Secretly filmed by DH - Ok to want space?

[papercoversrock]

Ok. Briefly as I can.

Week-long family event (DH's family) a good drive and ferry journey away. So DH, DS and myself travelled down and made a holiday out of it.

5 days into a 12-day-long stay, I discover that my DH filmed us having sex on his cameraphone the night before. It's around 3am and he's fast asleep. I did not know about or consent to the video. I feel shocked and embarrassed and hurt and furious. First time anything like this has happened to my knowledge.

In the morning, I confront DH about it. He leaves the room without a word, then comes back 5 mins later and apologises. He finds apologising hard, so I am touched by his apology, even though he does it in the manner of a 12-year-old being forced by the teacher to say sorry. Then we very quickly have to get ready to go to a family thing.
We then have 7 more days of enforced DH family fun, which I completely go along with, in order not to embarrass my husband or myself, or spoil things for DS. But DH is aware I want to take some distance for a while once we get home.

However, once home, I suggest a week apart from each other and DH's claws come out...

“A whole week? A week??!” “That's not right.” “What am I meant to do for a week?” “Well you can go but you're not taking DS.” And so on.

Am I being unreasonable? Does DH have a point here? I feel like he's lucky I went along to all the family things in the first place and should just say “thank you" and "take all the time you need."

Instead he gives the impression I'm the one being horrible and he's just putting up with my crazy shit.

I just want a week to clear my head.

All thoughts welcome. I know this is AIBU so am prepared to be set straight :)

Do not let him have time alone with your son.
Take you and your son away from this person that you can no longer trust.

I am sorry OP, this is a gross invasion of your privacy and consent. Given his reaction, its a msssive red flag to me that this isn't the first time. I too would be concerned on other videos uploaded online and would contact womens aid or the police.

You have painted your DH as a lackluster father so i am wondering if now you are panicking and grasping at things as deep down you know he has not been a good partner either. Do you have any trust for him now?

He obviously thinks you are overreacting as he Doesn't see what he's done is wrong or doesn't really care or respect your feelings. This is unsurprising as a respectful man wouldn't have secretly filmed his wife having sex.

It's creepy and illegal.

WarPigeon my suspicion would be it was filmed by a laptops cam or ipad which is easy to position and setup. And that he emailed it to himself and downloaded to phone. I have done similar with birthday clips.

Which adds credence to this not being his first time.

Cutielips second paragraph - read it OP, Cutielips is right, this is just more controlling and manipulative behaviour from him. And also the advice to not go to couples counselling - there is no point and no positive outcome to doing that.

Nope - there’s no hatred for your husband, we don’t know him. People are shocked by what you’re describing.

I very much agree with this, and the subsequent posts. I'm replying with concern and compassion for you, that's all.

I do understand why you don't want to divorce him or leave permanently. I actually think the women who immediately make that decision and follow through on it are extremely rare; most of us take time to come to terms with what our first realisation that maybe things are not as OK as we thought they were means for the rest of our relationship, and being able to face and accept it.

It has to be your choice, and a decision you make when you're ready to do so. Even if you don't want to do that right now, and/or you don't want to report him to the police, there is no harm in giving yourself options so that if you want to later you will be able to. Having options (like retaining a copy of the video, or gathering copies of important documents) doesn't mean you have to act on them, but it leaves you the possibility and means you won't find yourself backed into a corner later if you feel differently once the shock has subsided.

However, you've asked for advice and perspectives, so I can't stay silent on the fact that his response to you has been textbook coercive controller. This is far more serious than him making a "mistake" and then sulking about it. It is about him feeling entitled to do what he did, believing he has every right to have control of you, and acting accordingly.

I suspect you'll be reluctant to consider this because it might make what's happening all too real, but please give some thought to going on the Freedom Programme, www.freedomprogramme.co.uk.

They will never tell you to leave him, because that is absolutely your choice to make. Nor will they blame you or judge you. They won't even expect you to share anything that's happened if you don't want to, you can just listen. All they want to do is give you all the information you need to be able to understand what's going on here (in his reactions since as much as in what preceded it), give you back any perspective you might have lost, and put you in a position of power where you have all the information you need to decide what's right for you and your life - and your son's life.

