AIBU to not want this SN child in the same class as mine

[PinkyU]

DD is 5 and moving into P2 which will be a composite 3/2 class. I’ve recently found out that a boy with severe challenging and frequently violent behaviour will be in the same class as a P3.

DD also has SN, cognitive, social emotional and physical needs. She is very vulnerable and significantly smaller than this other child. Small knocks and bumps can cause DD significant injuries such as dislocated hip etc. Their will only be 1 teacher and 1 TA in the class which in non negotiable due to staffing.

I’m concerned that not only will this boy take up a lot of teaching time (away from my DD), he is also a substantial physical risk to DD.

AIBU to discuss/request a change of class for this other child as DD cannot be moved to a different class due to her needs?

Sorry OP, I know you are concerned about your DD and it's not fair that these children suffer because of funding cuts. But you must see that it is a better overall solution, considering the needs of all the children in both classes, if both SN children are supported by the same TA than if one of them is in a different class with just a teacher and no TA support at all.

Topseyt
Actually what a lot of us have been saying is that the OP should absolutely discuss what the school plan to do to safeguard her child.

We are just saying it is unreasonable to get involved in another child's plans or demand another child to be moved. The TA isn't the OP's child, nor can they reasonable expect tjeir DC to have a monopoly on the TA.

To quote cant (who has said what a few of us have multiple times:
As I said before, you can ask the school about robust plans for keeping your child safe.

You CANNOT ask for those procedures to include removing the other child from the class or the support that they need

But you must see that it is a better overall solution, considering the needs of all the children in both classes, if both SN children are supported by the same TA than if one of them is in a different class with just a teacher and no TA support at all.

Exactly this.

If other classes have no TA, and your DD has no statutory right to one, you have to accept that one solution would be for the TA to move to another class with the other SN child, leaving yours with a teacher alone. If SOME TA assistance is better than none for her, then this may well be the only solution available.

['this' meaning 'the solution which has a shared TA within the same class as proposed']

I can't understand why your child doesn't have an ECHP/statement, depending on which part of the UK you are in. It doesn't matter if there are worse children than her. You can always apply for a statement without schools backing mind, you do need to prove that they cannot support dd's needs without it. I'm shocked that the ta is allowed to provide personal care also tbh. In Wales this is not allowed without a statement of Sen. YABU to think that they should immediately remove the other child however yanbu to express your concerns both of dd's safety around this child and the schools failure to adequately provide 1-2-1 support to dd.

OP is being unreasonable not because she's concerned about her child - that's normal and reasonable. It's because of her automatic assumption (albeit supported by an unprofessional and gossipy TA) that having this child in her DD's class will be an insurmountable issue. It's fine to ask the school what systems they have in place to ensure her DDs needs are met. It is NOT fine to say 'I don't want this other child in my DD's class'.

I also think, OP, if you're as worried as you say it's very odd that you aren't 'jumping through the hoops' to get a statutory plan. If you need accommodations like one on one TA support like you suggest, your DD needs a plan.

YABU. As the parent of someone who would once have been considered ‘that’ child, this sort of attitude appals me. (And I’ve been on the receiving end of parents complaining about the support my son gets.) Your child’s needs are important to you, but they do not trump another’s right to a decent education and support. The school most likely have taken a decision on support, taking into account all factors, including a ridiculously strapped budget. Has it occurred to you that perhaps he might need more support than your daughter as much to protect the other members of the class as to support him?
My son has funding for a FT 1-1, all day, including breaktimes. Part of the funding application was made on the basis that his behaviour was so disruptive that nobody in the class was able to learn while he was unsupported. At times the children were also unsafe as he would throw things ( he’s never been deliberately violent towards other people, but has been destructive ). During those times, his TA would remove him from the class or stay with him while the teacher removed the other children.
He now is in KS2 and is like a completely different child, but he is very labour intensive still (his behaviour is partly down to being bored in class - he’s simply too bright, and there’s no appropriate specialist primary provision for him in our area).
Another parent asked for my son next to be kept away from her child. I can tell you now, that this did not impact or reflect on my child at all, but she certainly got short shrift from the school.
You do absolutely have a right to ask how the school will support and protect your child generally, but you have no right to tell them how to do this, and you certainly cannot expect them to discuss another child’s needs or behaviours with you ( whether by name or inferred ). The TA overstepped the mark massively, even if she didn’t mention the child by name.

