17 year old performer, not allowed to do what in the theater shocked 😮

[Willowk321]

So basically, my DS is 17. It is legal for him to have a job without parental concent, it is legal for him to drive (if he has passed his test which tbh he hasn’t 😜), he can legally move out- again without parental concent, and he can legally concent to his own medication.

He is also currently in a amateur production for a local company which he is really enjoying. However, I have been informed that I must accompany him to the stage door and sign to say I have dropped him off and Vice a versa at the end of the rehearsal.

I told my son I thought that this was ridiculous and refused to do it, however his director telephoned me the other night to told me thet it was a legal requirement and that any person under 18 is not allowed to vouch for themselves “Same way they don’t have any other responsibilities”. I then mentioned the above and they basically just said “yeah, well that’s different”. I mean WTF.

Anyway the thing that has annoyed me is what they said is complete 💩:

As soon I came off the phone, I went straight to Google to look up the law, as I would be amazed if you had to be picked up at an age where your considered mature enough to live on your own and even be married (yes, I do know that you need parental consent for that. Well, unless you run off to Scotland which; let’s be honest; is what most probably do 😉). Anyway I researched the law and click on the official document on gov uk and what a surprise... the age is 16. 😡🙄

I then checked my local authority to see if it was the same and it appeared to be. So I decided to ring up the Council and told them about the situation, and they told me:

“Although, the law is 16, it is not uncommon for theater groups/dance schools to raise the age (mostly to 18). 16 is the minimum age but theatre groups could raise the age to 30 if they wanted to and if you theater group wants you to pick up your 17 year old, then it’s their choice and life would be much easier if you just complied with it.”

So there you have it. It is clear that 17 year olds are legal to leave on their own, but my theater group just doesn’t want them to. I have discussed this with DS and although we both agree it is completely ridiculous; I have decided to comply as he desperately wants to do the show.

I suppose my question to all you lovely people is: should a 17 year old be allowed to leave a theater on there own? What age can members leave unaccompanied at your dance school/theater group?

I understand that some people feel that all people under 18s are children, but there is no denying that 0-17 is a broad age range, for example 17 year olds will naturally have more rights and responsibility’s then a 3 year old will.

I would like to say though, if you feel that 17 year olds should be escorted as they are still “children”, would you feel the same about a 17 year old McDonald worker being escorted. I personally cannot tell the difference, but... just a thought 🤔

Anyway I will leave it with you 😂

It sounds like it could all be resolved by signing a form. Have they never had a 17 year old driving themselves home before?

Why would a theatre group be held any more responsible than a school or a workplace? Seventeen year olds are not young children they are on the cusp of adulthood and independent enough to travel on their own. Many will be off to live at university in a few weeks where no one will be monitoring their movements, late night or not.

I made the comparison to primary school earlier because secondary schools do not require or expect parents to pick up and drop off which primary schools often do, this sort of expectation is infantalising at 17. If the group is in a rough area and rehearsals and performances finish very late then they could ask that minors are picked up (although surely they could make an exception for those that drive at least?). Having to have an adult sign a 17 year old in is just weird, makes me think more of children on report at school than anything else.

Insurance was my thought too. They probably just want to cover themselves. It would be useful if you could sign something to say you agree to have responsibility but if they don’t offer it it’s just something you have to suck up and do.

I remember at school when I was 18 and in 6th form my mum still had to write notes when I was off ill. It felt ridiculous that I was an adult yet my mum had to write a note saying ‘dear Mrs x, Reastie was not in school yesterday as she had a headache’.

Am I understanding correctly...the law says 16, but the theater group has their own personal rule that says 18. The part that is objectionable is that it seems that the theater group has implied (or flat out said) that the age 18 rule is the law, when in fact, it's just their company rules. They are of course allowed to set any rules they want, but it's a little disingenuous to pretend that their rules are the law.

Because of predators - Having worked in the theatre for most of my life, I can assure you that sex assaults are not simply the domain of beautiful Hollywood starlets and predatory producers....

There could be a reason for it - maybe they've had problems in the past with 17 year olds getting into relationships with older performers and parents kicking off. Late nights in a theatre are probably more emotionally charged than working in a supermarket. I think though that this is the way we are going. Soon under 18s will not be able to have jobs at all unless all adult employees at the site have had dbs check/safeguarding training.

Yanbu, this would wind the crap out of me.

It doesn't really matter what you think about this situation - they've been quite clear about the rules - you either go with it or not - how about having a calm discussion with the director to ask why

Different places have different safeguarding rules, and anywhere that has participation by under18s must have them.

Some places do not have the time or experienced staff/volunteers to make a detailed policy (and yes, what happens for 16-18yos is more variable). And of course if it's connected with their insurance (which is a legal requirement them to have), they'll have no wriggle room.

Many places do not require parental sign out, from secondary age from mid-teens. It's not related to other age requirements for other activities or responsibilities

I can understand the teens were doing a late performance and they wanted to ensure the safety of that person getting home. But even then a formal signing sheet isn’t needed.

I’ve been involved in an U16 sports team in a The year, and the boys used to come to training and leave by themselves.

