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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to change DD's school & move away to have a life separate from DM?

646 replies

YesSheCan · 26/06/2018 15:38

Namechange as too much personal info on previous thread, now deleted.

OP posts:
timeisnotaline · 11/10/2018 23:29

It sounds like you are handling it very well op.

chickenloverwoman · 11/10/2018 23:46

Worth remembering, if she is ASD or otherwise AT, she MN ay we'll be behind in emotional development buy 1/3, so more like 10 emotionally?

chickenloverwoman · 11/10/2018 23:47

Arrgghh phone auto correct! Do you get my drift?

WellThisIsShit · 12/10/2018 11:07

That’s not a set back. But please be careful with the escalating punishments, it will seem arbitrary and unfair for you to say ‘right that’s another week then’ or for you to go up adding day after day after day to each behaviour in a single incident.

I know she’s not a little child anymore (in years anyway), but punishing children in this way in a big no no because they lose it and you keep adding days onto a punishment which means the punishment gets too big for them to see a way out of, abd them there is no reason for them to behave well as they give up completely. To be honest, in the power battles happening here, this seems to be happening and this doesn’t help you or her. You end up feeling like you have to stick to difficult to enforce punishments, and then bending the rules of them because they are too long and you can’t keep the punishment up as it’s ending up punishing you as well (!)... and she is feeling out of control and like it doesn’t matter whether she behaves well or badly because the punishments aren’t in proportion with her ability to learn from them / make things better.

I’d stick to the original behaviour and ignore the reaction to the punishment, instead of escalating it into a power battle that gets out of everyone’s control. I’d deal with the violence separately, showing that it is something completely out of the ordinary and unacceptable - that’s the extreme violence vs pushing and clinging, as I think you have to pick your battles a bit here.

But overall... please keep in mind that this child is doing exactly what she has been taught to do. It’s not her fault, don’t blame her and don’t feel it’s her innate character... up until a few weeks ago she has been nurtured and bonded strongly with a manipulative and sick abuser. This is the result. This poor child has been programmed to play out these roles, get attention this way... and really, really, sadly, get love through this type of interaction.

In her world, it’s actually YOU who isn’t ‘playing the game’ here (!). She’s giving you the lines and triggers just as she’s been wired to do for years... and suddenly she’s faced with an adult who isn’t responded as they ‘should’ respond. And that must be deeply upsetting and unnerving for her.

You’ve taken her away from the source of comfort and security of the one person in her life guaranteed to give her all the ‘right’ moves and feed her all the ‘right’ (read ‘right’ as ‘warped’ and ‘sick’) responses to show her everything is secure and ‘right’ in her little world, and that she is loved.

So your dd must be feeling adrift at the moment, and powerless in a really fundamental way. And then to make the situation even harder, I bet she knows how to push your buttons and get right under your defences, because she has been exposed to a master manipulator and expert abuser of you. And children are wonderfully smart at copying and replicating what their role models do. So, your dd has been being taught everyday how to hurt you. And when someone is scared and powerless, they hit out...

This is the real damage your mother has done. Her sick legacy. And you are brilliant for stopping all of this in its tracks and saying NO! But, bloody hell it will be hard to undo the damage of these years, the damage to you and to your dd, and to your bond. And that’s what you’re dealing with now, as I’m sure you are well aware of!

So, I’d try and see your dd’s behaviour through that lens...rather than that she’s a naturally horrible person or anything like that! Right now you are having to:

A. Deprogram her (and yourself)
B. Reprogram her (& of course, you too!)

And all the while and most importantly building a bond with your daughter for the very first time away from the toxicity of your mother...

So:
C. Bonding (which is probably the most important thing, as you can’t do any changes without it).

Your dd needs to have a central attachment figure in her life, and she needs to know that’s you, not her grandma... and that your love is there however much she’s testing you, and you’ll care for her no matter how horrible she is, and that you’ll never give her to someone else even if she’s spotty and smelly.

It’s hard to show love when you are trying to tackle bad behaviour, and when someone is pushing you away. But please don’t be pushed away!!!

You’ve said earlier you find it difficult to switch out of giving directions and escalating into telling off and confrontations, and you need to try and switch styles of parenting a bit? I wonder if you also find it hard to switch modes from trying to ‘stamp out’ and fight with her for control (sometimes literally physically fighting!)... and snap out of all this negative interaction to be loving and kind and positive in daily life. Especially when she’s making it such a battle. I don’t mean those moments of ‘making up’ / or being remorseful after all this confrontational angst, and I don’t mean finding positive behaviour to praise (which you’ve also said is difficult to find!). I mean something separate from that, just giving your daughter positive strokes just because you love her!

Just for a few mins every day, forget all the bad stuff, and show her how much you love her.

Maybe look up ‘love languages’ to see the different ways of showing love to find a way that she can ‘hear’ at the moment, and remember, she probably won’t reciprocate at the moment, and that’s ok, it’s not the point of the exercise, she’s been in an abusive environment for years, and she doesn’t know what positive attention and non toxic love looks like and feels like.

