant proportion of night work, even though the majority are bottle feeding, and back at work.

Agree with you OP. I hope my (male) partner shows up the way you do if / when we have a baby. Sure, everyone is different and personal preference plays into it, but I for one find that a lot of convenient excuses are found why men can't or shouldn't be more involved. Short changes them as well, imo.

@Iamagreyhoundhearmeroar

Only one gave birth; only one can breastfeed.

I am afraid you are very mistaken there. Any woman who has never been pregnant, whether same sex partner, adoption or surrogacy can by medical marvel induce lactation through a lot of hard work and preparation and completely EBF in some cases.

I think the OP might have a point - it's not that women can't do night wakings without help, it's more that it sets the pattern that the woman is the default parent and can just manage that continues as the child grows up. You see it in the posts where men expect to keep up their hobbies at the same level of commitment as before and basically have their lives completely unchanged by parenthood. You see it in the posts about women doing 100% of the nursery runs, even after they've returned to work.

Many men (even nice ones!) need regular reminders that they're expected to pull their weight. DH is lovely, but he's domestically lazy, and doesn't tend to prioritise house/family work. We're working on it, and it's hardly LTB-worthy, but it's a fact that a true 50/50 household isn't the reality for many families. I don't think the OP is BU for pointing this out, and I think the reaction here has been a bit harsh.

I might be tired and incoherent at work occasionally during the day

Well, OP, good job you have an office job. Some people have to go and operate heavy machinery, drive an HGV (or any vehicle, come to that), perform an operation, interpret results... or even stand up in front of a class and teach - maybe your future child. So don't complain when your dc comes home and says Mr Brown/Mrs Jones was sleeping in the classroom. Maybe they've been helping their partner into a chair half the night.

but it's a fact that a true 50/50 household isn't the reality for many families

Yes but that's not necessarily a bad thing. Working inside the home and outside the home - both equally important. Both parents don't need to both as long as both get done!

Oh and OP - ditch the feeding chair. Encourage your wife to learn to feed lying down on her side if possible - that's what I did and I barely woke up after latching dd on.

I think what I find grating is the insistence that parenting has to be split 50/50 in all tasks for it to be equitable. And the assumption that not waking up to assist with breastfeeding is therefore a failing.

My DP didn't wake up for night feeds once he was back at work, unless I needed help (explosive nappy, vomiting, etc). He did do many many other things to compensate for that. I don't think that's unequal. I co slept and fed lying down, so I'm not sure what exactly he should have been doing.

If the male half of a traditional couple had started this thread to tell us all how it should be done - he’d be wearing his own bollocks for earrings.
I don’t think op has been given a particularly hard time .
I also think it’s significant that she just lit the touch paper and scarpered...

DH did all the cleaning as well as his usual cooking and food shopping responsibility. I did all night wakings when DD was EBF but he would come and sit with us while she fed in the evenings before bed. Once she was weaned he did nights at weekends and now tends to do any mornings he's here and overnight wakings as he says it's fair as I did more early on. I think you have to be practical about how the 50/50 works if one of you is getting up early and commuting etc.

It's ridiculous both of you being up at night. What is the point of that? I used to do the night feeds because my husband had a very demanding job that required him to be on top form, working very long hours. I stayed at home with the children for some time. I was able to sleep during the day or rest at least for periods, he couldn't. He did get up in the night for one of our children who didn't settle well. He was pacing the floor with him till late at night whilst i slept.

My husband shared in the nappies and helped with housework when he was home. It isn't reasonable to expect the working partner to get up in the night as well if the other is staying at home in my view.

but it's a fact that a true 50/50 household isn't the reality for many families

Depends on how you look at it. Some couples would say that one person working outside the home and earning money, and one working inside the home taking care of a baby WAS a 50/50 household. And if that works for them, who is anyone else to judge?

That is the relevant point. Are there women who feel like they have too much responsibility, or don't get enough help or support or parenting sharing? Yes, of course. Do all women feel like that because they don't have someone elses particular set up, that they have decided is best? No, of course not.

Do what works for you. If its not working, change it. But don't listen to gobshites who tell you that you're doing it wrong. The last thing most women need is yet one more person telling them how they are doing it wrong

@Iam I think it's because she didn't get the replies she wanted, she was either after pouring a of wow your amazing, or yeah I wish my partner was more like you. Instead she got told to wind her neck in.

I genuinely hope the anonymity of the internet gave her, her brass neck, because otherwise parenting is going to be a tough and trickier path than it needs to be with such a glorified sense of self importance.

You are right, women often end up doing most of it. My sister and husband were great- she was breastfeeding so he did all the nappies, without exception. When she was not feeding anymore they shared the work. My friends would take turns staying with the baby downstairs so the other could get sleep etc. Have to say that many women won't let the guy get involved. My mother was scandalised that my sister let her husband take care of the kid. Cos men are useless, don't you know.

