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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

DD forbidden to attend family party.

338 replies

sunshineandsnow · 23/08/2018 20:21

18 months ago, DD had a birthday sleepover for her school friends and didn't invite her younger cousin.

We then got to DN birthday, and there was the regular annual massive family party that we weren't invited to, and found out about from Facebook. When I confronted everyone they stopped speaking to me and it all got very nasty.

So we got to DDs birthday this year and I didn't invite DN again - she just had a small meal out this year. I had the whole day destroyed with endless messages slagging me off.

There has been no communication with my sister since then, and minimal with other relatives. Everyone hates me for being unreasonable.

Tomorrow is DNs birthday again. Without anyone realising, DD is staying at our parents for the weekend (as I have maintained contact this way every so often, as the cousins love each other and enjoy each other's company). DD has just been informed that she is to stay home for the duration of the party, and is not allowed to attend.

DD and DN are now texting each other, confused as to why DD is not allowed (DN thinking I was not allowing it).

DD needs to stay this weekend for childcare reasons - AIBU to tell DM she is to grow some balls and stop taking sides? AIBU to think DD should be allowed to go?

Hopefully this links to my old thread but it looks a bit odd...
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-mewww.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-me" target="_blank">http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am<a class="break-all" href="http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-mewww.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-me" target="_blank">ii<a class="break-all" href="http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-mewww.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-me" target="_blank">being<a class="break-all" href="http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-mewww.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-me" target="blank">unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-mewww.mumsnet.com/Talk/amm<a class="break-all" href="http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-mewww.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-me" target="_blank">i<a class="break-all" href="http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-mewww.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-me" target="_blank">beingg<a class="break-all" href="http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-mewww.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-me" target="_blank">unreasonable/3198050-my-family-won-t-speak-to-me

OP posts:
wornoutboots · 25/08/2018 21:50

Maybe it's true that you only get mum, but the whole world will only ever get one YOU.

And that means that time with you is too precious to waste on people who have always treated you like shit.

So ignore anyone who thinks the fact she gave birth to you gives her license to be in contact with you regardless of her behaviour. That fact should make her treat you well, not worse!

browneyes77 · 25/08/2018 22:13

I am in utter shock at the vile shit your mother has spouted at you over the years.

I’m so sorry you’ve had to deal with this kind of toxic behaviour all your life. Yes you only get one mother, but when your own mother treats you this way, then she doesn’t deserve to have you in her life. Sorry but she just doesn’t. No child should ever have to put up with this from a parent. Parents are supposed to love you and support you, not put you down and and make you feel worthless.

I agree with PP’s that you should cut all ties with your DM and DS. It doesn’t matter if they try and make you out to be the bad guy, because they’re already doing that anyway! So it makes zero difference.

And as for that letter your DM wrote? I’d write one back detailing her lifelong utterly disgusting behaviour along with your DS’s and say this is the reason that you won’t be speaking to any of them anymore. So she and your DS can continue to kiss each other’s arses. And now they can kiss yours too.

sunshineandsnow · 25/08/2018 22:25

Wow. I've never had so many people on my side in my whole life.

OP posts:
LeighaJ · 25/08/2018 22:32

If you decide to go NC with all of them then you should just send them links to your threads first so they can see how the average stranger views the situation.

I don't think the relationships are worth saving at this point, it's sad so much drama and hatred has been spewed at you over something so silly. But maybe the threads would give them a wake up call to how vile they are.

TeddybearBaby · 25/08/2018 22:49

Have you bluntly said to your mum ‘just to clarify mum. You’re going to go off to DN’s party and say BYE 👋🏼 to your 12 year old grandchild who will be spending the day alone in your house while you’re all partying away?’ And if she said yes in response I really don’t think she’d be going there.

You poor thing, you’re being so undervalued. I really feel for you 💐

Elephant14 · 25/08/2018 23:50

And if she said yes in response I really don’t think she’d be going there.

