To be unsurprised that Corbyn is still being called anti-semitic?

[crunchymint]

Corbyn has been quite happy over the years to work with those who are clearly anti-Semitic. And he continues to do so. Whilst at the same time saying that he condemns all forms of racism, recently changed to say he condemns anti semitism. Does he not realise yet that people judge him by his actions, not his broad statements which are pretty meaningless? And until he clearly shows in his actions that he condemns anti semitism, these allegations will continue?

I don't think that JC is anti Semitic but he is not on the side of Jewish people.There is a difference. So much so that Labour anti-semites feel they can say what they like about Jewish people and not face any consequences. JC is not clamping down on hate speech. He's a champagne London socialist who clings to his 1960's/70's beliefs like a limpet.

Sorry not read through the thread, so don’t know whether this article has been put up. www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/03/jeremy-corbyn-antisemitism-labour-party

@Togaandsandals yes it has. As has the fact its a big cut and paste job from his article in April.

Also noted that it was released on a Friday evening!

You have to wonder how being shitstains to Jews can be worth such a big fuss. I mean your average traditional core Labour voter (as was) won't hate Jews, indeed will probably tend to disapprove of anti-semitism if they care at all.

I guess if you were looking for who they see as their voter base now, audiences anti-semitism plays well for might be a start.

Labour is now a massive public sector/union employee voter block voting in its own interests, they have utterly binned the British underclass they have created amongst their former traditional core vote, don't care about them or their votes (they won't even protect their children from harm when elected) and they now look to bolster their numbers with impressionable students/hoorays and various other ne'erdowells that anti-semitism, supporting hamas and so on will play well to.

I have read through most of the thread now. It has been really helpful, especially Bananafish’s posts, and I am clearer now that Corbyn has not dealt with antisemitism for a long time now by some people in his party.

Glad it's been helpful @Togaandsandals

May I ask you, genuinely not intended as a loaded question, what you understood the accusations of antisemitism within the Labour party to mean?

I ask because I'm really interested that there's been a few posters who've expressed surprise at the specific examples I pointed out, saying they weren't aware of these incidents, and that yes in their opinion these were unquestionably unacceptable.

It suggests to me that the coverage in the press has been so focused on Corbyn and the Palestinian cause, that the actual tangible incidents of antisemitism within the party have been overlooked, and thus the nub of the issue is actually poorly appreciated (that Corbyn and the NEC have been reticent to do anything about them)

Would be really interested to understand what you thought before reading the thread, and if you feel differently now having done so?

Obvs understand if you'd prefer not to answer, and don't mean this in any critical way. It's more about trying to understand the impact of how it's been covered in the media

I am a naturalized Brit and I remember how wonderul and exciting it felt to participate in the democratic process( vote). Well I have finally come to the realisation that this thing called democracy is nothing but a show where only those who have real power get to choose. We might as well be like one of those evil undemocrtaic states. At lleast they are real

I am also a naturalised Brit and I still have faith in the democratic process.

My vote may be an insignificant drop in the totality. But all our votes add up and we can collectively remove someone from power. This is a luxury that many in the world do not have.

@bananafish81, I think I thought for all Corbyn’s faults, he has stood up for minorities for decades, so I struggled to believe he was anti Semitic. I think I thought there will have been a few isolated incidents of Labour members on the fringes who have said horrible anti Semitic comments, as anti-semitism exists in society, sadly, but the press (which much of it is right wing) have used it as a smear campaign against Corbyn. I realise now how naive and wrong I was and that Corbyn and his party should have done much more and made clear there was zero tolerance against any Labour member who made an antisemitic remark and as someone said on here by not doing so he is being antisemitic by proxy at the very least. I apologise for how wrong I read it.

Iam a naturalized Brit and I remember how wonderul and exciting it felt to participate in the democratic process( vote). Well I have finally come to the realisation that this thing called democracy is nothing but a show where only those who have real power get to choose. We might as well be like one of those evil undemocrtaic states. At lleast they are real

I agree.

The sad thing is that millions of people don't give a single shit about what has happened to UK democracy and freedom, indeed seem to like the idea of dispensing with both when it is convenient to them.

People get the governments they deserve, which is why I will probably emigrate and live a peaceful life somewhere a bit more 1st world.

@Togaandsandals thank you for saying that.

These threads are so depressing. There is always the assumption that Jewish people are a homogenous group that are all represented by the Board of Deputies British Jews which only represents an ‘established’ part of the population.
Israel has the most right-wing government it has ever had and there are myriad Jewish organisations opposing its practices (including the recent racist vote subjugating the Israeli Arab population).
Yet the media ignores these Jewish voices and instead bolsters right-wing islamophobic positions that will eventually lead to anti-Semitism as well. I feel very worried about this. I know that with the rise of the far right in EUrope a Corbyn government can be counted on MORE than the Tories to oppose fascism and protect ALL Jewish people interests.

