Trump puts kids in cages because he wants his wall. How low can he go? The authoritarian shitshow continues ...

[Gumpendorf]

previous thread

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/amiibeingunreasonable/3269815-The-slog-of-this-authoritarian-shitshow-is-grinding-us-all-down-My-inspiration-has-gone-into-hiding-with-Melania-Knock-yourselves-out-Trump-cont

Oh bullshit FTRT. Educate yourself.

FTRT FUCK OFF.

@NoahCRothman
“The three centers ... have been rapidly repurposed to serve needs of children including some under 5 ... A fourth, planned for Houston, would house up to 240 children in a warehouse ... Indeed some recent detainees are infants, taken from their mothers.”

mobile.twitter.com/NoahCRothman/status/1009251248577679360

Blimey.

So I am right then.

Thought so.

Thank you for 'educating' me. Again.

I did my own research on this subject, because it concerned me as well. That research did not marry with most of the opinions on here.

Obviously.

Would anyone like to calmly explain to me why President Trump is taking the flak for something that was put in place 22 years ago?

Please.

Because FTRT Sessions introduced this zero tolerance procedure in April as a deterrent. As I understand it, it has never been used by previous Administrations to deter asylum seekers coming to the US. Also those reaching official points of entry are told to go away, and their desperation means they cross over illegally. Points of entry are closed, moved or they are turned away.

Many are not reunited, there are cases of mothers being deported and having leave their children behind. This Administration with its zero tolerance policy are making all asylum seekers who have their own children with them, criminals and removing their children. That has not happened before.

There is a reason why 600 of Sessions' church have filed a complaint against him.

P.S. You spelt Obama wrong.

There you go. I've explained as best as I can but if your ears (and your heart) isn't open, you won't listen

Here you are, FTRT, here's the actual, factual, truth to replace the lie you believe.
[[https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/8001743/Implementing_the_President_s_Border_Security_and_Immigration_Enforcement....0.pdf Kelly's memo Jan 25 2017: Implementing
the President's Border Security and Immigration Enforcement Improvements Policies ]]

You're right, FTRT, you're confused.

The outcry is about the Trump administration deliberately separating children from their family members or carers, then declaring them "unaccompanied minors" and keeping them in mass centres rather than individual foster homes.

When the children could have stayed with their families, in family-suitable immigration detention if detention is absolutely necessary.

The story "the Dems are responsible for this" is a lie being pushed by Trump's admin and some of their more sycophantic media channels.

You might want to reconsider the news channels you watch/read, as they seem to be concealing important information from you.

Really, a new pp who can't even spell Obama?
When have I seen this before? It must have been at election time...

Anyway, clearly, this Administration is not worried at all about drug mules or sex traffickers, let alone the children.

(Maybe FLOTUS is too busy picking out her outfit for the ceremony to receive theses remains, to visit actual living, suffering infants.)

'US expecting North Korea to return troop remains in coming days'
'The Defense Department estimates there are up to 5,300 sets of US servicemember remains still somewhere in North Korea. A total of 7,697 personnel remain unaccounted for from the Korean War. Some are pilots who were shot down, some are ground troops, others may be those who died in prisoner of war camps.'

amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/06/19/politics/north-korea-kia-remains-return/index.html?__twitter_impression=true

I may be a cynic, but who on earth believes that NK has kept or respected remains from previous enemies?
I'd run DNA tests...

A summary of what's happening:

Why are families being separated at the US border?
www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jun/18/why-are-families-being-separated-at-the-us-border-explainer

Or not even that. A decent biological anthropologist would be able to tell if the bones were caucasian or not.

Taken from that article...

'Immigration advocacy groups and attorneys have warned that there is not a clear system in place to reunite families. In one case, attorneys in Texas said they had been given a phone number to help parents locate their children, but it was actually the number for an immigration enforcement tip line.

Advocates for children have said they do not know how to find parents, who are more likely to have important information about why the family is fleeing its home country. And if, for instance, a parent is deported, there is no clear way for them to ensure their child is deported with them.'

Obama detained families. He kept them together. His Administration did not seperate children from parents.

Even the shots of children alone at the time of the Obama administration were of (older) children arriving alone at the border. Not taken away from families.

