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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To want an apology from my cheating SIL?

174 replies

GoEasyOnMe · 30/08/2018 11:46

I’m going to try and keep the details as brief as possible as this has a long history...

DB and SIL been married c10 years with 2 DC 9 and 7. I have always struggled to understand their relationship as I don’t believe she pulls her weight and from I see, openly speaks unkindly to my DB. My parents supported them and gave them substantial deposit for house, set SIL with job and have generally been at their beck and call. SIL never shown gratitude. DB takes all financial burden and does all housework (I’m not kidding, dishes, hoovering, bathroom, dusting etc) but mainly as he has slight ocd. SIL almost every weekend would spend one full day out with friends shopping or catching up with girlfriends. Often would be out overnight at short notice. I want to be clear here...I absolutely think she has the right to have down time and nights out but the balance is very wrong and DB left holding kiddies.

18 months ago, my DB found out she had been cheating. Not once but over a period of years and with different men. She also rung up debts as had a gambling addiction he wasn’t aware of. She moved out and they kept civil for kids while he pretty much had a mental breakdown. He went into therapy and took a real hard look at how they ended up there.

SIL also laid bare everything and admitted she hadn’t liked herself for a long time (terrible relationship with her own DP) and wanted to face her demons. She also went into therapy on her own...and they did couples therapy.

Meanwhile, myself, DH and DP picked up the pieces with DC.s as best we could and supported DB. It has been a traumatic period for us all!

After the counselling and a lot of work, they have decided to make a go of it. This thread isn’t about his decision...I don’t understand it but have to support his choice. And in fairness, SIL does seem to have had a wake up call and done a lot of changing.

However, as a couple, they now seem to expect everyone to pick up where we left off. It’s my Aunts 60th in November and the first time we will be seeing her since it all happened. I have asked DB if we can have a chat with her beforehand and perhaps clear the air. I’m not talking all at once but feel she should sit with my parents and then myself and talk through it all. My DP have seen her since through childcare but the conversation has wholly revolved around kids, errands and schedules etc.

I don’t want to rake over the whole affair but I do think myself and DP are owed an apology at least and perhaps commitment that things will be different from now on. My DB disagrees and says he was the hurt party and he’s forgiven her so that should be the end of it. It’s not a matter of needing our forgiveness (we respect my DB and will support him whatever), it’s more that we were hurt, we were also let down and we had to put our lives on hold to support him...therefore she owes us an apology too.

AIBU at this event to be civil to her but not fully engage until we get a 121 conversation with an apology and a promise of things change?

If you’ve made it this far, thank you!

OP posts:
shallichangemyname · 30/08/2018 12:21

If she is making an effort to change and face her demons you need to support that, hard as it is.
I think if you do what DB wants and welcome her back and spend time with her a "clearing the air" conversation may naturally evolve.
I do understand how you feel and you have expressed yourself well and in compelling terms. However, bottom line is it's their decision and you need to support your DB.

mirialis · 30/08/2018 12:22

As someone who has been in a similar position to you, your feelings are understandable... but unreasonable. Totally agree with Sheldon. You and your parents took on all the extra strain that you did because you love your brother and his DC. You did not do it to help her.

The best way to continue to support them is not to have a showdown with their wife and mother and cause a huge family rift. You'll never forget what she did, but give her a chance to have a fresh start - if you don't your DB will really resent it if things go badly between them again and he hears "your family made me feel x, y, z" etc. And if things go well, you will be glad you didn't say all the things you really want to say to her right now. Do the whole "write an angry letter", get it off your chest... then tear up the letter without sending and move on.

serbska · 30/08/2018 12:23

I mean, obviously you don;t have to go out on the town with her one on one any more. Your bro is being U to expect that.

Clairetree1 · 30/08/2018 12:23

I have asked DB if we can have a chat with her beforehand and perhaps clear the air. I’m not talking all at once but feel she should sit with my parents and then myself and talk through it all

absolutely not, no.

I haven't read the thread, just the first post, but my response to this is that you feel you have the right to stick your oar in to a situation that has nothing what so ever to do with you.

SIL owes you nothing at all, you have absolutely no right at all to expect or demand anything of her.

therefore she owes us an apology too

no, she owes you nothing at all, and it is very weird and hostile that you expect this.

