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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think my friend just needs to say no to her kids?

177 replies

reddblackandblue · 30/05/2018 11:30

I have been very close to my friend for years. She is genuinely a lovely, lovely person. Too lovely.

She’s always been very into ‘gentle’ parenting but ever since her eldest turned two, she has had these screaming tantrums that last half an hour or more and no one can do anything during this period except sit and wait for the child to exhaust herself into sleep.

Obviously, I thought this was normal so waited it out. Child turned three, four and five and still has tantrums and screams when she doesn’t get her own way. The younger child who isn’t now three is exactly the same.

I think my friend just can’t say ‘no.’ Even when something is obviously impractical or dangerous she will sit around for ages reasoning with them rather than saying no. This has meant us all standing by a busy road while the children scream, standing outside the car waiting to get in as the kids won’t get in their car seats, waiting around exhausted at midnight as the kids rampage around.

Now she’s expecting another.

Aibu in just not wanting to be around her any more? I absolutely love her. The kids? I can’t stand them!

OP posts:
sweeneytoddsrazor · 30/05/2018 19:23

frankly I was a better parent for some of my kids than others.

I feel that sometimes as well, yet when I said to the 2 I feel I have let down in some way, they both say they couldn't have had a better Mum and they didn't really appreciate that whilst they still lived at home. They both still have some issues to resolve though.

GeorgeTheHippo · 30/05/2018 19:30

Children tantrum like this because they feel insecure. They are looking for the boundaries and they are bothered that they can't find them. In my opinion it's not just ineffectual parenting, it's actually inadequate. Not "good enough". Poor kids.

Peanutbuttercups21 · 30/05/2018 19:34

I always had myself down as a laid back gentle parent

If they had a tantrum, I'd pick them gently underneath my arm and carry them.home kicking and screaming.

If they did not want to eat something, that was up to them (no alternatives though)

If they tantrumed I walked away (gently 😉)

If they don't come off their devices, I gently switch off the wifi Grin

Am quite gentle, but not soft, if that makes sense

KERALA1 · 30/05/2018 19:40

Dh and I are quite strict. Mine have never had a tantrum. They are pleasant and have never talked back (older now). Sometimes idly wonder if I'm "lucky" and if they had different temperaments would have been different or if we are just really really great parents. I hope it's the latter Grin.

Anecdotally the stricter parents we know have much much nicer kids.

Honeyroar · 30/05/2018 20:01

Yes Peanut I had a friend who patented like you too. I think it's a good balance. You don't have to be a harsh parent. With my good parent friend I'd be at her house and the kids would start screaming or tantruming and she would say "excuse me Honey", pick the two children under her arms and carry them upstairs to their room saying " we've got a guest, you can come down when you have calmed down and can be quieter". Then she would come back down and continue our chat. Without fail there would be two little voices shouting downstairs a few minutes later saying "mummy we're quiet now!" And they'd come back down. They've grown up into the nicest young adults I know, after being lovely children. Their mum adored them and knew when they really needed her, but they had boundaries.

My current friend, who over softly parents, drops everything she's doing the moment her 4 yr old calls her. If she doesn't you can see his eyes narrow and he starts shouting and throwing things, until he's livid. She never stops him, just withers "oh no darling, we don't do that" while not doing anything about it.

sherazade · 30/05/2018 22:08

If the children are screaming when they don't get their way, as you say, that means she isn't giving into them/letting them have their way all the time. It can't be both.

Loandbeholdagain · 30/05/2018 22:29

I think parents are getting it wrong if they don’t have boundaries for their children. Children do need boundaries whatever parenting style you have. So no way would I let a child trample muddy boots all over someone’s carpet.
The key for me is that I want my kids to actually understand why that wouldn’t be okay, not just to do what I say because at some point I won’t be there. It doesn’t mean I let them do what they fancy, it means I speak to them kindly but firmly and I explain the why.

00100001 · 30/05/2018 22:40

You know, UK plug sockets are ridiculously safe and child proof

Uyulala · 30/05/2018 22:48

You know, UK plug sockets are ridiculously safe and child proof

Yes, so much so that plug-socket covers actually make them more dangerous, not less.

he took his wellies off just fine when I asked him? Tbf, some kids will do something for one person but not for another. Mine was kicking-up a fuss earlier because she had to come in from the garden to have her lunch... She was banging her head on the back of the highchair and really screaming at me, she wasn't having any of it. As soon as my Grandmother came over and tried the exact same thing I'd been doing... My daughter gave in and ate her lunch! Grin

Uyulala · 30/05/2018 22:49

Sometimes children feel more comfortable saying "no" to their parents than to strangers. I'd have been far more mortified at being told off by my uncles for not taking my shoes off than my parents, for example.

Graphista · 30/05/2018 22:49

Thanks lotta and nursy

"Anecdotally the stricter parents we know have much much nicer kids."