You need to teach her, and in the process help her realise that she has a mother who loves and cherished and generally is her champion and will always be in her corner, no matter what. Kids don’t learn that by being told that once, they need constant repetition... and, you might feel a bit better too if you do this as part of daily life, as it’s hard to remember or even feel the good stuff when the bad stuff is right up in your face all the time... and after all, it’s the good stuff that is why we do any of this...because we love our children so so much, and that’s a really good thing!

Flowers
RandomMess · 12/10/2018 11:54

This sounds a bit insane but how about having to hand an A4 piece of paper with a "Stop" sign on which gets put up when things start to escalate. You then both have 5 minutes out to calm down before continue the discussion/negotiating/arguing??????

I think if you can get into the habit of reflective listening it would reduce the escalation.

So "you are being nasty/unreasonable"

"Yes DD I can see that you think and feel that"

Don't use but!

"My rule still stands however I will write down you think it's unfair we can discuss it tomorrow after school"

I know it's not simple and it may not work but that kind of approach, it may take the wind out of her sails when you Agree with her point of view.

More ThanksThanksThanks

YesSheCan · 15/10/2018 08:09

I know she's not horrible really - it just felt like that in the midst of the situation. Everything you say about reprogramming what she is used to is right.
I took DD to see her best friend on Sat/Sun. Thought it was important forbher to spend time with her friend. We had a bit of a blip before going when she kept on and on about getting her phone back before Monday. She argued that she'd have nothing to do in the car during the 2 hour journey to her friend's and she wanted to play the online game they play together. I said she could have phone in car only. She then said she wouldn't go if she couldn't have her phone for the whole weekend. I said that would be a shame for her and her friend. Eventually she suggested she could have her phone for Saturday and Sunday and forfeit having it on Monday and Tuesday. I agreed - had loads to do, had a fever and felt rough and after thinking about it, her suggestion seemed reasonable enough. Her friend's mum hates their being online on phones the whole time so I knew she'd step in if they were staring at screens the whole time - she actually did end up turning off her router! It was nice for me to see another parent as well as DD seeing her friend, and they have loads of cats so we had loads of cuddles!

OP posts:
picklemepopcorn · 15/10/2018 08:36

What a turn around! Well done!

We used to nit comb in the lounge, watching a film. That was nice. Sort of! It's actually really bonding and therapeutic, if you are able to be gentle about it (lots of conditioner). Have lots of loo roll to hand to wipe the comb.

WellThisIsShit · 15/10/2018 14:47

Well done! Cake Brew

TraceyBond · 21/10/2018 18:46

Just wanted to say that you are doing a great job

YesSheCan · 21/10/2018 23:27

Thanks. Not doing such great job at the moment on account of new surgery messing up my repeat prescription order of antidepressant so that pharmacy didn't have it when I went to collect it. Because weekend couldn't get it sorted. It is an antidepressant which has v bad withdrawal effects even if missed for a couple of days so I'm in a bad state - v irritable, brain zaps, dizzy, no concentratiom/short tetm memory, tearful. DD spent all day in pyjamas on phone today and i couldn't cope with getting her off there and up and dressed. Tonight she said she hated school and didn't want to go tomorrow and I started off doing my best to control myself but she gave me the mist infuriatinf backchat and I totally lost my rag, yelling at her and telling her I couldn't cope with her because of the withdrawal effects and not to push me because I would seriously lose it. But she kept on and on and I had to take deep breaths so I didn't smash everything in the kitchen. She eventually went up to bed and I cried uncontrollably for about 15 mins then realised I hadn't washed her school shirts so had to handwash one really quickly but nearly fell over due to dizziness while doing it. No idea how will manage to get her to school or kyself to work tomorroe as don't feel safe to drive or make important work decisions. So angry surgery have messed up and left me in ths position. Have apologised to DD since calming down

OP posts:
YesSheCan · 21/10/2018 23:29

Oh on plus side have got CAMHS referral underway

OP posts:
ThinkOfAWittyNameLater · 22/10/2018 07:17

Great news on CAMHS referral.

Good news you DIDNT smash the kitchen. Well done - that must have been really bloody hard.

Can you get the bus / taxi today? Will your GP surgery be able to fix this today? Can you speak to the practice manager to ensure this doesn't happen again?

blueangel1 · 22/10/2018 09:53

Handhold from me. Hope you can get the meds sorted quickly.

RandomMess · 22/10/2018 10:14

Hindsight is a wonderful thing but your GP would have seen you as an emergency to get you that medication sorted etc.

I am so Angryon your behalf I know how hideous the side affects on, took me 12 months to come off the one I was on and it was by a couple of grams ever few weeks at the very end ThanksThanksThanksThanks

When you're feeling better find out where your Sunday opening/late night pharmacies are and how your emergency out of hours works.