FTRT Trump can fix this terrible issue his administration approved any time he wants to. He controls both houses, yes? But he is blaming others and stalling. This is inexcusable. Why is he the President of the United States if he cannot even behave like a human being?

That's what executive orders are for, aren't they?

Thank you to all posters that have explained this to me, in detail, with links.

I will definitely read up more and, willingly, change my view.

Thank you.

This is the sort of thing people who call Pres. Obama 'Obummer' find lighthearted and amusing:

'you sitting down?

here’s Corey Lewandowski mockingly saying “womp womp” to the story of a 10-year-old girl with Down Syndrome who was separated from her mother at the border.'

mobile.twitter.com/jiveDurkey/status/1009226035215429632

FTRT, here's some other information your media sources may not have told you.

It's from the investigation into whether Donald Trump attempted to obstruct another investigation, into Russia's attack on the 2016 US election.

That's the Donald Trump whose spokesperson SH Sanders has just publicly puffed how important it is to obey the law, and said that obeying the law is biblical...

Anyway:

All of Robert Mueller’s indictments and plea deals in the Russia investigation so far

www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/2/20/17031772/mueller-indictments-grand-jury

1) George Papadopoulos, former Trump campaign foreign policy adviser, pleaded guilty in October to making false statements to the FBI.

2) Michael Flynn, Trump’s former national security adviser, pleaded guilty in December to making false statements to the FBI.

3) Paul Manafort, Trump’s former campaign chair, was indicted in October in Washington, DC on charges of conspiracy, money laundering, and false statements — all related to his work for Ukrainian politicians before he joined the Trump campaign. He’s pleaded not guilty on all counts. Then, in February, Mueller filed a new case against him in Virginia, with tax, financial, and bank fraud charges.

[NB This is dated 8 Jun: Manafort has since been jailed for trying to influence witnesses. This was possible because he was extended the courtesy of bail in the first place, unlike the immigration detainees many of whom are trying to perfectly legally claim asylum.]

4) Rick Gates, a former Trump campaign aide and Manafort’s longtime junior business partner, was indicted on similar charges to Manafort. But in February he agreed to a plea deal with Mueller’s team, pleading guilty to just one false statements charge and one conspiracy charge.

5-20) 13 Russian nationals and three Russian companies were indicted on conspiracy charges, with some also being accused of identity theft. The charges related to a Russian propaganda effort designed to interfere with the 2016 campaign. The companies involved are the Internet Research Agency, often described as a “Russian troll farm,” and two other companies that helped finance it. The Russian nationals indicted include 12 of the agency’s employees and its alleged financier, Yevgeny Prigozhin.

21) Richard Pinedo: This California man pleaded guilty to an identity theft charge in connection with the Russian indictments, and has agreed to cooperate with Mueller.

22) Alex van der Zwaan: This London lawyer pleaded guilty to making false statements to the FBI about his contacts with Rick Gates and another unnamed person based in Ukraine.

23) Konstantin Kilimnik: This longtime business associate of Manafort and Gates, who’s currently based in Russia, was charged alongside Manafort with attempting to obstruct justice by tampering with witnesses in Manafort’s pending case this year.

Other recent news about members of the "obeying the law is biblical" administration:

Trump and family sued by New York attorney general over alleged charity violations
www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jun/14/trump-charity-sued-latest-new-york-attorney-general-violations

The attorney general of New York state sued the Donald J Trump charitable foundation, President Trump and three of his children on Thursday for violating state charity laws, alleging that the Trumps used charitable assets as “little more than a checkbook for payments to not-for-profits from Mr Trump” and his companies.

Foundation assets, acquired through tax-deductible donations, were used to settle legal claims against one of Trump’s golf clubs and to buy a painting of Trump to be displayed at another club, the suit alleges.

They must be planning to run DNA tests on the remains, Lweji. I presume they will want to reunite the remains with family members for proper burial. There seems some scope for some mis-steps here.

The charity violations have been in the open since before the elections, IIRC. Why suing them now?

Donald Trump is accused of personally breaking the law and using money from a supposedly charitable foundation he controls, to pay the fine from a previous time he broke the law. (There's a picture of what seems to be the order in his handwriting.)

I mention all this because of the sudden reverence for Obeying The Law which has just now sprung up in some Trump-supporting quarters.

Sorry, I didn't mean it as in why you're mentioning it, but more why are they only paying attention now.