That's been my experience too. The strictest (non abusive) parents I know, and there aren't many stricter than me, their DC babysat my dd. All 4 are now adults, delightful, charming people with burgeoning successful careers, 3 in happy ltr, one is wedding planning, one has just moved in with his first serious boyfriend, another happily co-habiting, the 4th happily single.

Uyulala · 30/05/2018 22:53

she was so adament we must all of been lucky and had it easy compared to her having such a high spirited little obnoxious brat created by her lack of parenting cherub.

On the other hand, I don't think it's all nurture. Some kids are born different. One of my uncles was a lazy baby, lazy/chillded toddler, unphased by anything... his brother was the opposite apparently, always crying and moaning and uncontented for the littlest of things, sometimes seemingly nothing at all. Nature has a part to play.

Peanutbuttercups21 · 30/05/2018 22:53

Bit smug? Grin

If kids turn out well, parents applaud their own parenting. If things go wrong peers/school/external.issues are to blame Wink

PurpleTigerLove · 30/05/2018 22:55

I’d avoid a parent like that too . Their poor teachers are going to have to fix a lot of their crap parenting .

Uyulala · 30/05/2018 22:57

they have just been parented and taught certain behaviour is not acceptable.

Because if a parent says it's unacceptable and punishes said child... They will learn and certainly never repeat the behaviour. Hmm
Some children, no matter the parenting, will turn out a certain way.

Not saying it is the case for OP, but I struggle with the emphasis on nurture all the time.

KERALA1 · 30/05/2018 22:59

Exactly we will never know. We may have had a demonic third child - but didn't.

Agree that reasoning with pre schoolers isn't beneficial for anyone. Children need to be taught how to fit in with society that's the parents job. Not doing so isn't kind or gentle - it's unfair on the child and a dereliction of your job as parent. Not doing them any favours and very short termist.

00100001 · 30/05/2018 23:14

*You know, UK plug sockets are ridiculously safe and child proof

Yes, so much so that plug-socket covers actually make them more dangerous, not less.*

Yy!

nursy1 · 30/05/2018 23:43

I feel that sometimes as well, yet when I said to the 2 I feel I have let down in some way, they both say they couldn't have had a better Mum and they didn't really appreciate that whilst they still lived at home

Sweeny. I begin to feel we are kindred spirits. I’ve asked exactly the same with my kids and got similar answers.

MiniMum97 · 30/05/2018 23:43

A child that is tantrumming for 30mins at a time regularly is not a happy child. She is doing her children no favours at all. Children are happier with clear and consistent rules and boundaries.

DarthArts · 31/05/2018 00:16

I absolutely agree re: boundaries.

Yes, children will test where they are, but you have to have them and be consistent in how you enforce them.

There's nothing wrong imho in explaining where those boundaries are to a child (age appropriately) but it's not a negotiation, which in my experience seems to be the "process" of gentle parenting when taken dogmatically (or perhaps its fairer to say inappropriately) and without consideration of of its the best way to parent a specific child's personality.

In fact, it's not even a negotiation, it's a process of parental appeasement (usually followed by a "justification" to anyone else bearing witness that inevitably involves words like "spirited", "willful" and "independent").

No one does a child a favour by refusing to set boundaries and say "no" - that's not a "style/technique" it's fundamentally a lack of parenting in itself.

MrsDilber · 31/05/2018 00:27

She's not doing her kids any favours in the long run.

Nb65988 · 31/05/2018 03:34

My best friend of 15 years is the nicest person but her kids are a nytmare and it's her and her partner fault they get kids to call mum bitch and dad a fat cunt they find it funny they run up the car and sit on roof and refuse to come down they scream shout swear and she's oblivious and I don't give my opinion as that's how she brings them up I know longer see her as I can't handle u can't have a glass of wine as there's 3 wild kids giving u headache

Gottagetmoving · 31/05/2018 09:51

On the other hand, I don't think it's all nurture. Some kids are born different

We are all born unique! That doesn't mean to say the parent isn't responsible for managing a child's behaviour. You have to be more firm with some children. You can't just blame chllenging behaviour on their personality. Nurture determines whether that behaviour is managed properly.

Myotherusernameisbest · 31/05/2018 10:51

Children are happier with clear and consistent rules and boundaries.

This, a million times. I think children feel safer knowing someone else has everything under control and is looking out for them which in turn makes them more content.

AllMYSmellySocks · 31/05/2018 10:57

To be fair I don't think what a lot of you are describing is really gentle parenting. I would consider myself a gentle parent. I respect my child's feelings, I listen to their point of view and always take the time to explain if they can't have what they want.

That is definitely not the same as permissive parenting where your child can just do whatever they want. I think that actually makes children feel unsafe. They prefer to have boundaries which they understand. You can apply those boundaries in a gentle way though.

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