YesSheCan · 22/10/2018 10:23

I went to collect meds from pharmacy on Sat morning which is when I found out the prescription hadn't been sent there. I know you can call 111 but also know I could have been waiting hours then possibly had to drive miles to collect the meds at a pharmacy that was still open and I was already feeling rubbish and not up to doing all that. In hindsight I probably should have bothered with the hassle. Phoned my surgery this morning. Script had not even been issued and I ordered it last Weds. They tried to tell me it was because of a dose change that needed approving?!?...nope. And they can't sort it til 12 today.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 22/10/2018 10:26

More Angry

LIZS · 22/10/2018 10:45

Will they give you an emergency appointment to collect the prescription in person?

YesSheCan · 22/10/2018 12:26

Finally got my meds. No explanation for cock-up but they seem to have taken the time to make a change to the make of my meds in order to be cost-effective which may account for the delay. Obviously as a doctor I understand there is a drug budget and why prescribe an expensive make if a cheaper generic version which is just as effective can be prescribed. However, last year I was supplied with a month's worth of ineffective generic in a package with no expiry date or batch number. I became very ill with withdrawal symptoms (which were genuine not placebo as I took the capsules for weeks assuming they would work as my usual meds did before I realised what was going on). I sent remaining capsules back to manufacturer requesting testing as I suspected I'd been supplied with bogus drugs. They refused to test. In meantime my GP decided to prescribe branded only from then on to avoid this happening again. It should all be on my notes but obviously this surgery think they know better. Ugh. Yet another thing to sort out when I have enough to deal with already. And this has coat me a day's earnings as I had to cancel work this morning.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 22/10/2018 14:04
Thanks
blueangel1 · 22/10/2018 15:46

That's so shitty, and worse for you as you're on the inside of the NHS and know how things should work. Hope you're feeling better soon. Offering another handhold as an A&D sufferer myself.

YesSheCan · 24/10/2018 22:52

Seem to have taken a step back with screen time. I am so tired and don't have the energy to fight. DD spent all day Sunday in her pyjamas staring at her phone, despite several reminders from me to get dresses and put her phone down. She doesn't want to do anything else. She watches YouTube/Netflix every evening. Promises each thing she watches will be the last then goes on to the next and yells at me when I tell her to stop watching and go to bed. It is 22:45 and she is downstairs in her school uniform watching YouTube. I am not going to wrestle her devices off her or get into shouting matches but don't know what else to do. I changed wifi password last time but then she pesters for it back supposedly because she needs to do homework or something, then as soon as she has access again, the whole battle of getting her off screens starts again. We have had the conversation about her needing sleep so many times and she gives me rude backchat about how I'm telling her things she already knows. Yet this week she wouldn't get up for school because she was too tired and made me 30 minutes late for work. She tells me it's my fault if she goes back to sleep once I've woken her up. She also had the cheek to tell me that she doesn't behave because I don't have enough authority and I need to earn her respect. I'm sick of feeling angry most of the time.

OP posts:
CodeOrange · 25/10/2018 00:16

If we have nothing planned then I let my DS (11) have a good lay in and stay in his dressing gown all day for one day of the weekend.

A lot of my friends can't bear the idea of their DC doing that but I see it as a part of his self-care after a long week at school. Maybe just reframe it as that, there's nothing too 'bad' about a slobby day every now and again.

YesSheCan · 25/10/2018 17:09

I agree, there's nothing wrong with having thr odd lazy day. But sitting on bed and staring at phone all day is a bit much. The worst thing is refusing to go to bed on a school night then being too tired to get up the next morning and making me late for work and herself late for school. I've tried, 'Hmm, do you remember you were too tired to get out of bed on time this morning? What do you think might help with that?' hoping that she will decide for herself that it is good to go to bed earlier and get enough sleep, as my nagging didn't get us anywhere. But she just says, 'I won't be tired. I will get up.' Then doesn't. Again. It's like she learns nothing whatever I try.

OP posts:
JollyAndBright · 27/10/2018 09:19

You know what is more effective that changing the WiFi password?

Removing all chargers for devices.

DS is 11 and when he misbehaves loosing screen time is the first punishment.
To prevent the issue you have I keep all of the chargers hidden, I will charge the phone/tablet/laptop to 20% and then leave it at that.
When it’s needed for ‘homework’ DS gets it back to do the homework But can’t keep it indefinitely as the charge won’t hold.

He did try once to hunt for the chargers but didn’t find them, if your DD is likely to try to ransack the house looking for them tell her they will be kept at work/out of the house.

DS can earn extra charge % by being helpful and doing chores, that may be something to work towards.

But honestly your biggest problem is her screen time, if she is anything like DS his attitude can change so dramatically when he has a screen in front of him for too long.

I know it’s tough but you will get there and you are doing great.

todayisnotthedayy · 02/11/2018 00:38

How are you OP? 

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