AIBU to wonder why Corbyn hasn't got the boot yet?

[marsbarsandtwix]

After all this recent stuff. Please could we have someone else and make labour electable again. Why is he still there and do we think he still will be for the forseeable?

'Full of idiots' Enthusiasm? Is that all 500,000 or just most of us? 'Idiots' and 'Socialists' don't actually mean the same thing.

And what form does this 'hatred' take, Sally? 'Hatred' and 'disagreement' don't mean the same thing either.

For the love of God! He has to go. If the Labour leader isn't preferable to May now, there is no hope.

I don't think he is anti semitic at all, being against certain people's views who happen to be Jewish is NOT anti semitic... Why can't people tell the difference?!? I read a quote somewhere that said once upon a time anti semitism was people who didn't like Jewish people, now it's people who Jews don't like.

So you think none of these (incidents within the Labour party that were overlooked by the Labour leadership and NEC) were anti semitic?

-mocking the Jewish victims of the Paris kosher supermarket attack

• calling Auschwitz a ‘cash cow’
• claiming the holocaust was a hoax
• sharing Neo-Nazi memes saying the Rothschild family has used money lending to take over the world
• saying '‘What have the Jews done good in this world?’', that schools were ‘brainwashing us and our children into thinking the bad guy was Hitler’ and that ‘Jews have reaped the rewards of playing victims’
• sharing a Neonazi David Duke video on Facebook entitled ‘CNN Goldman Sachs and the Zio Matrix’

-comparing a Jewish councillor to Josef Goebbels

• tweeting that Hitler was ‘the greatest man in history’.
• tweeting that ‘Hitler was Jewish’
• writing that the 'American Jewish lobby is extremely powerful'
• tweeting that Hitler might be a ‘Zionist God’ and Jews have ‘big noses’
• accusing Jews of ‘playing the Holocaust card’, and claiming that the BBC was run by a ‘hasbara media cartel
• defending an anti-Semitic mural in East London that depicted Jewish bankers playing a monopoly-style game on the backs of the poor

Why is it that anyone who is pro Palestine is labelled anti Jewish?

Can you explain what death threats to Jewish MPs (including calling them yid cunts) and incidents like the above have to do with the Palestinian cause? And how these aren't anti Jewish? Please do enlighten us

I read a quote somewhere that said once upon a time anti semitism was people who didn't like Jewish people, now it's people who Jews don't like... It really resonates on this case.

rumi I find that utterly offensive as a comment.

JC has not stamped out the anti semitic accusations and has imo handled the issue badly. I think most likely he is anti semitic. That's what fits in.

Moreover, irrespective of the manifesto, he's not a likeable leader for much of the general public including me. Nor is he just meh. He is marmite. I actively dislike the man and would never vote for him. I would vote for a blairite Labour Party. But so much damage has been done now.

How can he honestly do his job as the opposition when he is not being supported by his party who keep crying anti semitism with every tiny thing?!?

Yeah Jews, STFU! Stop making such a fuss. You're traitors to your own country. You're stopping the politician from doing his job because you're whinging about every last thing. Just shut up and stop complaining when your party refuses to condemn racist comments about your ethnicity. And anyone in the party who stands up against racism against a minority is a traitor to their leader! We should all be ashamed of ourselves. We shouldn't be objecting to holocaust denial, poor Jeremy Corbyn can't possibly do his job. We should shut up and be grateful!

How can he honestly do his job as the opposition when he is not being supported by his party who keep crying anti semitism with every tiny thing?!

Code for Jews shut up hey.

I read a quote somewhere that said once upon a time anti semitism was people who didn't like Jewish people, now it's people who Jews don't like.

Well would you say that about any other minority? No thought not.

Don't believe everything you read

I think you should take your own advice quite frankly.

I read a quote somewhere that said once upon a time anti semitism was people who didn't like Jewish people, now it's people who Jews don't like... It really resonates on this case

Try substituting islamophobia for antisemitism and muslims for jews in that detestable quote

Would you still agree with it?

*Iread a quote somewhere that said once upon a time anti semitism was people who didn't like Jewish people, now it's people who Jews don't like.

Well would you say that about any other minority? No thought not.

Don't believe everything you read

I think you should take your own advice quite frankly.*
Indeed. I mean the opening words being "Once upon a time" could be considered a bit of a giveaway.

