This wasn't flirting... help I need some perspective

[peoniepants]

I’m at my wits end and feeling desperate.

My husband is acting like a right fucker towards me.

I need some perspective.

Whole family at family themed place yesterday - families there and my husband too. My daughter starts playing with a younger child. I got chatting to the Dad whilst they were playing. He was nice enough - but not attractive and not my type, just a nice bloke. I didn’t fancy him and was chatting to him whilst waiting for my daughter to finish playing with his kid.

My husband is in the vicinity but doesn’t come over. Afterwards he kicks off. Apparently he was listening to our conversation out of sight and I was flirting and acting like a whore (which is bollocks! I know myself!). Also he says I was talking to this guy for far too long. He has massively overreacted and stormed out this morning for the whole day leaving me with no car and two kids upset and worrying where daddy is. I’ve just tried to talk to him again but he has got it fixed in his head that I was flirting and disrespecting him by doing it right in front of him. I won’t back down. I’m not going to ‘admit’ to something I haven’t done.

He’s really angry and has escalated massively and he has thrown my out of the bedroom (for 2 nights now) , acting like a man child and the kids know something is very wrong. He has form with doing this kind of shit.

I’ve told him that the kids are upset and we need to discuss it rationally but he doesn’t seem to care about that. Says he’s going out all day tomorrow as well.

I am so tired of his behaviour. He does this every time I ‘upset’ him. It’s so frustrating.

Also it’s my sons birthday next week and I already think he’s going to ruin it but either being in a huge mood or just storming off for the day. I don’t think I could forgive that.

Such a fucking child.

Do you or he know what causes the insecurity?

That is very familiar to me. My mother is a bit of complex person. I'd say the crux was she would be festering on a perceived slight and would save up her revenge for a big ticket day IYKWIM. Maximize the misery. She enjoyed have the power over situations.

Growing up she was the only driver and I remember one particular occasion when she purposefully made my brother late for a school cricket match. He was at a very strict grammar and she knew he'd get in shit for it. She sat chain smoking cigarette after cigarette, refusing to leave until the time the match started. My dad was begging her. My brother was begging her. I was crying (I was 8ish). And there'd been no warning/no row/no bad behaviour from my brother.

I'd urge you to really consider leaving. It's a horrible existence.

I wouldn't be married to a man like this. Whether he's projecting or not is irrelevant....his behaviour towards you is unacceptable.

Does he have form for this irrational jealousy?

Kicks you out of your bedroom? The aggression is another way of punishing you.

He's abusive. You don't recognise it yet...but he is abusive.

Picking fights and storming off is something cheaters do ....then go out and see the OW/OM.

Thanks! I've told him that his behaviour is really upsetting the kids but he doesn't care. Says I'm emotionally blackmailing him. I've spent so much energy arguing with him and trying to make him understand I wasn't flirting. It's driving me mad. I know I wasn't FFS!!! He said I was being subtle. Subtle flirting. Wtf!!

Every time you apologise to 'keep the peace'
Every time you 'are kicking yourself for having a normal conversation that can be taken the wrong way' you are enabling this behaviour.
Please please don't show your daughter that this is how she should react to a bully of a man.
Stand up and protect yourself and your children.
You. Have. Done. Nothing. Wrong.

If he has any inclination to want this to work, he stops any abusive language, he agrees to counselling, he doesn't fucking dictate where you sleep!
But please, claw back some control here before the kids become ill worrying you are all worth more.

He's been having counselling - it all stems from being abandoned by his mother as a child. He is massively projecting onto me. She was a flirt and used to humiliate his dad according to him and he has said he won't let that happen to him. So he massively overreacts to things. It's exhausting.

He said he doesn't want me in the bed because he doesn't want to be near me. I've told him I've done nothing wrong a million times and it has really angered him. He didn't like hearing it. I've told him tonight that I can't carry on like this and it has to change for the kids and us. I've also written a letter to him/me that I can use once it has calmed down to hopefully sort with a counsellor.

I'm genuinely sorry your husband had that experience as a child. But you (and your children) can't be put through these impossible hoops to prove you will stay. It will mess your children up to be around this. They have seen/heard enough to ask if you're getting divorced and it's just not possible to shield them from it.

My mum was also keen on setting up tests that we would fail. We were held to impossibly high standards and yet her own behaviour was..shit really.

If he's been having counselling, he obviously knows there's something wrong.
My OH used to be similar - when we first got together we used to stay around our friends places. He used to tell me not to wear a anything to bed, then start having a go when his mates saw me in my knickers and nothing else. I couldn't win, but he gradually stopped being an idiot

That's exactly it Frayedhem. He sets me tasks - as in he tells me what I'm doing wrong and how I need to be better at sex, give him more compliments, make him feel special etc but nothing is ever good enough. It only helps on the short term and this behaviour pattern always happens.

