To think children benefit from a clean home?

[AbeautifulBeast]

Inspired by the saying that seems to do the rounds on FB over the holidays. Something along the lines of not having time to clean because they are far too busy making memories....
I do get it, no one looks back at their childhood and remembers if the bathroom and kitchen were spotless however it amazes me how many adults admit a dirty/messy home affects their mental health but seem to think it doesn't affect children.
I appreciate everyone has different standards but surely it can't be good for kids to grow up in dirt and mess for the sake of 'memories' and there has to be a balance?

I grew up with a mother who never played with us because cleaning (the already spotless house) took priority over us.
My best friend lived in utter filth and mess and she and her family were happy, so clever, well read and good at music and it was because her parents invested in their children more than their house. I much preferred going to their house and spent most of my teenage years there avoiding my mothers mausoleum.
I haven't done any housework this week apart from cleaning the loo because we've had much better things to do!

I think children appreciate a sense of order and obviously cleanliness comes into this. No one is seriously suggesting disorder is better, surely. Perhaps the awful expression “making memories” is an excuse not to maintain standards?

I’m with DrWhy

However, your house, your rules.

My house is alright. Not where I’d like it to be. But my two kids are 3 and 1 and I work and DH works and there isn’t much spare time.

If I clean my kitchen floor, it is clean until literally the next time the kids eat something 🤷🏻‍♀️

Extremes are not healthy. Most people are in the middle.

I agree most people are in the middle.

"No one looks back at their childhood and remembers if the bathroom and kitchen were spotless

I do. All we did was clean. The more the cleaning the more my mother became more crazed."

I look back and remember how awful the bathroom was, a red bathroom that was actually white covered in limescale. Stinky toilet. The feeling of panic if a visitor said they needed the toilet. It's not something you can refuse.
I remember not being able to invite people home and even some girls from school coming over 'as a joke' to look through our windows so they could tell everyone else at school.
I try to be better myself, but there are things that still mystify me. Before I joined MN I had no idea some people thought bath mats were dirty and I'd never seen ours in the washing machine.
I think making children live in dirty and untidy surroundings should be illegal and come under neglect.
Of course, I think the people on here who say their house is dirty don't really mean it...

I've seen how tidying up a bit affects children first hand. My friend's house is a total bomb site. Clutter everywhere, toys quite literally carpeting the floor to the point where you can't see the actual carpet. Toys are all broken / pieces lost because everything is pulled out and never put back. (BTW house is not dirty - just prodigiously messy and overstuffed)
I was visiting with DD a few weeks ago and roped all the kids into clearing the living room and tidying toys away while my friend was cooking. Took us an hour but when it was done the change in her kids was amazing: quieter, calmer, better mood. They all sat and watched a film, apparently it was the first time in about a year they'd been so calm.
It's hardly surprising though. Too much mess fucks with my mental health, why would it be different for kids?

"I don’t see a single person blaming their miserable childhood living in clutter and dirt and wrinkled clothes on their father."

I blame both parents to an extent because they're both messy, but I blame my mum more because she was nominally a housewife even when we were at school. She had all the time in the world to do it, but just isn't domesticated.

I think you are taking these posts to literally. A bit of mess in the summer when the routine is out the window and out and about more is not living in filth.

There will always be extremes but I think most people mean the leave they tidy all the mess at the end of the day to enjoy the day rather than every 5 mins. Skip the polishing or windows once in a while etc.

As a child I was embarrassed by our messy, dirty, poorly maintained home. A better person might not have been, but I was. I am no domestic goddess, and we only have a little house, but I try fight my natural slovenly tendencies to make sure my kids and their friends have somewhere reasonably pleasant and fresh smelling, with room to play.

DrWhy need not worry. that is the life of many people with small children. It does change once they are at school and easier to get to bed. Our house got tidier as the children got older (I'm a fairly tidy person anyway).

People's personalities just differ on these things anyway. Most of us are somewhere in the middle. However if you are do nothing but clean or never clean anything you probably have a problem.

I think my children benefit from the order at home - things are in a place and I try to throw things out - if we get something new try to throw 2 older things away etc.

