I don't agree this is victim blaming

[TeeJay1970]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-45232993

I know what victim blaming is so there is no need to define it for me.

Surely this is just good advice?

The police have had to apologise for encouraging

"friends to look after each other on a night out to prevent someone becoming vulnerable or separated from the group"

Isn't that what good friends do?

It is not victim blaming to tell your DD to be careful and to not drink so much she is not aware of her surroundings. I would be telling a son exactly the same thing

This. I have 2 sons and one daughter. I’ll be saying exactly this to all of them when the time comes.

ethel yes! Exactly!

The delivery and target of the message is key.

“The thing is. A woman should be able to lie naked in the street, paralytic and STILL not be raped.”

Yes yes to this!

The issue is, for me. We are societally expecting there to be societal responsibility, whilst never expecting individual responsibility. We expect people,to be safe whilst vulnerable, whilst never encouraging me people to try not be in a vulnerable situation, because then that's victim blaming. But if none is taking personal responsibility, then how can they be taking societal responsibility. There has to be a balance. Of looking after and trying to ensure your own safety, and looking out for the safety of others. But to advise that, is victim blaming. Allegedly.

It was not IMHO victim blaming at slightest. Just an advice on how to be safe. There is now a lots of movement to educate young man and women (because sexual assault can be done by woman too) but unfortunately there are and always will be sickos and so giving an advice on how to keep safe is ok and in fact important.
And not just when it comes to rape. There should be more education about knife crime as well.

Well the last poster said "1/3 of rapes happen to when people are dunk"

So should people listen to these posters then actually they are twice as likely to be raped aren't they?

Make your bloody mind up how actually to keep safe

Light as well say stay home alome with your bloody cats

OftenHangry the vast, overwhelming majority of sex attacks are committed by men. Female sex attackers are really unusual.

I think it's good advice. The police see the worst of people every day, all day. They see the pyschopaths and the damaged and the plain bad. These people won't stop doing awful things because the police tell them they shouldn't. So prudent advice is look after yourself and your friends because there are terrible people out there who just don't give a fuck.

All SD what are you on about? Vulnerable situation?
You mean easy pickings for scumbags. So let's ignore the scumbags behaviour?

Women should be able to get drunk without being raped.

Yes indeed but you could equally say that women, and men, should be able to go out and have a good time without getting incapably drunk, which puts you at risk of other things such as being robbed/losing valuables, getting hit by a car, having some sort of accident and ending up in A and E etc.

So now we’re policing people’s behaviour whilst they indulge in perfectly legal and normal behaviour, Serendippity?

Fuck sake serendipity really?

Ending up in A&E clogging it up because of drunken stupidity is normal behaviour?

Ditching your friends to get home alone?
Getting so wasted you can’t function?

This is normal?

It's not one or the other though is it? Of course we should be trying to create a society where men don't assault women. But it's not exactly easy or quick to do that, is it? So in the mean time, let's continue concurrently telling people how best to stay safe.

We can do both! But that doesn't fit the hyperbolic narrative that most people prefer.

I’m just saying getting hammered isn’t necessarily a good idea.

So now we’re policing people’s behaviour whilst they indulge in perfectly legal and normal behaviour,Serendippity?

I'm just wondering what's next, what else can we pin on women . I mean we stop them leaving the house alone and drinking and shock horror girls and women are still raped. What do we tell them not to do next?

At what point do we solve the actual problem.of rapist men

It does seem like very sensible advice...

Until you remember that the majority of women who experience sexual abuse do so at the hands of their partner, or someone who shares their household.
Probably sober. Probably not dolled up.

It does seem sensible to stay with friends, not get too drunk, tell someone where you're going etc. But even more sensible would be for men to stop raping!

I can never quite work out how I feel about this! To compare, I know that if I walked down the street waving £5000 around, I should be able to walk without being mugged. But the reality is I probably would be mugged. And it would be the mugger's fault. Except if I'd not been flashing the cash, they might not have mugged me. But they might have mugged me anyway to see if I had cash. Or just for my watch.
And also even if I'm not waving the £5000 about, someone could still steal it ie a partner who I share a bank account with, or a narc sibling could guilt it out of me....

Argh. It feels like the thin end of the wedge to me. Sounds sensible up front, but if you follow the argument through logically, you end up at victim blaming. Tricky.

It's not what I'd do, any more. But I used to be more like this many moons ago.
It happens. Lapses in judgment, learning what you can handle, dealing with stressful times and sometimes just having carefree fun that goes a bit further than you might E intended.

It is legal to drink. It's not legal to rape.

Women don't really need this advice again. Women know that they should be curbing their own behaviour.

I don't think the tweet was particularly victim blaming but the point is the focus is always on how women should be behaving in order to avoid being raped etc and never any focus on the behaviour of men. I would quite like to see a campaign which tells men that if they come across a very drunk woman, they should ensure she gets home ok, not take her back to his house and stick his dick in her.

The 'there will always be sickos out there' argument is a cop out which just assumes that a) all rapes are the 'jumping out from behind the bushes with a knife' type and b) appalling behaviour from men is just an inevitable given, and rather than trying to change things to stop men behaving badly, the best we can do is ensure that women don't do certain things or behave in certain ways.

Whilst obviously falling over ourselves to acknowledge that Not All Men Are Like That and ensuring that offence is not caused to men in general. And ensuring that we don't take steps to protect women that some people won't like, eg. Not wanting to share intimate female spaces with people who have penises.

I can never quite work out how I feel about this! To compare, I know that if I walked down the street waving £5000 around, I should be able to walk without being mugged. But the reality is I probably would be mugged. And it would be the mugger's fault. Except if I'd not been flashing the cash, they might not have mugged me. But they might have mugged me anyway to see if I had cash. Or just for my watch.

Right. So the obvious answer is to try to stop people from being muggers. Which is extremely complex. While we work on that, best to take a few measures to reduce your risk of being mugged, such as not walking down dark alleys, not waving wads of cash around, etc. I know it's annoying, but it's better than being mugged, right?

Giles didn't you know, women are responsible for/to blame for everything ultimately? After all, if they'd raised their sons better, they wouldn't rape. Their daughters better, they wouldn't get so drunk.

Or, we could all grow the fuck up.

Maybe all the men should just stay at home.

If an attacker wants to attack someone or is completely on them.

However if you want to minimise the risk of you being attacked be cautious, watch your drink and look out for friends. If a friend is drink there is a higher chance of them being at risk of falling down the stairs, stumbling into the road or being attacked. Don't get too drunk and look out for each other is good advice.

However after someone has been attacked this advice should not be mentioned in case it sounds like blame.

Maybe all the men should just stay at home
Well that seems like the logical solution. I wonder how quickly men would tell their mates etc to pack it in if the we're honestly prevented from leaving the house unless they behave

@DiegoMadonna
And as I said in the beginning. That does sound like the sensible thing to do. I wouldn't flash the cash, and I wouldn't go out and get gutter stumbling drunk.

But. If you follow that logic through, and I do choose to go out showing off my £5000, do I deserve to get mugged for not following the precautions? Was I asking for it, through the very nature of not specifically protecting against it?

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