To wonder how many of you are ready for hard Brexit now

[keyboardkate]

I took on the mantle to start another thread. If that is not allowed, Mods delete the thread, I am not sure of the protocol. But it certainly is an interesting discussion!

If allowed to stay as my OP, let's go!

There is a good chance that the 'fond memories' of the blitz being tested again so we can see how much we are 'all in this together'.
I suspect the intervening 70 odd years might have put a 'rosier' glow on the realities of the time.
There is a 'tradition' that in times of extreme peril the captain goes down with the ship. In this case the ship IS going down and a handful of potential captains are playing 'ring a ring 'o' roses', (in a financial life raft).

Don't worry what I say, I will be excluded from any votes in the future.

Uncosted naive bollocks. And don't get me started on his personal love-in with Gerry Adams just after the Brighton Bomb which I remember because I am old. I hated Thatcher but a murderous attack on our democracy is a murderous attack on our democracy. He was a grown up then as was I and his poor exercise of judgement speaks volumes.
I wouldn't trust McD to run a cake stall and Abbott is shit. I so wish she wasn't but she is.

"And don't get me started on his personal love-in with Gerry Adams just after the Brighton Bomb which I remember because I am old. "

You mean the elected MP Gerry Adams who was invited to discuss prison conditions ( if you are old you will remember the political prisoner status issues).

Do try not to use hyperbole and counterfactual nonsense.

The Adams thing is a red herring. British governments had been meeting the IRA since the early 1970s. The Royal Family met Martin mcguinness.

If you dislike Corbyn because he met Gerry Adams but support a Tory government propped up by the DUP then its sheer hypocrisy. Two sides to the same coin.

"Uncosted naive bollocks. "]

Yet not totally uncosted, and backed by a range of different economists.

The Tory one was totally uncosted.

Also, can you identify a manifesto in the past where all of the costs of the proposals were completely accurate?

Corbyn was a back bench no mark MP looking for publicity. Not the same as behind the scenes talking by the government.
And his attempts to ride on Mo Mowlem's coat takes are fucking shameful.

The Royal Family didn't meet Martin McGuinness until after the peace process had been signed. Don't try and rewrite history.

Back bench MPs are perfectly entitled to pursue political issues. That is what they are paid for.

It doesn’t matter if it was before or after the peace process they both met the same person!

And I don't support the Tories and their terrorist loving bedfellows the DUP.

Ghost, you clearly have no idea.

Corbyn was the back bench MP to the constituency with the second largest number of Irish nationals living in it in the UK. He worked with Irish community groups in North Islington as well as using his position in parliament to reach out to try to make a difference.

Without the context you lose the big picture, and just spout tabloid rubbish.

I'm Irish. I know what a no mark publicity loving mp looks like. Adams does not represent Irish people same as the DUP don't.

"Adams does not represent Irish people same as the DUP don't."

Yet Adams was repeatedly elected?

Confusing your opinion with facts isn't a good sign dear.

Yet not totally uncosted, and backed by a range of different economists.

The "economists" included journalists so that's one to do away with straight away.

As for fully costed, it made a lot of assumptions, and when put under scrutiny (as did the Conservative one) it was deemed to be slightly worse of than what the Tories had promised.

This is revisionism party political tubthumping.

Does Adams speak for all Irish people? Dear.

What I don't get is that most leavers were in the poorer regions, the areas that regularly get 'stuffed' by each and every UK govt. ( an example is the rail service right now). Yet, when the EU dishes out investment funds, it definitely isn't looking at the South East for somewhere to put those funds, it's in the places that voted out of the EU. The EU looks after the poorer regions of the UK better than their own govt. does!!! It's a real pity the people never understood, what they got from the EU. Everyone on Europe sees it, of course except for a few right wing groups!

None of the pro-leave Tories have exactly covered themselves in glory since. They’ve been moaning about Europe for years, but none of them has a clue what to do now they’ve got what they said they wanted

Most of them only want to leave the EU so that they can remove employment rights. Beyond that, they don't have a clue what they want as you say.

"Does Adams speak for all Irish people? Dear."

No Sweetie, but as an elected MP he had a right to speak about the conditions of political prisoners at the time when this was a big issue.

In fact he had every right to be in the commons as an MP, dear heart, and the issue of political prisoners was being debated and raised in questions in the house at the time, sweet pea, but as republican MP he didn't take his seat. Did Corbyn have a right to raise issues that his constituents wanted to see raised? Or to enter into discussions about them? Certainly.

You are conflating lots of different things.

You see, when you simplify things into bland statements and use them as attacks on others you show your utter credulity.

My dear

"As for fully costed, it made a lot of assumptions, and when put under scrutiny (as did the Conservative one) it was deemed to be slightly worse of than what the Tories had promised. "

All manifestos make assumptions, as I pointed out above.

Name me one which was accurately fully costed, unless you can that means the last Labour manifesto was held to a higher standard than others.

You cannot move forward and resolve issues without speaking to terrorists. Agreeing with their views and allowing atrocities to continue is a different thing altogether.

Topcat whatever you personally think of Jeremy Corbyn or any of his acolytes matters not one jot. If Labour is to stand a chance of being re-elected it needs to move towards the centre. The Tories are ripping themselves to shreds, but no one moving over to escape the right wing of the Conservatives is going to vote for the left wing of the Labour Party. Actually if the LIb Dems had bided their time this could have been their moment, unfortunately Nick Clegg’s grab for power by jumping into bed with the Tories put paid to that.

ALbour's main problem is not its policies on taxation or redistribution, or nationalisation, in fact they seem popular with the majority.

They need to buck the deficit myth and the one that the tories manage the economy well in order to get power.