This is what this thread all boils down to. If your mother leaves your 12 year old alone to go to that party, then shame on you for letting her go there - I don't buy all this "oh yes, DD knows" etc.

Don't let your mother turn her crap onto your child - YOU are the adult now and your DD only gets one mother.

emmyrose2000 · 26/08/2018 05:50

It's immaterial whether DD likes being with her grandparents, thinks being deliberately excluded from the party is amusing etc. For now.

The bottom line is, her grandparents have two (or more?) granddaughters, but they are clearly favouring one over the other by (1) agreeing to attend the other granddaughter's party and leave the second child at home; and (2) going along with your batshit sister and her continued ostracism of your child.

Your mother was/is a nasty person who was/is a complete failure of a mother by going out of her way to treat one child better than the other. Now she's doing it to her grandchildren. I'm completely confused as to why you're standing by and allowing your DD to be treated like this. Having gone through it yourself I thought you'd want to do everything in your power to prevent it happening to your child/ren.

Just because DD doesn't appear to be upset by this now, doesn't mean the damage isn't being done and she won't be used as the family punching bag in the future. In your shoes, I'd cut the lot of them off and empower my DD with the knowledge that she doesn't have to stick around people who don't treat her properly/respectfully.

browneyes77 · 26/08/2018 07:11

Agree with emmyrose2000 100%.

At the moment, from what you’ve said, your DD only knows about their behaviour around the whole birthday party ridiculousness. She isn’t aware they’ve been treating you like this your whole life. She may not be amused by their behaviour if she knew this was the norm for them in how they treat you.

You’ve placed your DD in your DM’s care for the weekend. She isn’t providing that care. I’d go get her and never give DM childcare again.

LotsToThinkOf · 26/08/2018 07:17

If the GPS leave DD on her own whilst they go to the party then that'd be the reason to go NC. They sound awful, stop putting yourself through it.

bengalcat · 26/08/2018 07:31

I would not send my daughter there and at 12 she is old enough to be told why . And tbh I'd think very carefully before sending her at all - ever . Leaving her at home while there is a party is mean and unacceptable and I just wouldn't expose my child to this petty and toxic behaviour . Also explain this to your daughter - she's likely seen playground pettiness etc so will be able to understand that some adults are ridiculous too .

TeddybearBaby · 26/08/2018 07:54

I just wanted to add that I get the ‘you only get one mum’ thing and the ‘life is too short’. I’d normally agree. I lost my mum. Me and my siblings still struggle without her even though it was more than 7 years ago and for me it’s no longer being a priority for anyone. I have children, husband, dad, siblings, huge family but I’ve realised that no one cares like my mum did.......

You’d tell her you was feeling sad / ill / whatever and she’d be on your doorstep the next minute. She’d be the only nan watching the grandchildren do sports. She loved being a mum and a nan and life is really, really awful without her. I have to accept that no one will care for me like my mum did so I just try to be grateful that I had her at all.

FYI my siblings say the same thing as me. Obvs we’re all individuals so we all had a different experience with her and different needs but we all had a positive, loving mum and we all still struggle in our 30’s/40’s.

I don’t know if my mum’s story will help you, it’s just my experience. Tbh I’m feel really angry that you’re not being nurtured and loved in the way you deserve. You’re supposed to feel safe with your mum. I was always myself with her and honest. I knew she only cared whether I was ok or not. There was no judgement.

Regarding your daughter I think I’d HAVE to let her know ‘I know you are ok with all this my darling but you’re MY daughter and I won’t have you being left behind. Ever’ X

Makemineboozefree · 26/08/2018 08:38

Wow. I've never had so many people on my side in my whole life.