He also hit out at Momentum, the grassroots movement which backs Jeremy Corbyn.‘They represent malice dressed as virtue,’ he said.
Alan Johnson today.

supplying weapons and supporting the Saudis

I understand your point and share your concerns over the Saudi's. But why stop there, with them? Let's apply this standard to all of the awful dictatorships, oligarchies and theocracies we deal with and do without the trade links/diplomatic relations that we have with around [ i'm guessing] about 50% of the world and our global trade?

Let's do without Russia: awful dictatorship, riddled with corruption. Assassinates political opponents, dissidents, and journalists. Invades neighbouring countries and launches chemical attacks here on British soil. Let's cut them off. No more of their oil and petroleum products, gas, coal, rolled steel, minerals, timber, fertilisers, machinery and equipment, armaments etc...

Then we can tell China to sod off. After all it's a one party state that executes more people than any other country. Televises the forced confessions of dissidents. Tortures and persecutes religious minorities. Recently lunched a massive nationwide crackdown against human rights lawyers. Supplied Saddam Hussein much of his weapons arsenal. etc etc etc....

Then we can cut out almost the entire ME. Much of Africa. The Far East -- including Myan Mar, Indonesia, Malaysia all of which have diabolical human rights records. All of the Stan's.. the list goes on and on.. In an ideal world we could cut ties with all of those countries. But what do you think taking such action would do to our economy?

Do you suppose that one of the first acts that Jeremy "gentler kinder" Corbyn would do, is to cut ties with all of those nations and see goodness knows how many hundreds of thousands of jobs, that are dependent directly or indirectly by us dealing with those countries [many of which are syndicalists jobs] go to the wall? To think that this would happen is, as I said before, to see the world through the prism of childish, simplistic idealism..

Discussing prisoner conditions is not supporting the IRA

Is that all he did then. It ends there does it? Are you simply going to ignore the list of all of other things he did to encourage the PIRA, including attending their dead terrorist funerals. Inviting the killer Adams to parliament at the height of their killing spree. A bit like inviting Bin laden to the Whitehorse shortly after 9/11. Or how he lobbied the UK Gov't to impose a United Ireland that would ignore the democratic will of the majority and hand the PIRA a victory?
I invite you to have a read about what ex PIRA member Sean Callaghan has to say about Corbyn and tell us why he's is wrong?

www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2017/comment/decent-people-on-left-must-call-out-corbyn-over-ira-supporting-past-35772670.html

are you going to apply that standard to the current Gov and the Queen

I assume by that you mean the Queen shook hands with Martin Guinness and Charles with Adams and that successive gov'ts have met with the PIRA, so why criticise Corbyn?

Yes the Queen and Charles met with those two, but these events took place years after the PIRA as well as all of the other terrorist organisations, on all sides, agreed a ceasefire, laid down their arms, hammered out peace deal and stuck to it - as they said they would.

As for the fact that successive Gov'ts met with the PIRA. Yes of course they did. Heath's, Callahan's, Thatcher's, Major's and Blair's all had 'back door' negotiations with the PIRA, that were kept from public view and quite rightly so, in the interests of bringing about peace. . But crucially this was done by democratically elected Governments with a government's power to take action in the event of concessions made by the other side. They could call a ceasefire, withdraw troops, make all kinds of concessions, in order to achieve peace. In short - they had something to offer in return for peace. Can you tell us what Jeremy Corbyn had to offer the PIRA when he went grovelling to them, apart from a shoulder to cry on?

Its a great that the high standards you demand of JC are not applied to all politicians

That's because I can't think of any other political figure [except possibly Lord Haw Haw] who has acted as despicably as dishonestly and as disrespectfully to the British people as Corbyn has. Also, the fact that he, to this day refuses to even acknowledge his actions for what they are, compounds his guilt in my and a great many other people's eyes..

Whatabout this and whatabout that? The Tories, and the coalition did XYZ....We sell weapons to the Saudi's therefore Corbyn's support for the PIRA is exonerated!

The point that keeps alluding you is that these were governments, Tory and Labour,
Gov's make difficult choices and do not always act as morally correct as you or I would like. This is reality sadly. Yes we do sell weapons to the Saudi's, as we did throughout the thirteen years of the last Labour gov'. Do you think I like the fact? Well I do not... But the moral aspect is a side issue.

