AIBU to be worried about the normalisation of far right politics?

[Apileofballyhoo]

Just that really. I'm interested in what people consider to be far right and what people think causes it and what should be done about it.

I think it's caused by inequality and people feeling hopeless.

People havn't lurched to the right. The left have lurched to the far left.

Owen Jones and Ash Sarkar (Ash writes for the Guardian FFS) are openly praising communism..

Time to #Walkaway

#walkway

I think it’s interesting people are more worried about being called racist than about looking at their behaviour and considering whether it is in fact, racist.

I think it's more that the term "racist" has been devalued somewhat that a lot of people now don't care. The people shouting racist at every right of center point of view have now moved onto calling everything "far right" instead.

Yanbu OP

I thought the murder of Jo Cox was a one-off horror but it's the beginning of something that hasn't peaked yet.

The tabloids of course have been doing their bit to destroy society and spread lies every day. Theresa May wasn't a good Home Office secretary, refusing to listen to expert advice and routinely breaking human rights law. She has taken that legacy and attitude to number 10. Misogyny is rampant - have a look at twitter and Facebook were abuse of women (words or pictures) seems to be within guidelines.

We should be up in arms about all of the above but we seem to be OK about it. Yes labour are useless but there is no decent centre party.

I don't live in the UK anymore, but from abroad it does seem that way OP. The EDL, through the incarceration of Tommy Robinson, seems to have gained more support. I've seen a lot of stuff on people's facebooks, who I thought were fairly to the centre left in their views, supporting xenophobic view points or posting things against muslims etc. There has definitely been an increase recently.

I think there is also a certain amount of racist/xenophobic rhetoric amongst some Brexit supporters as well.

badlad have a guess.

I wasn't actually requesting information. I was asking rhetorical questions to point out the hypocrisy and intellectual dishonesty of damning media with certain political leaning for "supporting the blackshirts" but forgiving other media, with different political leaning, for doing so.

forallthesaints goes as far as to say "The paper...", clearly implying that there was only one. Either she didn't know that papers on both sides were doing it, or she's giving an Orwelian, distorted version.

There has always been a wide spectrum of political ideals, beliefs, discourse - in this and all countries - and thank goodness for it. I remember many evenings spent, as students, extolling the virtues of communism; isn’t it a young person’s thing mainly? A dream of equality and freedom from the shackles of property? It’s an ideal that often mellows with age and experience (and accepting the reality of what communism became and of the ugly side of human nature). It’s the bogey man in the US and, as we’re more and more influenced by the US, is becoming more so here.

I consider myself to be a fairly centrist floating voter liberal these days btw.

Why does it bother you that some young people hold these views?

Please, other than Owen Jones and the like, where is this lurch to the far left? And what damage is it doing? Compare this to the wilful damage being done to our society by the likes of Bannon.

• rise in racist incidents since Brexit = camera phones/not true.

• windrush/cons govt = no biggie/seen worse

• hostile environment/rhetoric against immigrations by govt/media= meh whatevs.

• murder of mp by racist = bad but did you see her dh, urgh

• racist/anti-Semitic remarks by leading brexiteers = meh, so, Brexit is not racist

• Jeremy Corbyn fails to stamp out anti-semitism = omg! Outrageous! Scummy racist. The far left are ruining us!

Thanks for the explanation badlad I feel much clearer now that I've had the benefit of your learned comment. Very grateful indeed.

No worries, longwayoff . I'm here for you.

Meh, they've always had a reason to hate. I'm black Irish and we have always been bullied mercilessly for being Irish or mistaken for other groups. Now the demographic chickens are really coming home to roost, they can't mount an effective foreign policy because everyone hates them, they had their financial assurance they gained in WW2 taken away from them with certain events 17 years ago, and the elites are lashing out looking for someone to blame because their whole idea of superiority is based on abuse and slaughter.

All these events are not accidental. They are DEALS made by some of the most corrupt institutions on the planet.

Helmetbymidnight

10 points for combining that many strawmen into one post!

You can go on fighting the good fight now.

Sorry if I’m repeating what others may have mentioned, through personal experience, the racists/far right or whatever they’re called have a platform now and a very loud voice. It is very worrying for someone like me (non white, follow a religion others don’t like etc). I don’t think we have more racist/far right extremists, just the case that like other extremist groups they’ve been offered platforms, backed up, and allowed to make as much noise as they want. It’s easy to tar everyone with the same brush, and I hope those who float around in the middle outweigh both the left and right.
Sometimes it does feel like a boiling pot, and friends and family who live in the Far East see the ‘tensions’ in a different light (and worry).

If like me, you’ve been bullied all your life for being different (beaten at school, attacked in adulthood) you do get used to it (sorry going off on a tangent).