I also think, OP, if you're as worried as you say it's very odd that you aren't 'jumping through the hoops' to get a statutory plan.

I totally agree. With the picture you’ve painted, you should definitely be pushing for an EHCP.

no advice pink but I feel for you, if my DD had a condition that made her more likely to be injured anyway and a child with violent outbursts was moved into her class I'd be pretty desperate. Ask about safeguarding, and consider your other school option.

Whilst I might not agree with the TA discussing this , I can see how if a major incident occurs , where OP's DD is hospitalised by the other child, the TA will most likely get the blame and be managed out of her job, cheap as chips to get another TA, as other posters have pointed out.

Sometimes, in a school with relatively small numbers of SEN children, a parent / child can get used to a level of TA support from 'normal class staff' that they have no 'right to expect', and then not feel that it has been necessary to really batter at the doors of those providing statutory funding.

It was the mention of 'my DD's TA' that had me wondering, as the OP's DD has no statutory hours of TA help - I wonder whether up till now a 'class TA' has always been available and pretty much dedicated to her, so the need to really push for dedicated funding hasn't been clear? it is only now when a (rare) class TA has to be divided between two high-needs children that the difficulties of this approach become apparent.

frumpty that’s actually very unlikely, unless the TA was being deliberately negligent in some way.

Whilst I might not agree with the TA discussing this , I can see how if a major incident occurs , where OP's DD is hospitalised by the other child, the TA will most likely get the blame and be managed out of her job, cheap as chips to get another TA, as other posters have pointed out.

That’s not accurate at all.

I would move her. Your child could suffer a hip dislocation (incredibly painful) and other injuries with this plan.

I wouldn't hesitate in contacting the school with your concerns, and in addition be prepared to move classes (if possible) or schools (if not)

Yanbu. Obviously other posters don't understand what it's like to have a child with SEN.

ByeMF,

The other child also has SEN. I understand what it would be like to be the parent of EITHER child here - and both have exactly the same rights to education and support.

WombOfOnesOwn. The response would have been exactly the same if the sexes had been reversed. Disgusting post.

Totally agree with @crunchtime. Professionally, I find it very undermining to be questioned about the presence of any child in my classroom by any other parent. This SN child has just as much right to be educated within an inclusive primary setting and I would hope that you would have enough trust in your DD's school setting that they would not endanger and/or detract from her educational experience.
If you do not trust her school, move her.

OP,

As a school Governor, and Mother of a child with enhanced care needs within that school, you have every right to demand an assessment for an EHCP, if your school feels that they cannot meet your DDs needs adequately without a designated 1-1 TA. Ask to see their SEN policy and their policy for children with Additional health needs.

The TA is unfortunately breaching confidentiality discussing the other child with you regardless of how anonymised they have appeared to make it.

If you are unhappy about your DD being in class with a child who may suffer a meltdown (I don’t feel it appropriate to say kick off, children with enhanced needs do not decide to just kick off, there is a neurological process that they can’t control, the correct term is meltdown) then you have a few options, 1) request a review of the situation, 2) consider Home educating 3) request an assessment for an ECHP and funding for 1-1.

1-1 is a very misleading position which rarely exists in a setting with multiple children who all have an EHCP. A school has to be able to show the child has access to the level of support detailed in the plan, it does not need to be delivered on a 1-1 basis.
It is very sad when a child's reputation precedes them to this extent. I appreciate you want to protect your dc - I'm sure all the parents feel similarly and it would appear yours would be better 'protected' than the others by having the ta. However, the hope would always be that actually, despite a shaky previous record, he is able to make good progress with great staff and appropriate provision, which may well be the case going forward mow.

@WombOfOnesOwn. The op is talking about very young DC. No one has rape excused. Lots have encouraged to ask about her DD's safety. None have said violence is okay or should be ignored. Bizarre post

WombOfOnesOwn your post is disgusting and completely out of order. So, by your reasoning, because my son was violent when younger - I’m talking 4/5 (though, I repeat not towards people), he is a rapist in training? No, the support he has received has been absolutely essential so that he can better control his emotions. His anxiety now is more likely to manifest itself as withdrawal than lashing out.
It’s a proven fact that children (and adults) with SEN are far more vulnerable to attack than are likely to perpetrate it. Without appropriate support, what hope do they have?