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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that the way people treat male toddlers....

440 replies

Yellowcrocodile · 09/07/2018 12:27

Is what leads to male entitlement in society?

Name changed for this as potentially identifying.

So I have a 2 year old DD and am currently pregnant with a boy.

Spent the morning at a playgroup in a naice area. I’ve come home feeling furious by the behaviour of some of the children and their parents. Basically there were a few boys 3+ who absolutely ran riot, screaming, running, shouting, snatching and hitting, and generally causing chaos. Their parents just smiled indulgently, and made comments like ‘boys have so much more energy’. None of them told their children off, apologised to anyone or acknowledged that their children were badly misbehaving.

It’s like this every fucking week. My daughter has her naughty moments too, snatches, tantrums etc, but as soon as she starts I tell her off (calmly), explain why she can’t do xyz, and say we are leaving if she carries on. She generally responds and behaves herself, and I’m very embarrassed if she doesn’t, as I have high expectations of her. Almost all of the other girls and half of the boys are the same, not perfect little angels but parented appropriatley and respond to boundaries.

It’s making me worried that when I have my son:
a. He’ll be a horrible little shit
b. I’m turn into one of the terrible parents who attribute his poor behaviour to ‘being boisterous’ or ‘naturally having more energy’

These children are never told off, and their sense of entitlement is growing by the day. This is probably hormones talking, but I can completely see how some men end up not doing any housework, feeling entitled to the best of everything, and go around raping and murdering people, as they are told from an early age that any behaviour is fine as they ‘have more energy’ and they just aren’t held to normal standards of behaviour.

Also, they all seem to be call very boring middle class names like william, Samuel and Benjamin, don’t know what that’s about? The children with names that would raise a mumsnet eyebrow are much better behaved.

So, AIBU to blame toxic masculinity and male entitlement on the tolerance we have for poor behaviour from boys in childhood?!

Or are hormones making me crazy... Grin

I’m determined not to treat my son any differently to my daughter for both of their sakes, but feel really sad about the society they will both be growing up in

OP posts:
Racecardriver · 09/07/2018 12:50

Obviously the same reasoning applies to later developing girls.

funinthesun18 · 09/07/2018 12:50

girls will be told off for getting carried away or being rough

I see plenty of boys being told off for getting carried away too.

cheminotte · 09/07/2018 12:52

Yanbu. See also ‘boys will be boys’ .

Thesearmsofmine · 09/07/2018 12:52

I have three boys and don’t let them behave badly. They are boisterous but then I know plenty of boisterous girls too.

HarrietKettleWasHere · 09/07/2018 12:54

WTF have their names got to do with anything?Confused

NotAsGreenAsCabbageLooking · 09/07/2018 12:54

@OiWhoTookTheGoodNames

God the gender stereotyping in this post is appalling.

I don’t know if it’s nature or nurture, but those stereotypes ring true more often than not.

Lethaldrizzle · 09/07/2018 12:54

Completely disagree. It's a personality thing. Not a gender thing. And it sure ain't a class thing

DuggeesWoggle · 09/07/2018 12:55

I have a 2 year old who is generally not like this at all. He is quite gentle natured and if he gets hit by another child at nursery (it happens), then he doesn't retaliate at all (corroborated by nursery staff not just my blinkered view!) He just wants to be friends with everyone. He can certainly be loud when he wants though!

Both boys and girls can be boisterous and loud and at that age have yet to learn to regulate their emotions which can lead to biting/hitting etc. I agree that in boys it's more likely to be excused as 'boys being boys' (whatever the hell that means Hmm), but I would hope that there are plenty of parents that, like me, wish to raise kind, gentle boys who are respectful of others (and to hold these character traits as strengths in a man not weakness) and try and parent accordingly. I have also witnessed plenty of grabby pushy loud girls too and we have all met the women that they grow into if left unchecked. It works both ways.

FrayedHem · 09/07/2018 12:56

It sounds more like a supervision issue. From my observations this tends to happen when there's a large group of parents who are friends and DC at an age where they can play independently in terms of managing equipment etc. And they'll put the behaviour down to any dismissive reason regardless of the child's sex.

AjasLipstick · 09/07/2018 12:56

YANBU and I've had to shut my inlaws down when they described my 3 year old nephew as "managing" my DD"s when he was A being a bossy little shit and B not managing but pushing them around.

I said "He is NOT managing my daughters thank you...they're being over-polite and putting up with his behaviour and he needs telling!

Soon stopped. They saw things differently.

likeacrow · 09/07/2018 12:56

At the playgroup we go to I'd say there's not much difference in the boisterousness of boys/girls. There are different personalities there obviously, but I wouldn't say it divides along gender lines. Most of the parents/grandparents are pretty good at reigning their kids in when they get carried away (boys or girls) although there was one woman there who used to come and let her DS run riot, throwing and hitting others, without intervening half as much as she should have for the sake of the other children.