I do wonder, someone mentioned a friend going to a pub where the majority were Eastern Europeans and being exposed to extreme anti English views, does the same happen in reverse to those who come from Eastern Europe? It’s a genuine question, are they venting their anger because they too are part of the ‘hated’ group?

In all honesty, I think we are heading towards France few years back, which didn’t end well with the riots etc. I hope not, I do like to believe people have far more intelligence. However, some comments on mumsnet to show how deep certain hatred goes, for specific religion (more so for that group than any other).

It’s whats been said on the thread. I think it was a good summary actually, except I forgot rising popularity of tommy Robinson - ooh how was this dismissed? Just ignored I guess.

And no mention of the far left?

You not worried about the far left: JC, anti semitsm, class based politics, making a profit is bad, pro Palestine, pro Hamas, pro Venezuela, pro Cuba...?

But you single out far right as becoming normalised?!

Morgan Stanley were right to release research that said JC is a bigger threat to the long term viability of Britain than a hard Brexit.

Yet it's the far right that worries you?!

Corbyn isn’t “far” left. It shows how far right the country is when a standard leftist is viewed as extreme.

I'm no Corbyn fan but ... I think you need to link to the Morgan Stanley statement/research.

My guess would be that Morgan Stanley were directing pressure on Labour (the wider Labour, beyond Corbyn) to change their position and come out as an anti-Brexit party.

Lloyd's London have said they are following plans to establish themselves outside the UK 'at pace' because of Brexit.

Rees Mogg has said that we will be waiting 50 years before we see (economic) positives of Brexit and his City firm have moved investments to Ireland.

So ...

But that, really, is by the by - about economics and Brexit.

Unless, of course, your point is - actually - that Brexit facilitates the rise of the Far Right?

If that's the case, I agree.

I’m not particularly worried about the far left, no

I’m worried about an incompetent cons govt that is driving us towards a hard Brexit. I’m worried about the economy getting fecked and rising racist discourse - and scapegoating when Brexit doesn’t deliver...

I don’t like Corbyn at all, never have, but this pretense that he is our greatest threat is mystifying.

I lean more to the right now than I ever used to do, even though none of my major core thoughts or beliefs have changed much over that time period, I was pretty; centrist.

What has changed though is the increased combative nature of the left wing that I've noticed, things such as challenging everything with wild accusations against you instead of debate, and deplatforming people if they don't agree with them rather than debating is rampant now, made ever so easier with the increase in social media platforms. You're either labelled a racist, or a sexist, or a homophobe, or a transphobe or whatever else lovely term they can come up with, rather than just someone who just has a maybe slightly different viewpoint or opinion than themselves.

The point about neither side existing in a vaccum is correct, you keep pushing from one side, and sooner or later the other side is going to push back, and that can't come as a surprise. If you keep calling somebody stupid, or a group of people stupid for doing something or thinking something differently to you, there is only so long before there's a breakdown, talking down and berating somebody, rarely leads to them being on your side.

And yes, I can acknowledge that people on the right will talk down and berate people on the left aswell, as said, neither side exists in a vacuum, no-one is blameless, everyone is to blame.

I don't think you need to worry about the rise of the far right. The far left is much more of a concern. I don't understand the hatred for the far right and the love for the far left. One is as extreme as another.

I think the growing support for the right is a natural reaction to the left's failure to acknowledge the concerns of many people, the fact that living standards are falling and that nobody on the left cares.

Rather than allowing the right to pull in people from the middle, the left should offer a carrot rather than just another stick.

I don't see any far right normalisation. Labours move to the far left and the cascade through universities etc from that is horrendous imo. (No platforming and erasing uncomfortable history for example, they will be burning books next)
They unelectable in their current form. Anti Semitic, anti women - that's what I see.

My guess would be that Morgan Stanley were directing pressure on Labour (the wider Labour, beyond Corbyn) to change their position and come out as an anti-Brexit party.

We have got into some very strange timeline where people who identify themselves as Labour supporters are desperate to save a neoliberal dream like the EU

They're cheerleading for the same agenda as places like the Financial Times and Goldman Sachs and yet this doesn't set off any alarm bells for them? They don't bat an eyelid about it.

Er . . . sohere, didnt that say JC is a greater threat than brexit to the profits of Morgan Stanley. . .?

Justanother

We have got into some very strange timeline where people who identify themselves as Labour supporters are desperate to save a neoliberal dream like the EU

They're cheerleading for the same agenda as places like the Financial Times and Goldman Sachs and yet this doesn't set off any alarm bells for them? They don't bat an eyelid about it.

Is the EU a neoliberal dream? How so?