Setting the bar low for fathers

[GoatWithACoat]

The more I observe IRL and on parenting forums, the more I feel frustrated at the parenting bar being set so low for non resident fathers.

Examples; “Ok he doesn’t pay but at least he sees them” (twice a month)

“Well at least your ex pays, mine doesn’t pay anything so you should be grateful”

I’m not sure if I abandoned my kids, rolled up twice / once a month and paid the bare minimum required by law to raise them people would consider me a great mum.

X Factor last year, several single mums came to audition. One single dad came on and they ran a VT showing him feeding and playing with his daughter like it was the most incredible thing ever.

Was in the park a while ago and heard a couple of women go, ‘awww look isn’t that lovely.’ It was a bloke pushing his kid on a swing!

AIBU to think that in general, the bar is set so low for fathers and the attitude that women should ‘be grateful’ for any crumbs of parenting / domestic chores completed by a man, is really damaging?

I agree and also think nrps who don't pay child maintenance should be jailed.

I don't get why anyone would have children with somebody that didn't pull their weight in the house and had a decent work ethic.

Oh my ex had a fantastic work ethic; up at five every day, come at seven, good salary etc. The novelty of most of that salary being spent on a wife and children soon wore off and then once the relationship was over and he was no longer invested in us it became very easy to play ostrich and pretend he'd done his bit or ignore us all together.

You do realise people change don't you? That children challenge a relationship, are hard work and cost a lot of money and some people just aren't up to that and that you can't ever know for sure until children arrive and then you can't exactly send them back if their Dad turns out to be a selfish fucker.

Absolutely true!!! I've done every night feed and woke every morning with our baby since birth. DH has got up ONE morning with her even when I've done night feeds. And his mum praised him like he was God's gift. I could have bloody punched her!

Love this thread!

I get sick of hearing how wonderful my ex-H is from his friends because he sees DS every other weekend and takes him watching football (which he loves to be fair).

I'm the one who keeps a nice roof over his head, pays the bills, feeds and clothes him and pays for treats and holidays. He always does his homework at home at ex-H doesn't have wifi.

Ex-H hasn't paid any maintenance for 18 months. He's happy claiming sick benefits. He recently went to the World Cup but says he has no money towards DS's school uniform. Thinks he's a hero as he goes without gas and electricity for a week so he can buy football tickets.

One of his friends slagged me off for buying DS a few designer t-shirts as I was showing ex-H up!

I regularly get told what a credit DS is to us both - no he bloody isn't - he is a credit to me. If it was down to ex-H he wouldn't be fed or clothed properly and his homework would never get done. I insist he has chores to do, so he will learn to become and independent adult. Ex-H doesn't bother as his house is a mess and he hoards. He's shit with money, drinks and gambles.

He's turned up at school to meet him, when he's been pissed.

Most of his mates think he's a great Dad - he's not - he's a complete knob head.

Nice to be able to have a moan - I don't do it in front of DS as he loves his Dad. I just say nothing, as DS knows he's a dick.

He's taken him off to football for the day today with no hat or sun cream, but the wanker will still be seen as Dad of the Year.

My exh worked right up to dc's birth, earning a good wage and working hard. I had to go back to work fulltime when dc was four months old because a job ex had been promised never materialised. He didn't work again for five years. Miraculously he managed to find a job within two months of us splitting up. He now has the cheek to criticise his new partner for 'sitting on her arse all day' when their child isn't even nursery age. He also fought to keep the child benefit when he has only had dc overnight once in six months and still doesn't pay maintenance. Apparently seeing dc every couple of weeks for a few hours and taking them on holiday still means he is a fabulous father

As others have said the low bar extends to the whole domestic sphere, if not further.

Calling out this type of bias is crucial if we want things to change, as is the way we educate our children.

I have been having 'epiphanies' of late and am quite cross with myself that it has taken me this long (mid 40s) to see things for what they are, including in my own life (personal and professional).

The social conditioning of females to be compliant, self-effacing, self-sacrificing and that of males to be assertive, entitled and to feel superior sickens me.

Mini rant over!