Jeremy Corbyn offered his encouragement to terrorist groups whilst he was a back bench nobody, he did not represent anybody but himself. Neither did he represent his government. He did so purely to latch onto a cause that made lurid headlines because he wanted to preen himself as a kind of dangerous outsider. To respond to this with whatabout Saudi Arabia as you keep doing, is to miss the point entirely.

@Rumi2018 care to enlighten us on "the anti semitism routine" you've referred to? Do please tell us what 'routine' you mean. We'd all like to be educated

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6087783/Jeremy-Corbyn-said-British-Zionists-no-sense-English-irony.html

jas JC held a meeting just a few weeks after the IRA tried to kill our democratic leader and the cabinet

It wasn’t as successful as they hoped

Why would anyone with an ounce of empathy bring into the HOC members who had been convicted IRA members when so many were still shaken and deeply upset by the death and injuries caused

So no one else could speak for prison referoms or the meeting couldn’t be held elsewhere 🙄

It’s absolutely despicable behaviour if there was social media around then he would have been out of Parliament but reporting was different at that time too much red going on to deal with the nasty idiot backbencher

There are many things I loath about Corbyn but this more than anything else shows you what he is

OyWithThePoodles

The the Labour Party Membership has a number of foolish idiots

Wittering on about the Establishments fear of Corbyn

That will keep him in place should he not step down as not many voters join political parties

I never mentioned socialists. I am posting about Corbyn and The Labour Party (it’s not a socialist party ....)

And what form does this 'hatred' take,Sally? 'Hatred' and 'disagreement' don't mean the same thing either

Funnily enough I am more than aware what hatred is funnily enough and it's not disagreement.

Thanks for being patronising though.

Ratchet, you make some good points but suggesting that comparisons between JC and other Governments or individuals cannot be made, is absurd.
I wouldn't met a current member of the IRA and neither did he but my point is that he is not a terrorist sympathiser because if he was, he would have been arrested and charged, has he got poor judgement, is self serving? yes - he is a politician!!!! and charge to be leveled at most of them.

My concern and the reason he should step aside is on the day the Government give out their notices for a no deal brexit inc stockpiling medicines and that the chancellor warns of 15% less growth in such a scenario, JC is wittering on about a tax on tech giants to support the BBC to fund independent journalism, worthy aims no doubt but a complete irrelevance to the vast majority of people.

He just isn't capable of going for the Tories many weaknesses.

jas that is exactly my main problem with him too. He can say what he likes. Until we have a centre left Social democratic party, the Tories will stay in government for the foreseeable. Proposing that the BBC be made to reveal the social class of their employees is laughable when social class is now so difficult to define, but when he and many of his closest aides are white public school boys it's the equivalent of pinning a 'kick me' sign on his own back.

He just isn't capable of going for the Tories many weaknesses.

Agree 100%

The Corbynistas can sing their disciple's name as much as they like, but this is what it comes down to. The man has a government on its knees, mishandling the biggest crisis facing the country since WW2, and he's focusing on issuing statements about funding the BBC? And this is how he positions himself as a safe paid of hands to run the country? Nope. Don't buy it. He doesn't want the job. Therefore he's not fit to lead.

I want a Labour leader who's a credible opposition to the Tories. I don't want a Tory government. But JC is manna from heaven as far as the Tories are concerned. They can fuck up as much as they like, and they still won't lose a GE as long as JC is LOTO. Their only threat is the infighting amongst themselves - not the actual opposition.

Just look at the far right names who have endorsed him over the past 24 hours. Tells you all you need to know.

I can’t support him anymore for a host of reasons. So for those who wouldn’t who would you propose would be best and why. ( I don’t know by the way just asking.)

Interesting trick JC tried to pull there over funding "independent journalism" with a tax on tech companies. The licence fee is effectively a tax too, and most taxes are controlled and doled out by the government of the day after setting their choice of conditions

A "tech tax" might be a different way of doing things, but I'm not sure how it's supposed to guarantee independence

@Carrrotsandcauliflower I'd go for Yvette Cooper or Keir Starmer. Former has proven front bench experience and can perform at PMQ. Latter isn't tainted with Blairite history. Anyone can be pilloried in the press, but I'd pick those two to be competent leaders and best chance at a credible opposition

agreed, I'd vote for either of those banana