You 're whole attitude to her is that you feel you are far superior, and you are very judgy, and that is really not going to help their relationship at all,

H1dingInSight · 30/08/2018 12:23

I couldn’t do couples’ nights out or one-to-one time with her under the circumstances either, and it’s unreasonable of your DB to expect that. Maybe in time.

HermioneGoesBackHome · 30/08/2018 12:24

I dont think she owes you an apology. She didn’t cheat on you but on your DB.

But a big thank you from her and your DB about all the help your gave THEM with the dcs wouldn’t go amiss.

What your DB can’t ask for is to pick up everything as if nothing had happened. Surely, having had some counselling himself, he shouod know that to be able, to work, things MUST have changed and therefore can’t be ‘just like before’. Both on her side and his side.
He also can’t force you to forgive even if he has forgiven her. Nor can he expect you to not feel hurt by her behaviour (even if she didn’t hurt you directly iyswim)

category12 · 30/08/2018 12:25

It's not about you. YABU. By making it about getting your pound of flesh, you drive a wedge between you and your brother, because his marriage doesn't need the stress of difficult family on top and he's made his choice.

You just have to be nice and normal. You accept that she's making changes, so keep your own counsel. It's not about you.

Squamish · 30/08/2018 12:26

I am not sure it is you that needs an apology? It is between your brother and SIL?

Sparklyfee · 30/08/2018 12:26

YABU. I think that must be obvious now

BlueSky198080 · 30/08/2018 12:29

She owes you nothing, you are being unreasonable. This is between them. If he wishes to make another go of things, then your job is to support that decision. In supporting that decision, then you should try and build your relationship again with her. This may not be what you want, but if you want to support your brother then it’s what you need to do.

Will it work out? Who knows. Some couples are stronger after issues like this. For other couples it’s like sticking a plaster over the cracks, that will always be there and eventually it will all crack again.

MiggledyHiggins · 30/08/2018 12:29

So, flip this and consider this from her pov.

You and DH are having marriage difficulties. You move out for a time while you both work though it in counselling. DH leans heavily on his family during this time - but to what extent, you are fairly unaware of.

You reconcile and would like to get back to normal. But the IL's aren't really friendly to you now and now DH's SiL wants you to sit down with her to apologise for... well... something... and to lay bare some details of your marriage split to her by way of explanation.

Still sound ok to you OP?

LilQueenie · 30/08/2018 12:30

yabu and sound like a busybody. sorry.

DolorestheNewt · 30/08/2018 12:30

I don't think I can just switch back on the relationship we once had

Don't try to. Reinvention all round is what's needed. Just try not to bear a grudge (not that I'm saying you would!) and give it time. Your relationship with yr DB needs to come thru unscathed, that's a priority, and my guess is that's most likely to happen if you put this behind you to the best of your ability, and bite your tongue when it's hard! Good luck, OP

RB68 · 30/08/2018 12:33

I don't think you have a leg to stand on - she might in time apologise you had to pick up with kids etc but nothing more - its their own private business and whilst it impacted you it really is none of your business and you have to deal with that and the impact it has on the way you treat her - she can't expect it to be the same but that is just how it is. Forcing her into a hair shirt won't work for building the future and puts extra pressure on your brother

rainbowlou · 30/08/2018 12:33

My bil had an affair, when he got back together with my sil he sent everyone in the family the most cringeworthy, forced, pages long text apologising for his behaviour.
I think that text made it more awkward when we all met up at a family occasion because it was so embarrassing!
None of us wanted to get involved, it was their marriage and she knew we all had her back, were there if she needed us but ultimately none of our business.

Original poster
GoEasyOnMe · 30/08/2018 12:33

Thanks again-I did update to say, having read the replies I agree this does seem like a bad idea.

I guess I'm now just struggling with how to approach my DB about his expectations. I totally get that he wants to reintroduce couples night and for me to take her out again and I do agree with the poster who said it would be a good way of slowly getting back to some level or normalcy.