That's because everyone on here can see how awful and damaging your family are and you just need to catch up with us! Keep reading your threads back as a reminder that they ARE passing the toxicity onto your DD now - like the Christmas phone call where your mum hung up on her because DN was on the other line and your daughter was upset. It IS affecting her already - but you as her mother have the power to put a stop to it by going completely NC. Your DD might be upset at first (maybe your DF will still keep sneaking round though!) but in the long run you're protecting her from a whole barrel of heartache.

powkin · 26/08/2018 08:50

I want to provide a bit more practical legal advice as I’m not sure what else I can add and I really don’t get the sense you are ready to go NC. However like others I really hope you do. It sounds like getting some counselling would be really helpful and maybe give you some clarity on how to move forward. I’d recommend you contact a local domestic abuse charity for this if you cannot afford private, the waiting list would be long but you’d hopefully get longer term support than the NHS, plus someone that understands that this is domestic abuse. The same goes with finding a private therapist, find one that has that experience (happy to help).

Domestic violence and abuse is defined as:

"Any incident or pattern of incidents of controlling, coercive or threatening behaviour, violence or abuse between those aged 16 or over who are or have been intimate partners or family members, regardless of gender or sexuality. This can encompass, but is not limited to, the following types of abuse: psychological, physical, sexual, financial and emotional."

To be this is clear psychological and emotional abuse. If your mum didn’t also sound very unpleasant I’d actually see your sister as the primary abuser, as in some ways your mother seems very frightened of her and the consequences of disobeying her (e.g. being terrified of you turning up at her house when your sister might see). It seems like your sister has had an extreme amount of power and control over the family for a long time. At this point you have nothing to lose and I would be tempted to ask your mum if she is afraid of your sister.

You also describe that when you try and reduce contact and block them on certain social media that they continue to try and contact you by other means. This would meet the definition of stalking or harassment (I would need more information to distinguish). If you decide to cut all contact and make that clear to them, any further communication by them can be considered harassment at the very least. This includes phone calls, text, emails, visits to you house, letters, malicious Facebook/social media posts where you are named or identifiable. The police are getting better at handling this and if a crime is committed they will step in, but there needs to be a clear boundary that you have tried to put in and no communication on your side for the most success. There are specialist domestic abuse offers who you can ask to speak to. You could also consider a civil injunction against them which if they break they would also be in break of the law.

This might all sound extreme and these are all options you may not want to take, but I want you to be prepared and also feel bolstered by the fact that there is support out there and people able and willing to support you. I have a feeling this may escalate if you try to cut contact, however much they claim to dislike you they clearly like to have power and control over you, and losing that is often a serious catalyst, as it seems to have been in the past. You will likely need support, as would anyone in this situation.

I’m sorry if you know all of this, as you said you work in mental health nursing, but often we can’t see our own situations clearly and family have a way of making things very confusing, especially when we are told narratives our whole lives. You might want to read some R.D.Laing - his books on madness in the family and how one person is forced into a position of ‘madness’ seem to be appropriate here. There is a little bit writing on sibling abuse online as well, it is worth reading.

I have not been in a situation as extreme as yours but my relationship with my family has been difficult, especially with my sister. It still lead to me entering abusive relationships. It took me a long time (and a huge breakdown) to distance myself from them and get the space to work out my issues. They will never understand my experience of growing up and most people with happy families never will. They try to say well meaning things but they have no idea what it’s like to grow up in a dysfunctional family and the damage that can, has, and will continue to do. So keep this thread in mind and make sure you talk to the right people, your friends sound supportive (my family look ‘perfect’ on the outside and they would do their best perfect routine so none of my friends understand).

If you really do still want a relationship with them then I think you would need to consider family systems therapy as your bottom line going forward, I’m not sure if the NHS would offer if the children aren’t involved, so then you’d need to all be prepared to pitch in and pay, not just you paying for it. If they really want you in their life then they’ll help pay for it and make it happen. If not then that’s their loss.

Thinking of you x

browneyes77 · 26/08/2018 09:13

Some excellent advice there from Makemineboozefree

garethsouthgatesmrs · 26/08/2018 09:26

Did you send your DD? What happened?

Nanny0gg · 26/08/2018 09:41

Your DD doesn’t need a relationship with her cousin. The world won’t end if it stops. She has other friends.