I've definitely seen "typical boy behaviour" used as a convenient excuse for letting boys behave inappropriately, usually at soft play. Whereas for girls there doesn't seem to be the same degree of making excuses.

nokidshere · 09/07/2018 12:59

It has nothing to do with gender and everything to do with poor parenting

ConfessionsOfTeenageDramaQueen · 09/07/2018 12:59

YABU - it's nothing to do with the sex of the child and everything to do with bad parenting.

I have a 16 month old boy and he doesn't do any of those things - if he did he'd be told off.

Whereas there have been quite a number of times when I'm in the park with him - both here in the UK and abroad - and I'll see a young girl (older than him) do something really bitchy towards him like start playing with something as soon as he expresses an interest, elbowing him out of the way, or pushing in front when previously they weren't the slightest bit interested.

PatchworkElmer · 09/07/2018 13:00

Hmmm, I get where you’re coming from, but it’s not something I’ve experienced a lot of. At gymnastics this morning, a girl ran straight into DS and knocked him flying- the mother seemed surprised that he cried “oh! Is he ok?!” Later, a boy pushed him off a soft play toy. The mother told him off immediately, apologised to me, and removed him from the area.

Generally, I think that the ‘naughtier’ children we encounter do tend to be boys, but it doesn’t happen enough for me to think exactly as you do (in terms of parents of boys letting them get away with more). Gendered thinking with regard to DC is absolutely toxic, and does happen from a very early age though.

DieAntword · 09/07/2018 13:00

My son is a pretty rowdy toddler, I tell him off and frankly it doesn't make a jot of difference, actually it encourages him a bit because he finds being told off very amusing. I could give him a spanking or something but I don't think that would go down very well with the modern mummies at the toddler group (we don't do spanking but I have been sooooorely tempted sometimes). I mean I am basically just a human climbing frame that says "please don't jump on mummy" now.

Cat2lady · 09/07/2018 13:00

Urgh my DNephew is a one of these boys, told by my SIL that ‘he’s a monkey’ or ‘that’s just typical DN’ whilst he carries on being a little shit. Some examples are spitting at his older cousin once and punching when he doesn’t get his own way!!

likeacrow · 09/07/2018 13:01

I'll see a young girl (older than him) do something really bitchy towards him like start playing with something as soon as he expresses an interest, elbowing him out of the way, or pushing in front when previously they weren't the slightest bit interested.
Honestly, that's pretty much all kids IME (as an FS teacher).

Notso · 09/07/2018 13:01

They just sound like shit parents tbh.

You don't sound very confident in your parenting if you think that you will also turn into a shit parent just because your second child has a penis.
Its also a massive leap from not being told off at playgroup to becoming a rapist.

funinthesun18 · 09/07/2018 13:02

FWIW, I don’t like the “boys will be boys” line being used as an excuse and I have never used it once. I don’t like those slogan tshirts either that have it on them.
Especially because it gives parents of girls an easy excuse to blame little boys for everything, now including men’s behaviour it would seem Hmm.

I wish people would stop using it.

Dahlietta · 09/07/2018 13:02

Your comment about their names makes me think you are just being goady (plus I wouldn’t say those are particularly MC names)
However, I do know what you mean. I wouldn’t let DS1 run round screaming with our friends’ children at about 2 and they would often tell me that he ‘didn’t have as much energy as their sons’ Hmm

jollygoose · 09/07/2018 13:03

so basically what you are saying is that all mothers of girls are perfect parents when mothers of boys are all woefully indulgent excepting those who have girls already and thus their perfect parenting mean these boys know boundaries - what a load of b...….

JaneJeffer · 09/07/2018 13:03

I have two boys and there's no way I'd have let them carry on like that. It's up to their parents to teach them good manners.

Beeziekn33ze · 09/07/2018 13:06

And the name you've chosen is ...?

Original poster
Yellowcrocodile · 09/07/2018 13:07

Dahlietta - to be fair, the name comment isn’t really that relevant. Just noticed it more as I’m picking a name for my boy, and when people suggest certain names like the ones I’ve mentioned I think ‘no! Not like that one at playgroup. Oh and the other one. And that one in the shop that punched his mum in the face when she wouldn’t buy him chocolate...’

OP posts:
MargaretCavendish · 09/07/2018 13:08

This is probably hormones talking, but I can completely see how some men end up not doing any housework, feeling entitled to the best of everything, and go around raping and murdering people

Gosh, that was a rapid escalation - from running around to not doing housework to murder!

I think it's interesting that you admit there isn't actually an absolute gender divide here - about half the boys are better behaved, and since 'almost all' the girls are well behaved some aren't - but then go on to assume that there is some inevitability to you doing this with your own son. I might examine the beam in your own gender-stereotype-endorsing eye if I were you..