Sounds like you are in an emotionally abusive relationship. It only ever gets worse, never better. Make an escape plan. I am afraid at some point you will need it. In the meanwhile do not let him isolate you any more than he already has.

Oh OP, just tell him to piss right off!!!!!!!!!!!!
He won't change! Ever!!!!
He's being allowed to upset your kids constantly!

The uncertainty and fear will damage them! I know! It happened to me!
Tell him if he can't behave normally, he will have to leave!
Tell him that you have had enough of his shit and your not having it any more.
And mean it!

Too often men use what was done to them as a child to excuse them abusing their wife and children. It is bullshit. He knows he is abusing you and he does it because he believes he is entitled to.

It is getting worse. The time between episodes is getting shorter. There have been about 6 stormings off this year so far.

Also, they do it because it works to get them what they want.
It doesn't work very well, but it works. He has your undivided attention now, eh?

I'm sorry but I wouldn't be apologising for shit. Honestly, why are you rolling over and letting him treat you like this? I would have been, and have been in the past, apocalyptic about being kicked out of my own bed. And about ruining Christmas, birthdays, special days out. He needs to stop this shit pronto.
Do you really not think your kids aren't going to get older and think what's the point in doing anything because he's going to ruin it? This is no life to live.

Does the counsellor know the extent of his behaviour? Would it be viable to have a joint session with them?
Honestly, it sounds like you are being used as an outlet for this pent up abandonment, logistically could you part while he works through his issues? Because if you stay, by the time he is anywhere close, you'll resent him that much that you may not even want to be with him.
You can't 'fix' him, I imagine you realised this some time ago, but it will really have an effect on the DCs.

One of my DCs was really upset last night, we had imaginary tummy ache/leg ache/itchy arm etc, after some careful digging, it transpired that she was very worried that we had no money and she may become homeless (she's 7)
This was based purely on the fact that DH and I have thrown a few 'we can't afford that' around over the summer holidays.
What I'm trying to say badly is that they take the smallest thing and get their little selves so upset and catastrophize.
We need to be minimising this for them, not leaving the door open for their heads to run wild. Your DH is going to have them feeling as fucked yo as he did. Does he acknowledge that?

I agree. Make an escape plan. You can't fix this. He doesn't want it to be fixed. He'll keep finding sticks to beat you with. He is sabotaging himself but don't let him take you and the children down with him.

My parents separated/divorced/remarried/separated/reconciled/separated/reconciled/separated from me being age 9 until I was 26!! when they finally separated for good. Don't be them. Be smart.

abuse is not an excuse.
when they start dragging out words like disrespecting and emotional blackmail......so much psychobabble to make you feel bad
not your job

You need to read this book. Your husbands cycle of abuse is in there.
unityandstruggle.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf
Your library may have a hard copy you can check out.
The result of abusive men going to counseling is that they learn all the jargon and use it to excuse themselves and claim you are abusing them. DenyAttackReverseVictimandOffender. DARVO

If I could go back and give myself some advice I would.

I would tell myself not ever to underestimate the damage an abusive relationship can do to children. Even if you think they are protected.
Especially when efforts are never good enough. It sets up deep feelings of constant failure that may never mend.

I'd say take the children and leave. At least until he has started to successfully work through problems and solutions with counselling.

It's sounding as though counselling is painfully making him relive memories and maybe this time should be spent apart until he's sorted out his head.

I'm not saying divorce him, I'm saying take the damage he is causing out of the relationship until he's stable.

Let me guess- he never storms off with the kids either? So you are left holding the fort, keeping things together and ding all the parenting while he nurses his self employe induced sulk? It sounds like a pretty convenient way of opting out of large parts of family life as well- how convenient!

I feel for you. Very difficult situation to be in. As you say, he's got insecurity issues and has got used to getting his way by throwing tantrums. At the same time, it's important for you to not to make any hasty decisions out of anger. He's lovely much of the time, he's already been for counselling (something a lot of men are too proud to engage in), and at times he does realise that he's been out of order (again, not all men would do that). Things shouldn't carry on as they are - not good for anyone, but I'm a huge believer in making marriages work (especially with kids in the picture), and would really recommend you approach specific marriage counselling with him once this episode passes over. I don't think fighting fire with fire and making threats will be constructive.

My dad used to always accuse Mum of having affairs etc, which I grew up thinking was normal and a sign of love.

Of course now I know it’s not but I’m just wanting to put it out there to say that if you stick with h the role modeling for your children will minimise their own chances at decent relationships when they are older

I wasted so many years in a relationship like this. I think it is very difficult for men with mother issues to learn how to think about women in a rational way and behave appropriately. I hate to think of the me that used to change my behavior trying to meet totally unreasonable expectations. No amount of ‘usually lovely’ is worth this shit. Do consider all your options. Sorry this is happening to you.