The cousin will pick up that she’s the favoured one and start treating your DD the way your sister does you.

Cut them all off.

sunshineandsnow · 26/08/2018 10:10

What a helpful post powkin. I certainly had never thought of it from that aspect. Bloody hell.

DD went. GP went the party. I've texted DM to say I wasn't happy that she was excluded. DD has fun with her friends and also posted lovely messages to her DN on social media saying she loves her not matter what.

Despite this, I don't want my DC to sleep there ever again. You've all given me so much to think about.

OP posts:
Sasstal67 · 26/08/2018 10:34

I agree with Powkin regarding therapy. MN has provided you with feelings of validity where your stance on this is concerned, but obviously it's not an ongoing support. A therapist could fill that role in your life for as long as you need it.

The comparisons between my past experiences and what you are going through are endless. I'm the youngest of 3 girls and have NC with any of my family, except some lovely cousins who live in another part of the U.K., due to the absurd and wholly unjustified behaviour of the middle sister. Her unfathomable issues with me are enabled by a family who don't have a backbone between them. Not one of them, aunts, uncles, local cousins etc could explain why myself, my husband and our children were cast out of the family. Yet every one of them left us off invitation lists for family gatherings, as they "Didn't want to upset ***, and cause any problems." Not one of them ever considered how upset I was.

My mother was exactly the same as yours, suddenly stopping us visiting on Halloween as we'd always done, just incase DSis and family popped round, and that was before DSis had completely cut us out of the family. Endless visits were cancelled at the last minute as DSis had heard about it and decided she wanted DM's company that day. It happened far too regularly to be coincidences. She even tried cancelling her visit for one of my DC's birthdays because DSis had a friend who had a child who was having a birthday and she thought she'd go to that instead. She informed me of this whilst I was taking her shopping. I was so shocked and angry, yet I knew that if I expressed how disgusting her behaviour towards my children was, I'd be the baddie and I feared it would give her and my DSis every excuse they ever needed to cut my DC out of their nan's life forever. I could honestly have shoved her in one of Tesco's freezers at that moment and been done with it.

Like you, I was baffled, hurt, sick of being judged against DSis and found wanting, but mostly hurt for my children. I think that's why I sucked it up for so many years and made endless excuses for their nan's behaviour. I was desperate that they didn't realise what was really going on and were left feeling like they had less worth than their cousins. I underestimated them. After some particularly spiteful treatment by my DM, I was really struggling to hide my emotions as I was so hurt. My DC must have heard myself and my DH talking as they came to me and told me not to let 'them' upset me anymore. That they didn't bother telling nan anything anymore, because she'd only respond that their cousins had done something even more exciting/clever/braver etc etc. That nan didn't care about us as much and that was her problem, not ours. It took my own wonderful children to make me see sense.

I wish with all my heart that I'd gone NC at that point. I was LC but allowed my DC to visit with their GM if and when they wanted. I did stop pushing them to go though which my boy's appreciated . My DD had always been very close to her GPs, especially her gramp, who had passed away suddenly. I knew she was scared of losing her GM after that. Tbh 90% of this happened after my dad passed.

My DM had banned us from seeing our paternal GM through spite, and I was against ever doing that to my own DC. How I wish I had. My DSis then spent years trying to undermine my DD's relationship with her GM and my DD was regularly brushed aside by her GM in favour of any of her other cousins. As my DD got older it became glaringly clear that all her GM was interested in her for was company, when none of the others could be bothered to visit and as a cleaner, carer, laundry, taxi and general dogs body. My DD was holding down a high pressure job with a hefty commute on top of all these chores, yet her GM never missed an opportunity to let her know what a terrible disappointment she was if my DD said anything but "How high" when her GM shouted "jump".