I’ve just undergone training and become a registered chaperone for children working in productions where licenses are required.

We were told that rules apply until a child is of legal age of leaving school.

So I suppose that the theatre group may have some grey area between the last Friday of June rule for 15/16 year olds and the additional requirement of further education until 18.

Whilst I can see you infuriated by this and understand it, surely there are bigger things to worry about and it would be nice to support your son without adding any stress or worry to what should be a fun time for him?

What a load of bluster about absolutely nothing.

For me, it would depend on the performance time. 6pm? no problem. 11pm? I would prefer them to be collected by an adult.

At 17 my daughter drove herself everywhere, including a job in a pub, I can't imagine having to sign her in and out anywhere.

When I was 14 I was in a drama group and got myself there and back on the train. That was in the 1960s, people seem to do a lot more for their nearly adult children now.

YANBU ((14) - DD is an ice skater, training several times a week. She wouldn't be able to do it if I had to drop her off as I'm working when training starts. She gets the bus. The rink have a policy that under 12s much be accompanied inside the rink. They reckon that once they start secondary school they're old enough to take that bit of responsibility for themselves.

The OP has already had a conversation with the director about it, and there is no reason to think that it wasn't calm. No mention of insurance or safeguarding, the director falsely said it was a legal requirement.

I can't see how having minors escorted to the stage door prior to rehearsals/ performances by a parent would assist with safeguarding or be an insurance requirement. Requiring a specified adult to pick up might be, although I've managed insurance for events for youths and never had a policy like this proposed. Events for much younger children have had set drop off zones and student role calls (no parental signature required though), and pick up policies are quite standard, but not for older students as they have all had parental consent forms that included a 'do you give permission for your child to go home alone' section.

If the theatre is concerned that some of their members might be abusers then they need chaperones during the rehearsal or performance, or rules that minors are never to be alone with one adult.

Well I think it's great they take safe guarding seriously. I also think that maybe you are over-reacting a bit.

But that said, I understand your annoyance and I'd be a bit frustrated too! At that age most young people are very independent. I had a job evenings and weekends that I made my own way to and from, had been on holiday without parents a few times, would drive myself to college and back etc..

If I was you, in a calm way, I'd discuss with the theatre person that you completely understand their reasons for parents signing out and appreciate the safe guarding lengths they are going to. I'd also then note that you feel your son is responsible and you would like to sign a disclaimer form to say you are happy for him to sign himself out after each rehearsal. Offer to write a signed letter to this effect if they don't have a form.

Whilst I can see you infuriated by this and understand it, surely there are bigger things to worry

Why come out with crap like this? Possibly the OP does have bigger things to worry about but that isn't relevant to the ridiculous policy. I have to worry about earning a living - hence DD gets herself to the rink.

It’s annoying. And it’s probably because they have a safe guarding policy - either written by themselves or copy & pasted from elsewhere - that defines children as up to 18. It’s frustrating when policy writers don’t think through the implications of such statements. For example a 17 year old who could drive to and from the theatre would still need an adult to collect them.

But. Some 17 year olds have been known to be economical with the truth, perhaps telling their parents they are staying at a friends overnight when in fact they are going clubbing, or they’re at the beginning of a relationship and plan to spend the night with their beloved. If the Theatre company has been caught out in the past, I can see why they might be cautious in future.

I did amateur theatre for years and once over 16 we could do as we pleased. I think this rule for a 17 yo is ridiculous. Not sure there is anything you can do though. Could you tell them that the law is in fact 16?

Makes sense to me. I’m assuming the shows might end quite late?

I don’t understand why you are quite so wound up by it?

I’m heavily involved in youth theatre-have worked extensively with 5 or 6 different companies over the years and it is so much easier to have the same rules for everyone taking part. I don’t deal with the safeguarding and logistics of these events (thankfully-I have enough of that at work ). There is one major theatre near us which is so poorly designed that to exit to get to the car park you have to walk through an underground passageway which often has unsavoury characters hanging around. There is no way I would want any teenager wandering down there on their own late at night.
It will be being insisted upon from a concern to absolutely do the right thing, not trying to piss off the parents. We all know as adults how vulnerable children and young people are. It seems from your OP that you are able to collect him, so it really is a non-issue? He’s 17, next year he’ll be able to do it on his own as an adult? I don’t know if you’ve ever had that terrible feeling of ‘oh god, where is so and so?’ When you’re in charge of a group of young people. It is honestly the most awful feeling ever when someone goes AWOL even for 5 minutes. Also remember that the chaperones will be volunteers, giving up their time to help out and having a consistent system across the board will make that easier, particularly if the chaperones change each evening.

I can't believe you went to such much effort and called the local authority about this! Yes it's a stupid rule but just accept it and move on. In the nicest way possible do you need a hobby? Can I suggest a theatre group

I am quite surprised by this as the cadets my 13 yr old goes to just let's them out to get home however they want at 9.30pm the number of her friends I have given lifts to is quite shocking. Also after there camp they were just dumped on the side of the road and the coach drove off no one checked they were with any one.