Or is my mother??

[rosesandflowers1]

Summer holidays we had a family holiday planned (DH, DD1, DS, DD2 and I, along with my parents) to go to a caravan park or Center Parcs or something. They left planning very late but that's not the point... now they want to go abroad, France or Spain my mother is saying.

DD1 is terrified of flying, she hated planes anyway and always insisted something bad was going to happen on holidays... it was just anxiety and she always loved it once we got there, but at the time she needs lots of reassurance and on the two holidays that my parents have been there they've been dickheads very misunderstanding about it on the plane.

Last year DD had a seizure abroad and got diagnosed with epilepsy; essentially, the bad thing happened. Now she's flat out refusing to go abroad and I don't blame her. I don't really think booking an overseas holiday in so little advance makes sense either.

My parents seem to think it's about cost It's not. My mother says she'll pay, we don't need her to, and then she got cross and said I was too proud. I reaffirmed this was about DD and that DH or I would have to stay home with her so it wouldn't really be a family holiday.

She said it was our fault for "giving in" to her fear. Now she went whining to my aunt about my selfishness and that DH puts me up to it, apparently

I'm pretty sure I'm not BU about the last part; but should have I just caved and booked an abroad holiday and forced DD to go? It's been a hugely chaotic couple of months - year, really - for DD especially, and she's just getting better. I don't think it would be fair to do that, but my mother as always has put doubt into my head.

Help?

You need to give Dh a big hug, this must be dreadful for him too.

DH and I have been cuddling, watching Outnumbered and eating chocolate all afternoon He isn't overly unsettled, he just thinks my mum's batshit, always has done. He laughed when she spat at him which didn't help

The only thing that's really upsetting him is the phone call yesterday which I will have to get to the bottom of somehow.

Record it. Be honest. Tell him you love him (assuming you do).

Thanks for the suggestion to record - I wouldn't have thought of it.

I do indeed love him and do plan on telling him so, especially as I'll probably be seeing him less

Keep telling your dad right now you have to put your child first, and you know he needs to put his wife first, so the best solution is to have your own holiday, you won't be changing your mind of this point and your dad has to accept that..

I'm not sure if he wants the truth or just wants to convince me to change my decision.

If he does want to try and change my mind I will most certainly be repeating what you said. I hope he doesn't.

He's been believing what she says for years, or at least not disagreeing to keep the peace most likely. Plus narcs can be very convincing liars - they almost convince themselves it's true, and that they are the victim. She almost certainly genuinely believes she is hard done by here.

I remember being punished by him when my mum lied to him about my behaviour.

I've always just gone with "convincing liar" because the thought that he punished me to "keep the peace" makes me feel sick.

She is a very good liar though.

If I were you, I'd be getting your daughter a new mobile number and once it's change, do not give the new number to your parents. At least that way, your mum can't try and go after her when you've put your foot down about contact etc.

She’s not a great liar. She’s barely able to keep to her own script. She is however a coward, and happy to thrash around blaming you, Dh or dd or indeed anyone to avoid admitting her own behaviour. So she knows she’s being inexcusably awful. Be as kind as you can as she is very pitiful, but being kind doesn’t involve being hurt for her.

I guess she's just very good at twisting what happened and you're more likely to believe your wife over a teenager.

Today she wasn't great though. Perhaps because she was confronted with evidence. It used to be my word against hers.

If I were you, I'd be getting your daughter a new mobile number and once it's change, do not give the new number to your parents.

I think she might be due for an upgrade soon, so that'll work out well!

Her number is blocked but I doubt that would stop her if she really wanted to.

Disagree completely

This is a common fear for children when diagnosed abroad after an incident.

I'd say your mother is trying to encourage and is frustrated. Not a villain🙄

Your protective and understandably so.

Suggest going away next year, explain that it's still all too fresh just yet.

I'd say your mother is trying to encourage and is frustrated. Not a villain

Unfortunately, it seems she's turned into one.

Interesting to read that it's a common fear in children diagnosed abroad though. That's quite comforting.

Good luck when your dad calls you. I hope he listens rather than talk at you like your mother.

At least your aunt has backed off.

Your Mum seems to be a narc and your Dad is utterly complicit in enabling her. He sacrificed you to her for a quiet life for himself.

Your Mum read Off the narc script over that phone call didn't she?

Sadly your Dad is not innocent in all this, he will blame you and DH and DD to avoid having to look at his own actions and choices.

My dad rang me around eight and we've talked. I think he's been thinking a lot and my mother's behaviour truly shocked him.

He first asked me for the full truthful version of what happened. I gave it to him.

He also asked me about the times my mother lied about my behaviour when I was younger, which I mentioned at the cafe. I told him what really happened for all that as well.

He then asked me if DH was very controlling. I said he wasn't and he shouldn't listen to my mum - and he said he wasn't. Essentially he said that he did know DH very well and he was a very practical confident person in comparison to me - not that it's a bad thing - and he actually was worried about our differences in personality and income. He also mentioned that marrying DH was what allowed me to move out of my parents' house and he had always suspected that that was part of the reason I had done it. It was interesting because even though it wasn't the truth, it genuinely felt like he was just concerned about my wellbeing.

I promised him that our relationship was fine and he said okay but if it wasn't he'd always be there for me, and then he asked how often I wanted to actually see my mother.