Thank you @Togaandsandals, that's very much appreciated

It does make me wonder how prevalent this perception is - as it strikes me that the actual nub of the problem is being lost in the debate. Thank you again for acknowledging the problem, it means a lot

Israel has the most right-wing government it has ever had and there are myriad Jewish organisations opposing its practices (including the recent racist vote subjugating the Israeli Arab population).
Yet the media ignores these Jewish voices and instead bolsters right-wing islamophobic positions that will eventually lead to anti-Semitism as well. I feel very worried about this. I know that with the rise of the far right in EUrope a Corbyn government can be counted on MORE than the Tories to oppose fascism and protect ALL Jewish people interests.

I'm a Labour voter

I despise the Tories

I wholly oppose the actions of the right wing Israeli government

I am a British Jew

I would like to understand what comments like this have to do with the actions of the state of Israel:

“Jews have reaped the rewards of playing victims”
"What have the Jews done good in this world?”
"The Jews have reaped the rewards of playing victims. Enough is enough!”

" Jews are a disgrace to humanity'."

Claiming that Jews were the ‘chief financiers of the sugar and slave trade’,

Claiming the holocaust was a hoax

@LadyandtheTea Could you explain how someone who has consistently refused to condemn these incidents from within the Labour party can be counted on to fight antisemitism and protect Jewish people's interests? I don't support Israel's actions and wholly condemn them. I am asking about Rothschild memes, blood libel, and other antisemitism canards.

I'd be very grateful if you could enlighten me.

Israel has the most right-wing government it has ever had and there are myriad Jewish organisations opposing its practices

Funnily enough you can criticise the Israeli government without being anti Semitic. Who knew

There are however more than 'a few pockets' of Labour/Corbyn supporters who defend to direct semitism or anti Semitic trope.

*decend not defend.

Israel has the most right-wing government it has ever had

I love these sweeping statements. Lady - are you a professor of government, perhaps, or a Middle East expert with a major think tank? Off the top of my head, I would rate the 1981 govt as substantially more right wing than this one - the coalition had Tehiya in it, or maybe 1990 after labour left the coalition. What do you think? Or are you one of the many MNetters who comments on the ME with very little idea what they're talking about?

And Margaret hodge has said she categorically did not apologise to Corbyn.

Cowardly weasel he is

Luciana Berger received letters from Corbyn supporters include rape and death threats, accused her of being a 'traitor to our country', Judas’, a ‘Zio-Nazi’, an ‘absolute parasite’, and telling her to ‘get out of this country and to go back to Israel,"

Ruth Smeeth received abuse including:

‘hang yourself you vile treacherous Zionist Tory filth, you’re a cancer of humanity'
'Ruth Smeeth is a Zionist she has no shame and trades on the murder of Jews by Hitler who the Zionists betrayed’
‘Ruth Smeeth must surely be travelling first class to Tel Aviv with all that slush, after all she’s complicit in trying to bring Corbyn down’.”

Corbyn walked out of the chamber whilst these labour MPs recounted the abuse sent in his name in the Commons.

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If Labour is a church, Corbynism looks more and more like a cult. It’s on the hunt for heretics. Pro-Brexit MPs are threatened with deselection. Tom Watson, the deputy leader, got it in the neck for calling for action against anti-Semitism: Twitter lit up with nearly 50,000 demands for him to resign. They call this online movement #WeAreCorbyn, and if Jeremy Corbyn was a Monty Python fan, he’d reply: “#I’mNot.”

How on Earth has Labour, a party with an illustrious history of fighting racism, wound up in a civil war over anti-Semitism? Seeing Corbynism as a cult is one way to look at it.

ImAIdoot

You have to wonder how being shitstains to Jews can be worth such a big fuss. I mean your average traditional core Labour voter (as was) won't hate Jews, indeed will probably tend to disapprove of anti-semitism if they care at all.

I guess if you were looking for who they see as their voter base now, audiences anti-semitism plays well for might be a start.

they have done the sums and realise their are more Muslims than Jews and Muslims are traditionally labour

This is the real reason he gives not two shits about what Jewish people think I said it and will say it again the Corbyn is no different to trump he is a populist
His followers call the issues in labour the media report fake news and a conspiracy against him

He indulges in dog whistle politics

He panders to trans at the detriment of women

And he’s given jobs to people that are not qualified purely on the basis of a sexual relationship

He lies and has been caught out traingate anyone

Thank you Bananafish, SallySings and others on here for educating me. Sorry can’t write more today due to a pain flare.

He indulges in dog whistle politics

I personally hate this term as its so nondescript, it's just a cloak for for "opinions that i do not agree with" but it shows how terminology that the left made prominent has now become a tool in the age old adage of the left eating itself due to ever enduring purity standards.

Corbyn isn't an anti semite publically, but as a principled man he has sought out friends who are along his line of thinking, as we all know, being stuck in student politics with all the russian influence for decades then being anti western is a defacto stance, problem is that he has been thrust into power by Momentum and now his principled stance pokes huge holes in the anti brexit/racism rhetorical stance

Let's be honest, the right wing media are using the guilt by association tactic against those that initiated it

Thank you Bananafish, SallySings and others on here for educating me. Sorry can’t write more today due to a pain flare.

You are welcome. Hope you are feeling better today.

The longer he stays as head of the Labour Party the better, they're unelectable.