I don't think it's just necessarily just a low parenting bar for men, just that it's more obvious on a site that's aimed at women

It’s hugely in favour of men. The experiences on here are taken from real life, the media, everyday interactions. Unless you have your head in the sand or have another agenda then I cannot see how you can say this doesn’t by and large affect women disproportionately.

But then I do think you have another agenda as you have been very vocal on other threads benefit bashing and judging people (often single mothers) who have been literally left holding the baby while men fuck off and play Disney Dad.

I agree to an extent but also feel that if we want to see fathers step up then it's important that it's normalised and celebrated.

Its not that dissimilar to all the encouragement to get girls into STEM subjects - we never hear the same about getting boys into Engineering, for example.

This thread is great. And absolutely spot on.

My ex lives miles away - other side of the country. Sees his kids only cos he feels he has too. You can tell he's not bothered either way. They run up to him open armed....so happy to see him. He hugs them but I can see it in his face...the level of love isn't the same.

He pays maintenance and thinks that's all he has to do as a father.

However yesterday he came to ds bday party and acted like he should be treated as a f**king king for travelling all that way. Even though he was the one that moved.

Dick.

Also a couple of weeks ago he told me I was controlling as I said he dcs couldn't meet his new gf....only because he'd only been split up with the last one for 3 days

Totally agree. The bar is underground.

I totally agree, thank god for mums picking up the pieces and doing double duty. What would happen if there were no mums, kids would have to go into care as the deadbeat dad's would not be able to look after them.

I agree to an extent but also feel that if we want to see fathers step up then it's important that it's normalised and celebrated

Unfortunately, they are hero worshipped for doing the bare minimum, that’s not normalising it.

It’s also not ok to normalise dads doing parenting when single mums are pained as feckless, money grabbing, scroungers, controlling, manipulative, stupid, bitches and all manner of other derogatory things.

‘painted’

Completely agree.

And this winds my DH up more than anyone I know. He says he gets comments when he takes the kids out to the supermarket or to the park either in the vein of 'ooh look Dad is babysitting today' (no he is parenting his children) or 'oh isn't that so lovely to see, how marvellous' (no he is parenting his children)!

I think it goes way deeper than just taking the kids to the park too.

Things like how involved they are with school etc.

My ex....not a clue. Now I've already said he lives miles away so it's not like I expect him to drive all the way to come to parents evening. But I always let him know when it is....he always says he will call me afterwards to see how they are getting on. Does he? Nope. Does he even know what year his children are in? Nope. Who their friends are? Nope.

Dd takes her homework to her dads. She's 6. She brings it back and she's done it but she's only written 3 words, all spelt wrong. No pictures. No colouring in. Nothing. So we have to re do it.

He was going to buy her a peppa pig kitchen for her 7th birthday. 'She likes peppa doesn't she?' Was what he said. 'Yep she did about 4 years ago....' was my reply.

He's a dad that sees them but only because he has too and he has his ego at stake....he likes everyone to feel sorry for him.
'Oh poor you living so far from your kids, that must be so hard on you etc'

That's literally the only reason he sees them. He doesn't actually know his kids at all.

jelly I practically could have written your post!
I'm pretty sure ds dad doesn't know where ds school is exactly, or who his form teacher was last year, or which school trips he went on.
He complains that ds doesn't ring him anymore or tell him anything about his life...Er...you showed interest about 3 times a year for 12 years dick wad. You reap what you sew.
I changed every nappy and earned all the money and went to every sports day and play. I know my son's current obsessions, what tv programmes he likes, who his closest friends are, what he's scared of, his hopes and dreams.
His father doesn't even know what he doesn't know iyswim.
Oh, and of course it's my fault ds has no relationship with his dad. Even though had I died ds probably have gone into care, as the arsehole is so fucking useless.

Colditz I am stunned. How can he not have been jailed?

And the worst thing is the fuckers believe it themselves, and expect us to fall at their feet in gratitude for any tiny thing they do. My STBEX could not be bothered to prepare the formula properly for our twins; he doesn't add enough water and heaps the scoops. When I saw this he acted like its too much hassle and that I should be grateful he preps the bottles at all. Well strangely enough I'm not grateful that my babies have been suffering with gas and constipation. TWAT.