Nobody is saying he's a monster; there's no such thing. Abusive behaviour - and I'm sorry, I know it's hard to hear (I came out in my abuser's defense when he was first called an abuser to me), but that's what this is - has nothing to do with monsters. All humans, including those capable of committing acts of abuse towards those close to them, have good and bad qualities. After all, no woman would ever end up with a man who would later abuse her if they were all 100% cruel and evil 100% of the time from the day they met. It's gradual. That's why several pp have referred to boiled frogs! (I assume you know the analogy).

You have nothing to lose by doing the Freedom Programme, and everything to gain. It's entirely confidential. They don't even keep attendance records.

I couldn’t stay with a man who did this, it’s a huge breach of trust and respect.

Having lived with an abusive man child for 9 years (who attempted this among other things) I would say LTB. It will not be the first time!

This is absolutely sick and illegal. And this is the only one you know about...

What a disgusting pervert!

Blimey, a lot of hatred for my husband here*

Well he is a sex offender? They are not generally liked!

Would anybody understand if I said I don't want to divorce him?

Not really.

Trust is gone. He has violated you.

Please, please don’t go to couples counselling. A man like this will either manipulate proceedings. He will either act contrite to get through the process and then revert back; try to manipulate the counsellor to put himself in a good light and paint you as the villain; or, refuse to engage if it’s going against him and say the counsellor is useless.

I've known people this has happened to, and this is an excellent summary of why couples counselling is never recommended in circumstances like yours. Please don't put yourself in that position.

That’s a gross breach of trust OP, and I’m afraid would be a deal breaker for me.

Trust in intimacy is a crucial part of any solid relationship, trust that they won’t do anything you don’t consent to is the crux of that.

He didn’t even ask for consent, let alone understand why you wouldn’t have given it and were so hurt by his actions.

Sex isn’t a right, it isn’t something he can manipulate for his own kicks, it’s something shared between you which should always, always have the full informed consent of both of you.

The fact that he can’t see that is worrying. That he’s minimising and has gone on the defensive to turn it round on you is worrying.

How many other times have there been that you don’t know about? If he doesn’t respect your right to consent to your sex life, what other boundaries would he overstep?

Lastly, you’ve told him you need space because he’s hurt you and let you down, badly. If he can’t respect that, and you give in, then all it does is tell him that he doesn’t have to respect you. Which is never a good thing.

He does something really bad - to you.

You find out for absolute sure that he has - this time...

He STILL tries to make it your fault???

The apology is not really an apology.... and yet you are "touched" by his apology??? So he doesn't usually apologise - why not? Why doesn't he usually aplogise when he is wrong? Red flag. Why did he do it this time? He saw that look on your face and feared you would say/do something in front of family!

Then attempts to give you the impression that you are in the wrong and being horrible with your crazy shit?!

You KNOW he is pulling the wool. You KNOW he has done stuff to you before that you didn't like and you have pushed the uncomfortable feelings away. he has explained it away....telling you that you were wrong/silly, and over reacting. You only get one chance at life. Live it with someone who worships you, not uses you....

I made that same decision myself.....very recently! It is tough but it will be better for you and ultimately your DS!!!

Op please wake up...
DO YOU REALLY THINK THIS IS THE FIRST TIME EVER????

OP, there have been previous posters who have had their partners film them without consent and then upload those videos online.

i think your minimising how serious this is.

It’s the first time you caught him committing a crime against you - he has fuck all to say apart from a mumbled semi apol “soz”, and he is being a manipulative shit when you have made the frankly paltry request for “space”

Wake the fuck up - you have good advice from others there are a lot of alarms and red flags in his behaviour - lack of remorse using your child as a pawn, control issues.