I am all for equal parenting and overall I would say DH does more than me around the house and with the DC on weekdays.

However, I do think both waking for every night feed is taking it too far, at least past the first week or two when you are still working things out. I dont think it would have gained me much sleep if DH had done this and i found it important to help the DC recognise the difference between night and day, meaning keeping night feeding as low key as possible, and i think two people fussing around make that harder.

What I found helpful was DH doing the last feed at night (expressed milk from a bottle) so I could go to bed earlier and also taking over first thing in the monring to allow me to sleep later (his work start time was 9.30 which helped!). Obviosuly there were some nights when DC took longer to settle or were ill when DH would pitch in.

I also think with bottle feeding where there is more fuss involved, it is fair enough for the other parent to do a night feed (or two, depending on number of awakenings) but again not both at once!

I think it is different when one person is on maternity leave (or indeed now shared parental leave). Once I went back to work (by whch time DC were no longer breast fed) then any night wakings were alternated, which I think is as it should be, although that means taking it in turns not both waking!

So overall although I agree with your general point that both parents need to step up and do their share, i think your example of night feeds is a poor one and is duplication of effort rather than sharing. I can understnad, though, that the parent not on maternity leave/breast feeding can feel left out during those early months so i can see why you are doing this. Hopefully you will take shared parental leave and your time will come to spend more time with the baby. I think that is a great development and I hope more and more people take this up.

Agree with the others saying OP might be seeking validation because she's not the baby's mum. But it obviously works for her relationship because after 4 weeks, she's experienced enough to tell us all that real parents are doing it wrong. Nice one OP.

Geez people have been awful in this thread, can't help but think there's a bit of jealousy behind many a barbed comment.

Quite different responses too from this other thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3342147-AIBU-DH-needs-8-hours-sleep-2-week-old-baby?pg=1&order=

Where multiple people listed the things her partner could get up and do to help with the night feeds even though she was breast feeding and he was working.

You sound absolutely lovely! I think many couples are still stuck in the dark ages of a SAHM mum's role being running the home, organising all household things and doing all the night feeds.

My DH helped a bit but I would have loved more support. He couldn't help much in the night as he had long commutes and a pressured job. Not performing well at work would have meant reduced chances of promotion and bonus, which would have affected our income and lifestyle. So we decided he would focus on work and I would focus on the baby and domestic things.

Next time I'll enlist more family help and maybe a part time nanny!

There is nothing wrong with gendered roles if it suits the couple in question.
Well, except that it teaches their children it's the only way to be, and makes any fathers around them who actually, you know, do their job as fathers appear like saints, and the total wastes of space who don't do any fathering appear normal.
So yeah, there is quite a lot wrong with gendered roles.

You are being almost comically sanctimonious. Yawn. " Look at ME, aren't I GREAT ! " No, you are nuthin' special. No, for the record most parents don't live in the 1950s, though most are bright enough to realise there is no point BOTH being awake to do a one person job.

Well I’ve bf both my babies and my DH hasn’t often got up in the night when they were newborns. What’s the point of us both being tired when there’s no need? As for the mornings, DH had/has to get up, shower, get dressed, make his own lunch, prepare for work etc and often leave the house at 7.30am. Being on maternity leave I don’t have to do those things. I don’t express so there’s nothing to sterilise. I bf in bed so don’t need helping into a chair, and when they were newborns I used to bring my snacks and drinks up to bed so didn’t need to fetch them in the middle of the night.

Plus when DS2 was born and DH was on paternity leave he would always get up with DS1 early, so even less reason for him to get up in the night.

You say you’re incoherent at work due to tiredness, hopefully any reasonable boss will understand you not firing on all cylinders in the early days but people have been given warnings for much less. I don’t know why being in an “office job” means anything - my office job requires a lot of concentration and attention.

I’ll probably get flamed for saying this, but... having babies and kids is hard, but some people like to make it even harder for themselves!

For me part of the deal of having a lovely year off was the night wakings. We had a deal that my husband did stuff once he returned from work until 11pm on week days and I did the things later on. He then did Friday or Saturday nights so I’d have a break. If we’d have done shared parental leave we’d have done the reverse. The person working needs to be able to function. I spent a lot of time on the sofa or in cafes or baby classes. Not really the same level of stress. As long as I was safe to drive, it didn’t really matter if I was dazed or confused. It did matter (a lot!) that my husband could perform at work and not get himself fired.

I'd be interested to hear your criticisms of how other couples split the workload when you've been a parent for longer than 4 weeks.

it's mildly entertaining watching all the straight women get on the defensive. Really? I wasn't being defensive, I was stating actual fact. I fail to see how being truthful and stating fact is defensive?@LauraMipsum