There are so many instances like the above, but he won't hear that he's lazy, I'm lucky he's 'helping' raise his own kids. I've stopped asking him to do anything (and he's not allowed near the bottles) since I figure I need to get used to doing everything when I've left him anyway, and at least I know its done properly.

SPB, everyone involved denied it and the CPS said ds1 was an unreliable witness. Which, as a seven year old with learning difficulties, he was.

I agree to an extent but also feel that if we want to see fathers step up then it's important that it's normalised and celebrated.

The problem is that when men are already being hero worshiped for doing very little, there's no incentive for them to do more.

My ex used to be affronted when I asked him to help with anything after he'd brought our DD back from swimming. I wonder if it's because he was being praised to the skies while he was there, left feeling like a hero, then came back to me asking why he still hadn't done the various things he was supposed to do.

And men ultimately always have that option of saying "Nah, fuck it" and walking away, that women don't really have. Because women don't have the "get out of jail free" card which is to blame the woman. My ex was not paying towards our DCs, was not seeing them, yet everyone around him was sympathetic because he'd say I was "keeping him from his kids". There was that time I didn't let him in on a Friday night when he turned up wanting to shag me, so I was "keeping him from his kids" who of course were also in the house. Perhaps he was planning to say hello to them in the morning before he left, who knows? But men know it only takes a few buzzwords and phrases to get all the sympathy on their side. We can't use "keeping me from my kids" because we are usually the ones who got left alone to care for the kids.

Yes greenmeerkat my dp gets pretty amused when he gets praised for taking the twins out/ cooking dinners/ changing nappies. Luckily for me he sees the irony in it!

Hell yes, OP, you are bang on.

My parents did equal shares of house/child work, and I insisted from the start that me and DH did similar.

We have had rocky moments in our marriage, (due to illness) but I think this shared work is one of the things that keeps us together - we both wonder what we'd do without each other!

I sometimes have wondered how much absentee and other degrees of shit father's cost society in terms of talk therapy, anti-depressants, criminal activity, poor decision making etc in their abandoned offspring.

I think the problems caused by absent father's are so common now that we've just accepted it as part of our society.

What's so odd as well is that these men abandoning their kids were likely barely doing much in terms of the responsible work for bringing up the child, yet they're the ones who feel burdened by their children?

@IfNotNowThenWhen1 feel for you and your ds. My dcs just think their dad is great. And i just stay impartial. I never ever slag their dad off to their faces and never will. I want them to make their own minds up on their father - and I have lots of people around me who say in a few years, they will wake up and realise who is there and who has brought them up. A trip to McDonald's every other weekend (which is what he does) isn't going to be enough to keep them happy forever.

So I'm just waiting for that day to come. And when it does, I know I'll feel nothing but sadness for my dcs.

We've been split up 5 years now. For the first couple, I kept the ex informed with absolutely everything. Ds has some health issues etc. So every appointment etc is ring him with the outcome. Every time something happened at school I'd tell him. I thought it was my job too.

But I started to realise after every phone call or series of messages that I'd feel increasingly frustrated and that was due to the lack of f**ks give by the ex.

Then one night ds got rushed to hospital with suspected meningitis. Rang the ex in a panic straight away. Drs were extremely worried. Ex's response 'I'll try come see him tomorrow if it's bad'.

From that moment I gave up. I no longer tell him anything. I no longer get the dcs to ring them through the week. If he wants to speak to them he can.

I realised I had enough on my plate bringing 2 dcs up alone and I was wasting energy on him.

A few months ago my friend referred to these type of dads as 'fun uncles'. These are the type that do the fun things every now and then and to them that's enough. They are not a parent though. I thought it was bang on at describing my dcs father.

100% agree. I started a thread a couple of weeks ago as there was a story in the news about Jack P Shepherd (Corrie's David Platt) passing out in an elevator and going up and down all night, a fan had snapped him and he shared it on social media with a 'hilarious' comment.

I posted that I thought if a mother of three (of whom one child she never sees) did this she'd be lambasted as irresponsible, not fit enough to be a mother etc, but Jack was lauded as some sort of court jester. Most people agreed with me but some posters were in utter denial that men are set lower standards.

It infuriates me and I always check people on it! I don't care if I sound like a misery guts or feminazi, it's important that we don't allow this