to find it hard to talk about race/racism as a black woman without feeling like I'm 'playing the race card'

[CalliopeSparkles]

Sorry if this isn't the most eloquently put post. I read some of the threads on here where people seem to know so much about their subject, it's a little intimidating at times (not a bad thing) so will do my best to get my point across!

I am a mixed race woman. Black and Caucasian. Recently saw a clip of George the Poet during a search:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BkmV6viAfz3/?utmsource=iggsharesheet&igshid=1ilippwo0ufby

Nothing we haven't seen before!

My dad is a runner and went out running one evening. He was pulled over by the police who asked to search him and his bag, saying he looked like a known criminal (he's a professional with a clean record, never broken a law in his life - other than simple ones like breaking the speed limit or not wearing a seatbelt). My brother was strip searched in a shopping mall once after someone thought he was shop lifting (he wasn't), my other brother lives in London, works for the BBC, clean record, and has been stopped and searched 4 times in 2 years, all for no reason (that he could tell anyway). These are all hurtful for me to hear and I know there is something wrong with this. If I've ever entered in to a discussion about it however it often turns in to people becoming defensive, trying to defend why the searches might have been done, and a refusal to see an issue. I believe that most people in this world are good, and kind, and are in no way bigoted or racist, however why is it so hard for some people to simply admit that racism does exist? It's almost like it's taken as a personal insult at times, even though I am as explanatory and unbiased as can be in my discussion.

The last straw for me was the other day when my whole office was in total uproar about a crime stoppers report regarding a white male that was called a 'cracker' by two black men. This is awful racist behaviour, however the anger is never there when it's the every day 'normal' racism we hear about towards ethnic minorities.

AIBU to think that there IS a problem and to be frustrated when trying to discuss it with those who won't engage unless it's their own race that's affected?

And what's 'cracker' supposed to mean?! To me it's a biscuit you put cheese on, something you pull to go bang & that contains a crap bit of plastic, a hat no-one wears and a shit joke, or someone that breaks into safes. I can't see how anyone can get racist undertones from those....

@whiteroseredrose it depends where you live and grew up in London.

Where I grew up in London parents of different ethnic backgrounds encouraged their children to mix with each other. Some where then surprised when their child, as an adult, decided to marry and have children with someone they knew from school/college who was from a different ethnic background. The first handful caused a lot of arguments within families and across generations.

Where I live now some of my white neighbours don't like a particular type of people there as they don't give a stuff if you are an ethnic minority as their own families are mixed. (I've heard what @Mrsharrison has said from some of my neighbours, who other people don't realise have siblings/partners who aren't white, and friends who are mixed race.) However on different streets the interaction between neighbours is different.

www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Cracker

OP: I'm sorry all these shitty things have happened to you & yours. People that don't want to see will always be able to excuse individual occurrences of course, whilst failing to notice that their (white) family somehow never has members stopped & strip searched when they've just popped out to the shops, or had people phone the police on them when they're just out for a run.

It's the gestalt that makes these things racist - not individual events & anyone who fails to appreciate that and insists on picking individual actions apart in a pettifogging fashion is wilfully ignoring that fact.

Nikephorus

Yes, sometimes it will be accurate. I however, as a white person, with mainly white friends have known one person in my entire life to get randomly searched by the police. One person. Once.

In America black kids get shot every week by the police because they have their hands in their pockets and were therefore 'reaching for a weapon' or some utter crap. Google the entire list of the victims. There are literally hundreds of them. And the cop usually gets a slap on the wrist at most for taking a person's life.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2015/jun/01/the-counted-police-killings-us-database

cjferg America is a whole different ballgame though - they have some (not all, but enough) massively racist cops. But then they have Donald Trump as President so what can you expect?

Stop and search is a difficult one. With limited police resources, it makes sense to stop those most statistically likely to have committed a crime. A higher percentage of men are therefore stopped rather than women. Is this seen as sexist or sensible?

I am white my brother, father and two nephews are white and have never been stopped by police and we have vanishingly rarely been subject to racism.

My DS is asian and the racism started when he was 2.

He goes to a big London comprehensive with a high proportion of BAME pupils.

He has been racially abused by black pupils.

I don;t doubt that the Black to Asian racism comes from black teens who have grown up with racism. It's a bit like the bullied become the bullies. I suspect that the impotence you feel as a black teen is ameliorated when you can dump it on someone else.