I agree that this is nothing to do just with women. My own father (as my mother was not keen on cleaning) used to whip round with the hoover every weekend, empty the room waste baskets, go to M&S for food shopping etc etc (he also did all the night bottle feeds for those bottle fed as he said he was used to being up on call (he was a doctor) but it was certainly to spare my mother losing a night's sleep). These are all issues for parents not just women.

" I learnt absolutely nothing about cleaning because our house was awful and it's been a steep learning curve as an adult."

Yes. I once had a housemate who told me he'd done the skirting boards. I nodded, but had no idea what a skirting board was.
Bed sheet were cleaned 1-2 a year, blankets never. Carpets everywhere that were never cleaned. I didn't know bath mats could go in the washing machine. The white fridge was orange.
I didn't realise towels should be washed once a week (well, that's what I believe now, not the every day of some MNers) and had a boyfriend ask me why I had stinky towels - thought that was normal.

Gwen it was ovens and grill pans for me. Thought thick, crumbly greasy black crust was mandatory. And we didn't own a mop - the penny only dropped when I moved in with DH and he bought one.

DrWhy For toddlers and babies it just needs to be tidy and clean enough to be safe. Some of the stories shared here are pf homes that are so dirty they are unsafe for babies and toddlers.
A house does need to be safe for kids. That is why SS will intervene when kids are living in dirty hovels. Because it is dangerous.

" I think those memes are aimed at this very scenario," [overly clean people]

Yes, but really messy people will use them an an excuse. My mum used to say things like 'you couldn't tell that any children lived in that house at all, so sad" to make herself feel better about the squalor we lived in.

Its totally a balance though, I have a friend who's home is completely in chaos and often there has been accidents in relation to the children because of this such as them getting their hands on hazardous objects left laid about, or she will have the sink piled high with washing up and not having a clean cup for them to have water out of etc.

On the opposite end of the scale I had an aunt who was obsessive with cleaning, making sure the children were spotless never sticky hands and as a child it felt stiffling, each toy had to be nearly put away before moving on and she would nag if their bedroom was cluttered whilst we played and I hated visiting.

My parenting I'd like to think is something in the middle, in the holidays there usually are toys everywhere, general hoovering/bathroom cleaning is at a minimum but it's still relatively clean and I like to atleast wipe down the surfaces/tidy up in the evenings and basics done but leave big tasks.

"Gwen it was ovens and grill pans for me. Thought thick, crumbly greasy black crust was mandatory. "

Ah yes, we had that as well. The grill pan was a sight to be seen as well.
We didn't have a mop, but then every surface was carpeted, including kitchen, bathroom and even the garage.

There’s a big range between totally spotless and living in squalor though. I’m somewhere in the middle in that my house isn’t going to make anyone ill but it’s been a while since I cleaned behind the furniture. I think the extremes of the range are both unhealthy. A filthy dirty house is a symbol of neglect but a house that has to be clean all the time and kids aren’t play invade they mess it up also isn’t ideal.
There is a lot of pressure on women to have the perfect house while juggling everything else and I don’t think there is any harm in reminding people that you don’t need to kill yourself to stay on top of every bit of dust.

I lived in a dirty home it definately affected me, any friendships I had etc. Our home can be untidy but is mainly clean. My kids all have lovely bedrooms.

play incase not play invade!

Although my house does feel play invaded at times

Hmm.. I have a disability which means I can’t do as much around the house as I would like, and if I do use my limited energy on that I genuinely don’t have enough left for my dc. I prioritise hot meal, clean clothes, and clean dishes; everything else is done as and when we can, maybe not as often as it should, but we can usually live with it. If those memes make someone like me feel better (albeit they’re twee as anything!) then where’s the harm? As with anything on social media, if you don’t like it, keep scrolling.

I lived in a dirty home it definately affected me, any friendships I had
My step mum and Dad had a filthy house and my Step brother and sister were always so ashamed by it. It was so sad.

I think it is neglect and bad for their health to be brought up in filth. I’ve seen some shocking conditions. Making memories while the house is filthy my arse