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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to feel car driving is frequently unjustified

999 replies

Clairetree1 · 08/08/2018 09:18

Having sat in a traffic jam yesterday, in which I counted 10 buses being held up by around 45 cars, many of which only had one person in.

So say 60 people in cars holding up 600 people in buses....

just as a snapshot, throughout the whole journey, each person in a car seems to hold up 10 people in a bus, and if the cars were not there, those car travelers could easily fit on the buses, and everyone would be moving at least 3x as fast,

and I can't really see how this is allowed, or can be justified.

If you are in a city, or in another area with an adequate bus route, and are physically able to use the bus, how do you justify to yourself the danger, inconvenience and lethal pollution you subject everyone else to? Not to mention the further damage to the environment caused by concreting over parking spaces, car manufacture, etc.

I know some people are going to say they need the time, but if cars were banned from our cities and more people on public transport, everyone would be moving faster.

I know some people are going to say they are disabled, or have too much to carry, but some people who are disabled or have a lot to carry do use buses, they often have no choice! it doesn't automatically preclude you.

I know some people are just going to say they have a right to, but really, do you? Pollution is killing thousands of people a year in the UK, not to mention those killed in car crashes, the environmental damage done including global warming, and the sheer inconvenience to everybody else.

I know a couple of cities are planning on banning private cars, and I know petrol cars are on their way out, so things might well improve, but I just don't understand how we reached this position in the first place, so much death and destruction and time taken away by an entitled privileged few with such a selfish habit I can't understand how they justify to themselves.

I don't expect many people to agree with me, I think this privilege is so deeply ingrained in our culture that people genuinely feel they have a right to drive cars, when perfectly adequate public transport exist.

I don't think there is any moral right at all though, I think it is morally wrong in every way

OP posts:
Jeanclaudejackety · 08/08/2018 22:29

What the fuck is this abstract idea of family life and how do we pay for it if not for these careers that are so awful?!

MrSpock · 08/08/2018 22:29

what’s wrong with people having careers?

Individually, nothing.

But society wise, everyone chasing a career leaves less time for voluntary acticities, family time, recreation and leaves society a much colder, unfriendly place. We lost something when society moved to having both parents working as the norm.

Nicknacky · 08/08/2018 22:29

How does volunteering pay the bills? Or the other activities you mentioned.

(Not to mention I don’t want to do any of them)

Horridhenry88 · 08/08/2018 22:29

Buses are expensive and often there is no direct route. Trains are cheaper for short distances but often the station is not central.
For example I needed to go to a Town about 8 miles away. Takes maybe 15 minutes by car. One day I didn't have my car. Took me 30 minutes to walk from my house to the station. Another 30 minutes waiting and travelling on the train as late. Being at the mercy of other passengers to help me with buggy up and down steps. Another 30 minute walk to get to the Town. Not surprisingly I haven't been since by public transport.

MrSpock · 08/08/2018 22:30

having a career doesn’t necessarily exclude those things. Many careers have a positive impact on society and community. Being career minded doesn’t mean at the exclusion of community values and family .

Sometimes it doesn’t, you’re right. My belief is that one wage should be able to support a family, as NMW was intended, and then families should have the option of one or two parents working instead of both being forced to which can often lead to family life and community life being neglected.

Jeanclaudejackety · 08/08/2018 22:30

Take it you're not a single parent?

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 08/08/2018 22:30

@mrspock....your list of what it means to be community’s focussed, apart from neighbour hood watch , I do all of those as part of my career.....and some.

Mynamesblurryface · 08/08/2018 22:30

Because the buses stink of urine the seats and floors are filthy and the clientele they attract are horrible. Maybe if they smartened up their act and got new buses and kept them clean people would use them. Its also cheaper to drive for me than to buy a bus ticket several times a day

MrSpock · 08/08/2018 22:31

How does volunteering pay the bills? Or the other activities you mentioned.

It doesn’t, my point is that wages should be in line with living costs that support one parent being able to support a family.

MrSpock · 08/08/2018 22:32

your list of what it means to be community’s focussed, apart from neighbour hood watch , I do all of those as part of my career.....and some.

You can have a career that is what I’d class as a “positive” career, such as teaching, nursing, police etc.

MrSpock · 08/08/2018 22:32

I don’t mean you can as in allowed, I mean it is possible.