I said I'd go up there for her birthday (alone) and family parties etc. Perhaps holidays like Christmas and Easter but I'm still wary of getting my family, especially DD1 involved. We do big parties on Boxing Day generally so I said maybe then.

My dad did sound upset at how little he'd see me, I said if he came alone he'd always be welcome but I can't have my mother around the house. He said he'd be happy to do that but my mum would probably not like it so he'd see.

Last he said he loved me, I said I loved him back and then he reminded me again that he would always be there for me, and then we said goodbye.

I feel like I've lost something really important and am just praying he visits on his own.

At least your aunt has backed off.

For now - I daresay my mother is on the phone to her right now. She just screams down it and my aunt agrees with everything she says.

Your dad actually sounds quite nice, I hope you both find a way to keep a good relationship somehow

Did you dad acknowledge or apologise for your childhood? If he's starting to realise that his wife isn't truthful and he's now seen her manipulative behaviour, then he must realise that what you're saying has some level of truth to it... So did he apologise?

I had this with my sister. She would tell all sorts if lies and my parents always believed her. She was older so what she said counted more. I'd come home from school and start getting screamed at and I'd have no idea why; I had to try and figure out what my sister had made up through what my mum was shouting at me. They never believed me. They always punished me. It wasn't until uni (I had to live with my sister as they bought a flat when she went to uni and I went to the same one after her) that they seemed to realise. She saw it her hers, because she was there first. She knew I'd be moving in eventually, but when it happened she made my life hell. Then one morning she called my mum and said that is brought a strange man back and he stayed overnight after I'd been out drinking - but I had been out visiting my mum that night and she had dropped me off at the flat so she knew what time she dropped me off at and my sister told her at that same time I'd came in, dressed all slutty, with a random boy. It was like right then my mum realised what a liar she was. I finally got an apology; it didn't change how awful I felt during my childhood and teen years, but it improved our relationship from then on.

I can relate to your posts so much. Sounds so much like my own mum. Good for you for standing up for yourself and family!

Did you dad acknowledge or apologise for your childhood? If he's starting to realise that his wife isn't truthful and he's now seen her manipulative behaviour, then he must realise that what you're saying has some level of truth to it... So did he apologise?

He did say he was sorry. What your sister did must have been awful - my mum did similar.

The only time my dad ever hit me was because my mum told him I'd stolen money from her to go to a paid-entry party and gotten drunk and given a boy a blowjob. Not even the party part was true.

Thank you OakElmAsh and jeeeeeeeeeeeez And everybody else on the thread

Jesus, that's not even just twisting/exaggerating - it's plain making stuff up.

I suspect that she did it to specifically to damage your relationship with your dad - he'd think less of you (because he believed her) and you'd hate him for punishing you.

My mum made up a lot of lies about my dad (telling 5 year old me that he was going to kidnap me and take me to Libya, coming in to school all dramatically to pick me up early because he was "outside in a van ready to grab me" as she points at some innocent tradesman's van near the school...) and tried very hard to drive wedges between all of her children too. She can't cope with other family members having close relationships, she has to be in the centre.

I believe it's quite a common behaviour which is driven by a mix of jealousy and the need to be the most important person - they can't achieve it by being nice, so they do it by destroying other relationships instead.

@StatisticallyChallenged

Yes, she did see me as competition, almost, with my father and I did resent him a bit for believing her. I hated her more though!

But that day she was in a foul mood anyway - again, perhaps, because she viewed me as competition somehow. She'd given up on her diet and had been moaning all week about being fat and unattractive etc., and I'd come down in a nice dress for a date and she went mad.

She'd previously agreed to pay but refused to, so I went and got some of my own money from upstairs and went out. She screamed a load of abuse at me about being ugly etc. and pointed out all my flaws - and I, not fantastically I admit, called her a jealous cow and went out on my date.

I think that would have been enough on its own to get me in some trouble but for her, not enough.

Ah, the old "my daughter looks nice today, better do my damndest to destroy her self esteem" trick. Lost count of the times I was told I look like a fat slut, slag, disgusting, bla bla bla. The digging about the size of my arse started when I was maybe 8? I remember being made to go to my school christmas disco when I was about 14 wearing one of her dresses because the one I'd bought myself was "hideously cheap and made me look like a whore"...funnily enough there were several girls there in various versions of it, whilst I was stuck in my 50 year old mother's black frock.

The competition goes both ways; you're competition for his attention/affection (taking it from her) but HE is also taking your attention. Damaging that relationship is important to her, and she's likely to ramp up as a result.

Rose

It is very common. Time is a great healer. Slowly stretch your holidays out, further a field.

It's a balance between supporting your child and pushing them too. You'll know what's right for her

Is her epilepsy stable?

Is her epilepsy stable?

The full-on seizures have stopped but she still has absences. She took a long time to adjust to the medication, it made her very tired and listless but she seems much better now!

Thank you I'm thinking our next holiday we'll push it a little, but for now a UK one is best

I'm sorry Statistically My mother insisted I looked like a whore/harlot/slut in loads of clothes when I was younger, and if you saw the swimming costume post still did when I was an adult! The only difference was I didn't have to listen and it would probably somehow be DH's fault.