Coming up with occasional incidences of black on white racism either in this country or abroad isn't particularly helpful - not because it doesn't happen but because it's not the norm.

It is eye opening how much racism my 12 year old deals with.

@ghanagirl I don’t know why you’re picking on me. the poster before me mentioned black kids getting shot in the USA and said to google the entire list of victims killed by the police - that guardian link has the entire list.

I recognise your name - you were the poster who called out the entirety of mumsnet as being racist if you don’t like black celebrities weren’t you. Looks like that chip has got bigger.

03051781boo
I’m not “picking on you” racism exists that’s a undeniable fact.
OP was asking if she was unreasonable to not want to express her feelings re this issue.
You are apparently married to a Ghanaian man whose family “hate you” but you’re also looking up statistics saying Police in USA are definitely not racist.
Whilst checking my previous posts regarding my genuine concerns about racism.
If you really have children of colour I honestly don’t think you would be so focused on trying to bully and put down women of colour

@kewcumcumber both myself and one of my sisters' have had lots of experienced of Asian on Black racism. In fact my sister had far more as a child and I've had more as an adult. So it works both ways.

I wasn’t checking up on your posts, I remembered it earlier on in the thread then when you popped up I recognised you as the one who started the thread.

And the link just shows the victims of police shootings - I never said the police definitely aren’t racist (though I’d not make a generalised claim about a whole group of people)

03051781boo
Okay you’re the victim, will be interesting to see how your mixed race kids feel, if they exist...

03051781boo
Have you actually acknowledge d OP’s concerns?

I think a lot of white people do not want to admit ‘white privilege’ is a real thing.

I think a lot of white people do not want to admit ‘white privilege’ is a real thing

Absolutely right. Sickening.

I don't really talk about racism to non PoC, apart from one of my best friends who is Irish.

Seeing threads on FB - even so-called neutral or anti fascism pages eventually making jokes about black people, then whole thread of people who were oh so right on moments ago, suddenly hit defence mode and/or join in being derogatory, has reiterated how I feel about it.

I'm not bothered about race card or any of those terms that are just a more pleasant sounding substitute for 'youve got a chip on your shoulder'.

I don't require validation or attention from anyone who'd go on about the race card.

Liberals are the worst. They don't even see their racism as they're not EDL or "Free Tommeh's" etc so think they're a cut above.

Inevitably, their conversations around race involve seeking you out (I'm sure they search) instigating a conversation about race (when you might have wanted to chat about something completely different actually) then trying to whitesplain you into understanding why they should know best how you feel and actually you shouldn't feel like that, you should feel like this...blah.

As for the microaggressions black people suffer. I thought about the Rashan Charles recent verdict. He was a slim, petite young man. No size to him, really. Excuse for (several) police and 'nameless civilian' being complicit in him being choked to death, was that he had a package in his mouth.

No evidence was ever found of any package in his mouth. But what struck me was after the incident and before the inquest verdict, the sheer number of people on social media who actually voiced that because he had a package in his mouth 'oh well he was a criminal, deserved to die 1 less on the streets'.

That's the reality. That swathes of non PoC believe that a PoC doesn't deserve the procedure of arrest, investigation, trial, sentence
They believe he deserves execution there and then with no recourse.

His grandfather was present at the inquest. He'd served as a policeman in the UK for many years. The shock he felt and spoke about..
I just wondered why he was shocked at what happened, and the verdict.

I'm not surprised you feel awkward talking about race tho. Good luck resolving the never ending story.

@BlueBug45 Of course it goes both ways. My point wasn't that DS the poor little asian gets racism from nasty black teens. But that if you subject children to ongoing racist abuse they normalise it and some of them will pass it on to other racial groups.

So endemic racism tends to create more racism.

:ile bullying tends to create more bullies - it's vicious circle.

I'm gobsmacked that there are people trying to do the "yes but, yes but" thing.

It is EXACTLY like men who perform the "But men are sexually harrassed too" song to order. It doesn;t address the problem and so the problem continues.

And I should add that he experiences more racism from white kids than black (as I didn;t make that clear)

I’m unsure why I’ve had two posts deleted by MNHQ?
Racism is alive and kicking on Mumsnet!!

Black women defintly don’t have a voice, trans women are more acceptable

Perhaps it was the post where you called 0305178boo a terrible mother? it was very uncalled for Ghanagirl.

I’m definitely over with Mumsnet the
Huns on netmums less racist