Nicknacky · 08/08/2018 22:32

But many families don’t want to have only one parent working. I can afford to stay at home but I don’t. I have a career and that will never be wrong in anyone’s book.

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 08/08/2018 22:33

@mrspock I believe there are great benefits to have two working parents.

Jeanclaudejackety · 08/08/2018 22:33

A family with one parent at home and one nursing is not a family that can afford to do... Well... Anything really 😂

Nicknacky · 08/08/2018 22:36

WTF is a “positive career”?! And what’s a negative one?

MrSpock · 08/08/2018 22:36

But many families don’t want to have only one parent working. I can afford to stay at home but I don’t. I have a career and that will never be wrong in anyone’s book.

You’ll find a lot don’t have a choice. It’s not wrong but the choice should be there.

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 08/08/2018 22:36

@nicknacky ....same here. I choose to work and it’s the best decision all round.

@mrspock there are many jobs which have a huge benefit to society which fall out of your realm of approved jobs. There’s also the benefit of women having progressed to a stage where it’s passionless to have a career and a family. That is a good thing!

agnurse · 08/08/2018 22:37

I live in Canada. We don't have the same level of public transit as you do in Europe. Every day I have to drive an hour to go to work. Let me explain.

I live in a rural community. The nearest community where I could get a bus is a 20-25 minute drive. Then I would have to park and get the bus to the city where I work. That bus only runs during morning and evening rush hour. The bus would drop me off at the tram station. I would need to get a tram to a station near my work and walk to work. Ballpark it would take me probably about twice as long to get to work - and I have to be at work at 8 a.m., sometimes earlier. Did I also mention that when I teach clinical I have to be there at times when that bus doesn't run?

"But why don't you just move closer?" Two issues with that. Housing prices in the city are MUCH higher. We probably couldn't afford a house. On top of that, we have shared custody of my stepdaughter and her mum isn't willing to move.

"But why don't you get a job closer?" I did have one closer. This new job is a step forward in my career. Not to mention that even if I DID get a job closer, it's quite a lengthy walk to the hospital from our house. Our community is so small we don't have transit of any kind. Plus, how would we buy groceries? Our community store has limited options and tends to be more expensive. We can't buy clothing or electronics in town. "But you could order them online!" Yes, and then have a long walk home carrying the parcels from the post office.

My husband also can't get a job in our town as there are no opportunities here for him. Having 2 vehicles is essential for us.

MrSpock · 08/08/2018 22:37

A family with one parent at home and one nursing is not a family that can afford to do... Well... Anything really

That’s untrue. Depends on your outgoings.

MrSpock · 08/08/2018 22:38

there are many jobs which have a huge benefit to society which fall out of your realm of approved jobs. There’s also the benefit of women having progressed to a stage where it’s passionless to have a career and a family. That is a good thing!

There’s a benefit of women have a choice, most do not.

Nicknacky · 08/08/2018 22:38

MrsSpock You will also find that just as many parents chose to work.

Most of my social group chose to work.

crazycatgal · 08/08/2018 22:39

@MrSpock You've said on another thread that your DP is very career motivated, so maybe emphasise community duty and family life to him before everyone else.

Feedthemachine1 · 08/08/2018 22:39

@etymology23
have you been inside a cycle factory ,they are as bad as a car factory as they use the same materials , and as there is as little cycle manufacturing as car manufacturing in this country there is the environmental cost of transporting them here.
ok after that its only disposing of the broken ones that then cause pollution which i agree is better than motorised transport , but they arent as eco as people think.
i used to love cycling everywhere but due to asthma i can't now ,ironically the asthma may be due to pollution.

agnurse · 08/08/2018 22:39

Even if we did have Hubby staying at home we would still need two vehicles. Someone has a doctor's appointment? Have to get there. It's a long walk from our house to the clinic. Need to get groceries? That's a fair walk too. No public transit in our small town.

ImNotAsGreenasImCabbageLooking · 08/08/2018 22:40

my point is that wages should be in line with living costs that support one parent being able to support a family.

That would be great MrSpock but the simple reality is that for most people it's just not the case.

We all have to exist in the world we live in right now. IF the Op was having a rant about 2 car households when only one was needed I might see their point but they're not. They're ignoring the here and now reality, despite dozens of posters outlining the difference car v public transport makes to them, in order to berate and lecture.

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