I'm just honestly not sure how that would go? The last time I saw her she was screaming at him telling him he was boring and driven her to other men...now we're all meant to sit as a foursome at pizza express and talk about the GBBO? I need to find a way of not making him feel that I'm shunning her but getting used to her being around again without wanting to throttle her! I know I need to make an effort and completely accept that but he's suggested next weekend for a girlie shopping visit... I'm just not comfortable

The other thing playing in the back of my mind is my DB has asked my parents to lend them the money to pay off her gambling debts (£000's). They feel uncomfortable doing this as want them to work through some of these financial issues together and they can afford to pay off themselves over time but DPs don't want to appear unsupportive. I guess this is also affecting my attitude

I'm just finding it difficult to think about being friendly with her again but realise this is what my DB needs

OP posts:
LyndorCake · 30/08/2018 12:35

I think I would tell DB that while you fully accept that he is the hurt party in all of this and has chosen to forgive her, whether intended or not, she has damaged the relationship with you. Now this does not mean that she owes you anything, you also can't be expected to go straight back to how it used to be straight away. I believe a couple's night out seems to be exactly what is needed tbh. If they have been working on themselves and their relationship, she may feel the need to speak with you without prompting. Which is her choice.

rainbowlou · 30/08/2018 12:38

I do know how you feel, the first time we all met up afterwards was a whole family occasion and I did wonder how I’d be able to be nice to him.
We aren’t as close as we all were admittedly, but I think that’s to be expected.
There’s embarrassment and awkwardness from all sides with that huge elephant in the room!

category12 · 30/08/2018 12:39

I think that that's pushing it a bit on his side. I wouldn't agree to girly shopping days or 1-2-1 anythings. And rather than a foursome, perhaps ask another couple of couples, or more family, for the pizza night?

I'd be unhappy about the in-laws paying off the debt, but it's up to them, so I'd step back from that.

You all seem very involved with each other. Perhaps a widening of the social network is in order.

Original poster
GoEasyOnMe · 30/08/2018 12:41

@rainbowlou I can see that's where we'll end up! I can cope with family occasions and understand that's something that'll happen. It's the expectation of 121 friendship being switched back on that I struggle with.

I hope things improve as best they can for your family

OP posts:
Original poster
GoEasyOnMe · 30/08/2018 12:45

@category12 A few other couples is a good idea! Takes the focus off her so much so she doesn't feel in the spotlight and also allows me to sit back from direct conversation if I need too.

I've totally left it up to my DPs how to tackle the ask of money and haven't (and won't) bring it up with my DB. It's their choice but it does annoy me tbh

We are a close family but do socialise outside too! I just feel sorry for my DB as some of their couple friends have backed away from them since it all happened as they just can't forgive her behaviour (she pulled friends into some of her lies and really caused problems for some of them). So I feel bad that myself and DH are one of their only 'couple' friends they still have.

But I will try and think of others to invite out and make it into a bigger group-good idea

OP posts:
Maelstrop · 30/08/2018 12:45

I don’t think you need an apology. What was done was to your brother, not you. Their relationship is nothing to do with you. I can understand why you no longer want to go out one on one with her, absolutely I agree with that, nor would I want to do couply evenings out with someone I didn’t like. I would still do family events, but that would be it.

I think it’s vu of you to want an apology.

FASH84 · 30/08/2018 12:47

Not your marriage, not your business. She doesn't owe you anything

Plumsofwrath · 30/08/2018 12:49

The money situation is absolutely none of your business. None whatsoever. I’d be furious if I were your DB and found out you even knew about this.

I think you need to grow up a bit, in the nicest possible way. Life isn’t rosy, relationships aren’t always happy. Life is often tricky and uncomfortable. In your shoes I would have a sole purpose: supporting my DB in a way that doesn’t compromise my own principles. It’s not like she’s come out as a neo-Nazi and your DB is asking you to be her friend. She’s a flawed human, just like you, and nothing you’ve said leads me to believe you’re in any position to think she’s not worthy of you being civil, polite and courteous with her. For your brother’s sake.

BertieBott · 30/08/2018 12:50

Mind your own beeswax op. You are not in bed with them at night. You only know what you see and what dB tells you.

Maybe he is addicted to my little pony, sleeps with 500 in bed with him but his wife respects his privacy and doesn’t discuss it with people.

You know fuck all. Butt out.