To wonder what people mean when they say "Oh, I wish they'd just get ON with Brexit!"

[BertrandRussell]

Because I have no idea how they would do that.

My vote for what to do.... Is do nothing keep it as it is. But that's no longer an option.
So with the time frame there just has to be extensions and keep the status quo. Anybody in manufacturing cannot move that fast, things are planned in years. Any changes then need big lead times. But I haven't got a scooby as to how it can resolve without serious serious pain. There is no good solution just a multitude of best of the worst choices.

Maybe because we have had an incompetent government who from reporting have done SFA the last couple of years and now that we are a few months from exit have decided to hand in their notice and walk away whistling.

Which is pretty much what Cameron did several years ago after the vote.

So what do you want to see magoria?

It wouldn’t have been any different with a competent government would it? Other than if they’d just gone with the softest of soft brexits and realised the hard brexitters were just going to have to get over it.

Maybe because we have had an incompetent government who from reporting have done SFA the last couple of years

But what should they have done? All we ever hear is this deal isn’t good enough. But those rejecting the deal never present a solution.

I've seen several very misinformed people on the news today spouting nonsense along the lines of 'get on with it, why is it taking so long or the EU are being so meeeean' and it absolutely infuriates me.

It's all a big surprise to them. They are generally the same people who (pre vote) said things like "the EU need us more than we need them - they'll be falling over themselves to make a deal which benefits US".

But those rejecting the deal never present a solution.

Because "Leave" never had a plan. They don't deal with such dull stuff. And besides, if they came up with a plan and we followed it then it would all be their fault. this way, when it all goes to hell in a handbasket, they can say "That's because we didn't have the right plan. It is someone else's fault, because it wasn't MY plan..."

I agree with Magoria in that instead of the government making a plan of what they were going to negotiate with Europe, and sort of ticking them off one by one (majorly over simplifying things there) so it leaves just a few huge big decisions to have heated debate in a hot smokey room until 5 in the morning, then agree, shake hands and go home. What we have instead is a Tory government that couldn't seem to give a shit about the rest of the country, and just want to keep themselves in power. That is what I think people mean- I wish someone would get hold of the negotiations by the scruff of the neck and get some sort of blueprint sorted.

However , having said that, it seems like the EU may be forced (not only from Brexit, but also from internal discontent) to abandon the whole Federalist EU experiment, and revert back to a more "common market" philosophy.

What Messy said.

I am a bitter remainer and hope the idiot leavers really suffer the consequences.

slap up a hard border in Ireland, opt out of the European agencies, cut off trade (inc cancer medicines), let international businesses go.
Just get it over with.

As a convinced remainer I don’t think it’s unreasonable to have expected that two years down the line we’d have an actual decision on what Brexit was going to mean.

Obviously it was idiotic to vote on Brexit in the first place without specifying what that actually meant. And if we had a basic set of principles of what level of ongoing agreement would be involved then yes there would still be years of negotiating on thousands of details, but even so the fact that this government is still unable to clearly state its fundamental objectives and planned post-Brexit status, after two sodding years, is utterly ludicrous. People are trying to do life and business planning here, and we need a sodding hint. So that’s what I mean by “get on with it”.

Upthread someone said that people (voters in the ref) did not understand the consequences and the processes involved in leaving.

Well with respect, neither did the Tory Government either, as has been shown already! Triggering Article 50 way back was just brinkmanship and was totally out of order IMV.

It is a long process so "getting on with it" is not going to happen any time soon. Over the last two years what negotiations happened, what plans were put in place, what boxes were ticked and a big X put beside the imponderables? None.

So here we are.