Eventually my DSis inflicted such vindictive and truly vile behaviour on my DD, that it simply broke her when her GM publicly backed my DSis, effectively throwing my DD to the wolves, mired in false accusations and lies. We have proof in black and white that my DSis lied again and again yet it means nothing. My DM even phoned my DD to say she was sorry and that she knew my daughter was free of blame. She followed that by denying she ever made the call.

I would give almost anything to be able to turn back the clock and protect my DC from their psychotic relative's behaviour, by choosing NC as a way forward for my children too. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 26/08/2018 10:41

I agree that it is no longer appropriate for your mother to have "care" of your DD.
If your mother had relented and taken your DD to your DN's party, different story - but she's determined to continue the rift, so she's not a fit person to have "care" of your DD any longer, as she is starting to treat her abusively as well.

I think you should maybe sit your DD down and have a big chat with her, explain in an age-appropriate way what your mother has done over the years and how you don't want your DD to be treated in a second-class way, as you were.
She's old enough to understand - but she's also old enough to make up her own mind re. contact with them. However, you do not need to either force the contact (by letting them have her at weekends) or facilitate it.

Lots of people don't have grandparents for one reason or another - distance, death, estrangement - I'm strongly of the belief that it is better to have no grandparent than to have a toxic one in your life.

browneyes77 · 26/08/2018 10:43

Sorry I meant excellent advice from powkin

(Although Makemineboozefree was right aswell)

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 26/08/2018 10:45

Xposted with Sasstal - um, her story is a cautionary tale indeed of allowing any sort of contact to continue!
I think I'll retract my previous suggestion of letting your DD make up her own mind re. contact!

Carly46 · 26/08/2018 11:07

Your sis seems an immature dinlo the poor kids are suffering not her if I were u I’d take ur daughter out for day so she’s doing something and not thinking about the fact she’s excluded from her own cousin party bless her

browneyes77 · 26/08/2018 11:07

I think you should maybe sit your DD down and have a big chat with her, explain in an age-appropriate way what your mother has done over the years and how you don't want your DD to be treated in a second-class way, as you were.
She's old enough to understand - but she's also old enough to make up her own mind re. contact with them. However, you do not need to either force the contact (by letting them have her at weekends) or facilitate it.

I wanted to say this exact thing but was struggling to put it in the right way.

powkin · 26/08/2018 11:11

@sunshineandsnow it can be hard to look at things through that lens but I think knowing those avenues are there can really make you feel less alone and ready to deal with the consequences. Having read through your last thread it seems like your sister was the one engaging in stalking behaviour. The difference is stalking involves a fixation or obsessive quality to it, whereas harassment can be done by one or more people without that fixated quality. Stalking is often about power and control. It’s important to know that any contact by them after you’ve explicitly said ‘no more’ can be seen in that light, even if it’s apologies, gifts, flowers, attempts to get third parties involved etc. They are still not respecting your boundaries or wishes. There is no ‘defense’ to stalking or harassment in the law, ie there is no reason you can give to justify it that a member of the public can give (if you are in MI5 and following someone it’s a bit different!). I’m not saying every police officer will understand as they have limited training and can be a bit hopeless, so speaking to a domestic abuse team or the National Stalking Helpline will be helpful. If you can bear not to block them and just mute or send all messages to another folder then having the evidence of a ‘course of
conduct’ on their part is very important. You might get another phone/email for example and just leave the other one to get the abuse but then if you decide to take it further you’ve got the proof.

Again, you might never need this info (I hope you don’t) but it is good to be prepared. Information is your friend!

TinklyLittleLaugh · 26/08/2018 11:20

What Sas says. I'm 52, my sister has some crazy passive aggressive vendetta against me and my mum enables her. We get snubbed and left out of so many big family events its almost a joke.

It has taken the insight of my grown up daughters for me to see this for what it is; that my lovely mum, who I get along with brilliantly, is so in the thrall of Dsis that she will never have my back. My sis and her kids come first every time.

My kids have no time for their Auntie and Grandma now. They have lost all affection for them after realising how they treat me. Some recent conversations with them have been a big eyeopener for me.

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