Aibu to think “loola” and “noony” aren’t words interchangeable with genitals?!

[Mightymelon]

And that cutesy words for your genitals help NOBODY AT ALL?

To cut a long story short - I’m friends with a girl, who has seen one of those posts on Facebook, about correctly naming genitals to avoid confusion when kids have uti’s or worse, have been abused.
DF mentioned that in this thread as well as the willy/mini/front bottom names loola and noony being used by children instead of vagina/ vulva and penis, and said she’d never heard of it before. Nor have I?

Firstly I would like to know if IABU to have never heard of these words?

SECONDLY I WOULD LIKE TO URGE YOU WITH EVERY OUNCE OF MY BEING TO TEACH YOUR KIDS APPROPRIATE WORDS FOR THEIR GENITALS SO THAT IF ANYTHING’s WRONG THE ADULTS WHO DEAL WITH IT (TEACHERS/CHILDMINDERS/HCP’s/THE POLICE) CAN DO SO WITH AS LITTLE TRAUMA AND FUSS AS POSSIBLE!!

Knowledge is power, and I believe children should be empowered by having the formal as well as informal words to describe their bodies. But here on mumsnet to some extent we’re preaching to the converted, and as professionals we need to be aware that children may disclose using language they are comfortable with OR language their abusers use.

I dealt with a case once where a child with English as a second language complained some boys were ‘teasing’ her. That was what they told her it was. I overheard someone saying she was always complaining about the boys teasing her, investigated, and found out she was talking about sexual assault.

collywombles

I do hope your dd is ok? but I think it’s disgraceful that adults cannot establish abuse circumstances because children use children’s terminology. It’s s complete cop out.

I have done a child protection job. It’s tricky because a lot of the time there’s no physical evidence, even though books and TV suggest the opposite.

There’s a difference between establishing that abuse happened and proving it. Words that aren’t accurate provide some wriggle room.

sugarplum

We have an aging, out of touch with reality headmistress too.

God I wish she’d listen to the professionals rather than assume she’s right about everything

sugarPlumFairly why don't you click on the link that both nolongersurprised and myself have posted. It includes citations from as early as 1993. Then explain how it is that in your professional career you have never seen evidence of any link between nicknames, shame, sexual abuse. If you have studied child development at some point I am very surprised that this subject was never covered. However, I did have a friend with a bachelor of primary and secondary teaching and he said they never studied child protection or recognizing signs of child abuse. Which surprised me. So, maybe you never covered those subjects either and that's ok. But as a teacher and as far as professional development goes aren't you in the very least interested in exploring the subject further? I recommend you click on the link posted earlier. Fwiw I never felt slighted by you. I did have an irresistible urge to have a little dig at you though. Only because I think you were being ridiculously argumentative.

What bugs me about the "correct name" thing is that until you start your period you really have nothing to do with your vagina.

I don't want to tell my girls there's a hole there so they can try and poke at it, because I know at 5/6/7 if I'd known there was a hole called my vagina I'd have go curious.

Until puberty really your genitals are just for weeing out of and keeping clean. So I'd feel uncomfortable my girls saying "my vagina hurts" because their vaginas don't yet do anything. Vulva makes more sense, but I'm afraid to tell you we're a noony household and trust me if my girls say loudly in the pool changing rooms "Mummy why isn't there hair on your noony today, there was last week" that I'm in no doubt anyone else in earshot knows what they mean......

They do know the words vulva and penis, but that's not what we use in conversation.

I think if someone working with children can't work out that children have a different word for penis and vulva then perhaps they need to rethink their career choice

So if a child is talking about their “moneybox” a teacher should work out they’re talking about their vulva

Colly and Colins

mrspreston but why does it matter if they self-explore? My daughters all have in the bath or had a good peer at each others’ whilst in the bath. I never thought of it as a problem, just a normal developmental stage. They’re at school now and know it’s not appropriate in public.

It’s not just about ‘a teacher working it out’
It’s about PROOF in a court

MrsP

My mother was born with a generic default that made her hymen grow over her vaginal canal about an inch thick, at 14 she was rushed to hospital and given a more extreme version of a D+C to clear her womb of infection and crap. She lost her first baby late due to weak cervix because of that operation.