In your shoes I’d tell him he is a disgusting sex offender and he is very lucky I have not yet logged this with the police. Further, he is not taking our son camping to pretend to be dad of the year, that I was taking him to my parents for a week during which he won’t contact me unless I tell him otherwise. While away I would take all devices including his, do digging and consider reporting to the police

Sorry if this comes across as harsh but you sound like you are in shock and seriously undereactung. I’m livid on your behalf

Would anybody understand if I said I don't want to divorce him?

I would certainly understand that, because divorce is stressful, heartbreaking and life changing....

...but so is being married to a sex offender who doesn't parent unless it suits him.

I know you've seen other sides to him, OP, including ones that you love, but I can't get past this. Come on. If a friend of yours told you that her husband filmed her having sex without her knowledge or consent, then turned shitty when she confronted him, what would you tell her?

He doesn't even realise he's done anything wrong. Agree with all the others saying this is unlikely to be the first time he's done this.

He's not going to change; if you forgive him then he'll do it again. Don't stay in a relationship without any respect.

I am sorry to say that there are a lot of men out there who honestly believe that if they have a sexual urge for something, then they have a moral right to it. Because men's needs.

Women's needs to get away from these predators, on the other hand...

Oh he definitely knows he's done something wrong....

He's gaslighting. Would you talk to your local rape and sexual abuse centre OP or consider talking to the police?

I hope you deleted the footage OP.

What a vile dirty pig.

That would probably have been a dealbreaker for me.

And him being a nasty bastard afterwards would DEFINITELY be a dealbreaker.

What a cunt. Seriously.

I go bathshit on the rare occasion DH films me secretly putting the washing out or doing the washing up, because he thinks I look 'cute!' I don't, I look like a fat old harridan with a fat arse and saggy boobs (in MY eyes anyway He says I look like the day I met him.( I totally don't! )

I instantly delete the footage. I don't want anything on film (of me) that has been filmed without my knowledge.

Good luck with whatever you decide. But what you DH has done is WELL out of order!

I go BATSHIT, not bathshit haha FUCK IT MUMSNET GET AN EDIT BUTTON!

Sorry, I know I'm multi-posting but this is a topic very, very close to my heart. Trust and consent are so, so, so crucial within sex. They are what stop it from being abusive and criminal.

I've done some weird shit, but it was always consensual and set up so I would always be safe. The man who does not care about your consent does not, by logical extension, care about your wellbeing. As further proven by the fact that he attempts to guilt trip you and exploit your son after he is found out. Think about that.

I'm sure he was nice to you a few times once upon a time, OP, but that's chameleons for you. This is who he really is. The person you loved is a mask.

I agree with previous posters. Gross invasion of privacy and trust.

I’d be doing some digging on his devices for anything else he might’ve done.

His reaction is very disturbing. He should be full of apologies...

He should be the one leaving, not you - but I understand that might not be an option.

The hatred for your husband is because what he has done is such a violation. I don’t think I could ever get over it. To know I was so disrespected, so objectified. It would kill the relationship for me. I couldn’t live with someone who valued me so little that they felt justified in doing something like this. It’s perverted and it’s a crime.

YANBU to want space. You wouldn’t be unreasonable to leave him either. Relationships cannot exist without trust and how could you ever, ever trust him again?

I would leave my husband if it did this to me. No question. It is massive breach of trust and privacy.

Taking one week to consider and reflect what has happened is perfectly reasonable and measured response, his reaction is very worrying and I would be wondering what else he has done without my knowledge.

Your need for space is paramount

OP, don't let him take your son. Don't let him be in control of this situation. It is YOUR turn to call the shots and decide what happens from this point forward.

It is entirely up to you if you forgive your husband for this but please be aware that it's highly unlikely that this is the first time he'll have filmed you.
I've been there, I deleted the video and life went on. He was sorry, it was the only time he'd done it, he wouldn't do it again... Until eight months later when a friend sent me a link to a video online and there I was. Not the same video I had seen before. He had dozens of videos of me, and all he got was a slap on the wrist because I couldn't prove I didn't consent to these videos.
Don't keep yourself in this vulnerable position OP, it's not worth it. You deserve a million times more than a man that violates your trust like this.