I think people are fed up of the same arguments coming up over and over again with no possible solution. I voted remain. I still think we've made a massive error leaving, . However, it no longer matters why people voted the way they did, or who said what or if leave didn't have a plan or thought they weren't going to win so said any old bollocks Boris Johnson, Michael Gove. We are going to have to leave, we will not be having another referendum. I just want us to get some sort of consensus as to what our negotiating position is going to be and try and get as good a deal as we can. If we leave with no deal, it will be a disaster for everyone . I'm trying to get myself an EU passport in the vain hope they will change the rules in that country to allow my children to get one if they want one. Let the people who voted leave live with the consequences when they have visa restrictions slapped on them and they have to go out fruit picking because theres no one else to do it, or go and try and trade with the Commonwealth and be surprised when they realise that now that the commonwealth is no longer owned by us, they are under no obligation to trade with us, and would rather trade with a large trading bloc like the EU. I'd gladly be wrong, but id also gladly watch their arses being handed to them on a plate.

Someone at work was saying something along the lines of “why dont they just do it?” I pointed out we couldn’t get our project planning process to work smoothly across 40 people in the same team, all speaking the same language in the same company.
Brexit is so much more complex with contradictory ambitions which we have no idea how to reconcile.

Right at the very point when we have assorted lunatics in both white houses, and Turkey and Hungary, we decide "hey, this seems like a good time to go it alone". There's no wonder our political leaders don't know which way to turn. We are shafted whatever happens

I heard on the radio earlier that the government is starting to organise the stockpiling of processed goods and medicine ready for Brexit. This was being presented at a good thing because it shows ... god knows what. Nobody commenting seemed to grasp that they're stockpiling because there's going to be shortages. Massive shortages.

People don't stockpile for the lolz, they stockpile because of impending catastrophe. Why doesn't that sink in?

And this is why I prep.

Exactly, Mimpi. Why don't people get it? I feel like I've fallen through into an alternative universe sometimes!

How do people find this 'boring' when it's going to affect their lives for at least 20-30yrs?

Why are we doing this when it's going to lead to economic harm whatever form it takes (see govt reports) or worst case scenario - mass food and medicine shortages and the decimation of the economy.

And still no credible plan for how we just 'get on with it', just endless infighting as we bumble ever closer to disaster.

@user1471453601

I agree with you. We are on the road to nowhere now.

We need a People’s Vote on the final deal including an option to remain. Link for petition here: www.peoples-vote.uk

When people say they just want to get with it, they simply mean they want a complete split from the EU as other countries manage perfectly well.

• Repeal the 1972 Act, setting leaving date
• Setup agencies that replicate those functions that we used to have
• Provide border crossings checking passports and goods at each border the same as if good are coming from outside the EU, recruiting whoever is necessary.
• Grant ball EU citizens in UK 1 year visa to apply for a new visa as per any other countries citizens
• Implement on a given day

The rest can be sorted by mutual agreement between countries as the UK and US manage all the time.

The only issue with this, is that the people implementing it, just find excuses to try to avoid doing what people were told would happen, and voted for. e.g.

• Taking control of borders and immigration requires a hard border in Ireland - it was understood
• WTO rules in goods are fine, in fact with the imbalance they are to our advantage, we can always subsidise exports using the import tariffs
• EU and UK citizens have no rights other than what their hoists will afford them

It is only difficult if you want something, which many leave voters didn’t.

This was being presented at a good thing because it shows ... god knows what.

When I saw the Sun article I was intrigued to see whether/how it would be positively spun by Leavers, seeing as until it came out, all discussion of prepping for Brexit on MN was furiously derided as hysterical remoaning unpatriotic scaremongering by fifth columnists plotting to tear down the greatness of Brexit Britain (I paraphrase).

And now I see it has indeed been positively spun by Leavers as, um...

Also consider joining your local Remain group and get campaigning! There are loads all around the country mainly under the Britain for Europe and European Movement banners.

Blink,

How does your roadmap compare to the Chequers proposals? I note that the White Paper has been postponed until next week. Tweaking to meet EU expectations?

Well that's good isn't it? Otherwise why did UK not leave on the day Article 50 was invoked?

Serious question.

Leaving things as they are is an option. The author of Article 50 reckons it's reversible. We aren't out yet and nor do we have to be.