SIL has not vaccinated my nieces

[Pittcuecothecookbook]

My baby has been booked in for her vaccinations soon. I asked my sister in law, who has primary school aged kids, about the experience and I was flabbergasted when she said she didn't get their jabs. I can't quite believe it!

When I asked why, she said the risks outweighed the pros but she struggled to articulate what the risks were beyond 'potential death'. I said that that was also the downside of not getting the jabs too! She said she was persuaded when her friend said that the jabs couldn't be undone if her kids had a reaction.

AIBU to be shocked and quite disappointed about this? I'm not looking forward to it by any means, but the eradication of many awful diseases and protection against those still prevalent is surely a non negotiable?

When her kids don't get these diseases, she'll be vindicated but that will likely be because the majority have had their jabs rather than proving jabs were unnecessary.

I imagine I'll get over this - my child will be protected - but I'm just at hearing this news.

I agree with a pp, it's none of your business. It's up to parents to decide if they wish to vaccinate their dc.

Obviously this is an anonymous forum so no one knows where you live OP - but I always assume most of the UK is fairly multicultural/has tourism. A lot of countries don't have vaccination programmes - you are meeting unvaccinated people every day

I seriously hope you’re talking about Andrew Wakefield

I know a child who has to be home schooled because he has immunity problems. He can't even go to home school groups because they are rife with anti-vaccination families.

It is selfish in the extreme not to vaccinate for kids like him who are vulnerable. Poor tyke.

I wouldn't let my unvaccinated baby visit with children I knew to be unvaccinated. Partly because of the risk factor, but also to make it clear that selfish behavior won't be rewarded.

Herd immunity for measles is 90-95%. As has been stated innumerable times, those who don't vaccinate are relying on the vast majority to vaccinate to protect their own kids. That's selfish crap, and it's deadly to those who can't vaccinate for legitimate medical reasons. About a third of the immunocompromised who catch measles die. Those who can vaccinate, but choose not to, kill their neighbors.

California was heading away from herd immunity until the Disneyland measles outbreak a few years ago. In a handful of schools, vaccination rates were as low as 13%. This is part of the reason why as many people caught measles in Disneyland over a couple months as do in the rest of the United States in a year. It's fucking terrifying how quickly it can spread. This is a very interesting NYTimes article about it. www.nytimes.com/2018/01/16/upshot/measles-vaccination-california-students.html

In short, tell your brother and sister in law that until either they vaccinate their kids or your baby is vaccinated, their kids aren't welcome. Frankly, this is an issue where I go to the mattresses.

robotic that is so sad.

One of the families in our NCT group haven’t vaccinated their child. They didn’t even give the vitamin K injection at birth. I really, really struggle with it. We aren’t close, and this is probably a big factor in me pulling away.

PS: it is entirely your business. There are things that are bigger than one family's decision, and this is one of them.

Yes it’s up to parents to decide if they want to vaccinate their kids or not.
That doesn’t mean that they are not unbelievably effing stupid if they decide not to.
Have you no understanding of the leaps and bounds that science has made?
Bloody hell, it’s just common sense.
Stop listening to a load of old scroat that meant nothing when it came out and means even less now.
Do you really want to see kids dying of diseases that we have found cures for?

Most people who don't vaccinate are university educated, many are GPs. People who don't vaccinate usually research it quite thoroughly, probably more than those who do vaccinate.

Gosh, three ‘citation needed’s in just two sentences. That’s quite an effort.

SIL is a fucking idiot and like the dickheads in my area whose stupidity has damaged herd immunity. I'm immune compromised and have never had measles (no jab in my day). If there's an outbreak now and I get it, it could kill me. Personal choice, my arse.
She's a selfish fucking bitch.

@CoolGirlsNeverGetAngry that really rings true with me. DS is at university age and he is in the age group of children due their MMR when Wakefield spouted his bollocks so a more than normal number of his fellow students did not get their MMR. Two of his friends have had mumps this year, both young men, that is really not something young men want to be having.

At the end of the day, it's their choice to vaccinate or not.

However, given their children aren't vaccinated, I'd be extremely careful about letting your newborn anywhere near them especially until they've had their jabs at 8,12 and 16 weeks. And ask your GPs or HVs advice to make sure you'd be OK after that.

Jassy
By research I think political correctness means 'looked up some sh*t on the internet'

It's not really your business. You sister in law is not alone in this - I think she is wrong but there's nothing you can do about it. Let's hope her children, if they do catch anything, only have a mild version.

Anyone who chooses not to vaccinate their child is deluded.
Has anyone actually looked back at the history of diseases and it’s affects?

Sorry to hear that @oddboots. I hope they are ok

@politicalcorrectnessisgreat I'm an RN. I don't know any physicians, nurses or other medical professionals who don't vaccinate their children.

Do you have any proof otherwise, or just the usual anti-vaccination conspiracy theories and pseudo scientific gibberish?

No cool they are not ok. They probably feel like total shite, have bollocks the size of Wales and are lucky if they didn’t get encephalitis or meningitis, as well as infecting everyone around them.
Thanks stupid parents

Ridiculous, I'd be having serious conversation with them.both about the risks. After spending this last week with my sick DD who'd caught measles (thankfully mild case due to vaccination) despite being vaccinated I have little time for anti-vaxxers. Such a huge risk when it's so easily preventable. These diseases shouldn't be coming back

I never had any

I am not dead.

My friend's DS didn't have his and he is dead. From whooping cough.

But anecdote is not data, not being dead from a deadly disease doesn't mean no one dies from them, it doesn't mean everyone does either. But if you are the one parent who does lose their child then statistics are irrelevant, your life is 100% scarred by that avoidable tragedy.

You can't tell people they have to vaccinate, but I would expect people who have made that choice to at least have read everything they can on the subject so their choice is informed, rather than base it on the word of a friend.

the lowest take up of vaccines in the UK is probably in the richest area,
i think people are very ill-informed about vaccines. For instance a lot of the things we vaccinate against, there is zero chance a 6 week old baby will come into contact with, none of the vaccinations are 100% effective anyway.

The mother of two of the children in the original Andrew Wakefield trial posted on mumsnet on one of the live q&a talks about vaccines with a government expert, please read her posts before you make your minds up.

Have they not even had tetanus? I once looked after someone who died of tetanus. Not a good way to go.

This is an interesting book about a diphtheria outbreak in Nome, Alaska in 1925. As no one sees diphtheria any more the severity of the disease is not appreciated, but it is only thanks to vaccination that outbreaks like this no longer happen.

The Cruellest Miles: The Heroic Story of Dogs and Men in a Race Against an Epidemic by Gay Salisbury et al. The Cruellest Miles: The Heroic Story of Dogs and Men in a Race Against an Epidemic
by Gay Salisbury et al.
Link: amzn.eu/2w8rtoF

KurriKurri - the chance of dying from whooping cough in the UK is tiny, and there is no guarantee that the vaccine targets the same strain, will have worked.

For instance in the last big mumps outbreak in scotland every single person who caught mumps had been vaccinated.

They are both idiots. I would take advice from your health visitor or GP as to when your baby will be fully protected. I would then speak to your SIL and your brother (BIL?) I would tell them how unhappy you are that she put your newborn baby at risk. I would tell her that it is completely unacceptable and that until your baby has received her vaccinations and has full immunity that you do not want her to have any contact with their children.

I'm going to do exactly that Queen, yes.