So when I was 7/8 I was told I should make sure I could put my little finger fully into my vagina by my mother. Obviously she didn’t watch, but she wanted to make sure I didn’t suffer the same issue.

So yes, vaginas do ‘do something’ before puberty and exploration is good

nolongersurprsed it doesn't and both mine do and know it's only for private.

But I don't think it's safe or hygienic for them to be putting things into their vaginas. Hence why I don't think it needs mentioned until closer to puberty.

Because lets be honest saying to a teacher "theres a hole called your vagina and things go in it" will set off more alarm bells than the words "noony"

The problem isn't using a nickname - willy is fine as everyone knows what it means. The problem is that there are so many for vulva.

We need a universal nickname for vulva like we do for penis.

In Sweden they have such a nickname - "snippa" for vulva. They have it because they had the same problem we do, so they invented a word!

They popularised it through nurseries and schools and according to media reports it worked. (Can any Swedes here confirm?).

We need to do the same here - problem solved!

www.theguardian.com/world/2015/aug/01/sweden-girls-genitals-feminist-invention-snippa-vagina

MrsP
That’s a pretty big leap.

Your vagina isn’t ‘a hole things go in’

It’s a cylindrical organ that babies come out of. It’s also self cleaning and where the uterine wall shedding evacuates.

That you think a vagina is ‘a hole things go into’ is worrying

I am a teacher (secondary though so dont remember ever talking about "privates" at school!)

Until mumsnet i hadn't come across mini or foofoo or half the names on here that people think are obviously refering to kids bits ( I giess if you grow up with them you think everyone knows them.)

Some i could work out but if a kid at rainbows or brownies bounced over to me and said someone touched their minnie id assume a stuffed toy.... similar with some of the other names!

Maybe we could start a mumsnet campaign?

If we could agree on a nickname for vulva, equivalent to willy, we could start a campaign to get everyone using it (it worked in Sweden!) and then that'd solve the safeguarding issue.

I think we need to accept that:

1. not everyone wants to use the correct anatomical term vulva (saying tummy instead of stomach, bum for bottom are perfectly acceptable!)

1. Even adults are confused! Vagina is totally incorrect when referring to anatomy on the outside of the body but most people seem to use it instead of the correct term, vulva

1. it's not fair boys get the universally recognised term "willy" and girls have no universally accepted equivalent

So, what do you think should be the universally accepted nickname?

I can't help from my house - we use "girls' bits" and vulva!

Sleeping

I want us to reclaim Cunt but I know that’s unlikely

CantankerousCamel I'm with you on that one! But yeah - unlikely!

We still don't say 'Mary's dead', instead 'she passed away' or 'left us peacefully in her sleep'

Please don't do this. Just tell your child that someone has died. Clear and unambiguous. Teaching your child that if you go to sleep you may not wake up is not a smart move.

To all those saying but but but we use tummy not abdomen, belly button not navel - these are universally understood terms. Moneybox (wtf!) and flower are not...

Looking at it the other way, why on earth wouldn't you use the correct terms? A lot of people seem very very resistent to this, but I don't think I've seen anyone actually say why they don't think their child should use the correct terms.

So far noony seems least bad. What do other people think?

Minnie sounds too cutsie I reckon - and is also a girl's name.
Flower - also too cute and means something else.
Front bottom is an insult IMO.
Gina is short of vagina, which is not the part of the anatomy we're talking about - although, would it work to have gina meaning vulva and vagina meaning - well, vagina - or is that too confusing?

I don't think I've seen anyone actually say why they don't think their child should use the correct terms.

I've taught my child that vulva is the "science word" for girls' bits.

But I don't encourage her to use it as adults don't seem to know what it means! Most people seem to use vagina which is just wrong!

Girls' bits is descriptive, and has an obvious male equivalent which we also use.

To all those saying but but but we use tummy not abdomen, belly button not navel - these are universally understood terms. Moneybox (wtf!) and flower are not...

So let's invent one and popularise it. They did it in Sweden. There's good reason to do it here (safeguarding).

We just need to agree which one...

I vote for 'noony' because that's what we use Although I quite like 'snippa' actually!