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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to not force my child to go to Romania for Christmas

161 replies

SquidgyBanana · 30/05/2018 09:23

My ex husband is Romanian. We split up when our dd was 8 months old she’s now 9.

He takes her to romania every summer holiday for a couple of weeks and for a week in the Easter holidays.

Last week he said he wanted to book some dates in the summer holiday from 5th August to 23rd. Usually I just say yes that’s fine but this year I wanted to take her on holiday I’m the summer too.

I’ve never been able to afford to take her on holiday before and have been saving to be able to take dd & ds away.

I said the dates are smack bang in the middle of the holiday meaning I don’t have a lot of freedom to take her away for two weeks myself but he said tough basically.. those were the dates his family are available in Romania and that’s what he’s governed by and his holiday with her is more important than mine because I have her throughout the year.

I said I’m sure she would like to go on holiday with her 2 brothers and Mum too so could he pick the dates either at the beginning of the summer holiday or the second half so I could have the half he didn’t choose. He still said no.

I said so considering he takes her every year that means I will never be able To take her on holiday and he said that’s just tough basically.

In the end I said that I we will keep saving so we can take her away next year and have pick of the dates and he take her whenever he wants this summer... that was fine

Then yesterday he told my dd while he was out with her that he was taking to Romania for Christmas. She told me this morning

I understand that his family want to see her for Xmas and he wants her to experience a Romanian Xmas. But dd was distressed this morning saying she doesn’t Want to go away from home at Xmas.

I asked her why she didn’t tell him that yesterday when she was out with him and she said because he would argue with her.

I said to her that if she wants to go she can and if she doesn’t want to go I won’t force her and that she has to be strong and stand up for what she wants either way.

I sent him a message to explain that she’s not happy to go and suggested his family come over here for Xmas and they’re welcome to come over and see her Boxing Day and spend time with her while they’re here in my house if they want to/if it makes it easier but he replied ‘don’t you dare’ and that ‘life is about compromise and she has to learn that’ (which I think is ironic seeing as compromise is clearly not something he’s capable of)

AIBU to not force her to go to Romania for Christmas?

OP posts:

LifeBeginsAtGin · 30/05/2018 10:35

She's only 9, she really can't make an informed decision - she will only be guided by her parents so it is you and your EX who have to sell it to her.

Notveryladylike · 30/05/2018 10:36

Yes OP force your daughter to go somewhere she doesn't want to, make her upset on one of the best times of year for a child so her dad doesn't feel annoyed
Some people obviously have no respect for children's feelings.
Her extended family already see her twice a year, that's more than some families where the parents are still together. I have family that live in all different countries and your lucky if we seen them once a year.
No matter how nicely you put it your daughter and how exciting you try and make it, If she feels she doesn't want to go then that probably won't change.

Luisa27 · 30/05/2018 10:37

I agree with Dunnowhy - exactly what she said OP

Notveryladylike · 30/05/2018 10:38

worridmum, this isn't really like brushing teeth though is it.

Original poster

SquidgyBanana · 30/05/2018 10:39

Kerryleigh Also, there is Santa. He comes on the night of 24th and he can bring the gifts in any shape or form, including a sock smile exactly this is what I told her... I said Santa will bring your sock there... but he’s said no to this. I thought Santa was magic enough to be able to sneak in a little sock even if it wasn’t the tradition... I wasn’t asking for an English Xmas in Romania.. just the one little token

I married him when I was 19 and we visited Romania a few times together... To be honest I didn’t appreciate it then as much as I would now... we didn’t have a great relationship. Without going into details I left my narcissistic mother to move in with him and I left the relationship with little to no confidence. I could never say or do anything right. He constantly put me down and made me feel stupid but I thought this was just how I was because my mother did much of the same.

Mine and his relationship is irrelevant as while dd has been young he’s been easy going with her... we had supervised visits together until she was 3/4 & by the time she was ready to go out with him on her own I was happy that she was ok with him & he was being ok with her but it seems like now she’s getting older and getting her own opinions he is not liking/dealing with it well

OP posts:

PetulantPolecat · 30/05/2018 10:40

“Not sure where some of the PPs are gettting the information that Romanian Christmas isn’t 25th December from that its “early January” - my husband is Romanian and is Orthodox (as is his whole family) ”

Because some branches of Orthodox follow the Gregorian calendar

MinaPaws · 30/05/2018 10:41

As long as you are sure he's an ethical person and has no intention of 'forgetting' to bring her back from either holiday, I think it would be fair to agree to both of these. It's great that he has maintained contact with her over the years. It's an important part of her own sense of identity to have that experience of the Romanian side of her family. And one childhood Christma swith her dad and his family doesn't seem unreasonable.

In your position, I'd do a shorter holiday one side of the holiday he's booked. When money was tight, we'd often take DC abroad just for a week. It's cheaper and you can still have a fantastic time. We've been to France, Italy, Iceland, USA all just for a week.

worridmum · 30/05/2018 10:41

I have a child who does not want to brush her teeth go to the dentist should i respect her feelings and not force her too? or would it be neglect?

People have to do things they don't want to do and it is not wrong in enforcing this? Child does not want to go to school what good parent says fine you don't need to go? or again with other stuff when does the parents have the right to overrule the child's feelings?

Should i not force my DD to brush her teeth and so she will have shocking teeth when older? should i respect her feelings even if its determental to their future?

So give over.

yorkshireyummymummy · 30/05/2018 10:43

He sounds like he wants everything his own way! Where’s his compromise?
What concerns me is that your DD was too nervous of him ‘ arguing’ with her to tell him she didn’t want to go to Romania for Christmas.
She’s 9 years old, is used to going to Romania and knows her relatives there but she still does not want to go there. So don’t make her. She has to have a say in this. Personally I would be having a very very firm chat with her Dad regarding his ‘ arguing ‘ with her and her being too scared to say anything to him. This would worry me a lot.

She lives with you, there’s no court agreement so at the moment he sees her on your terms - but they seem to be all of his terms. I would tell him that unless her wants to go to court then he gets the first two weeks of the school holidays this year and the last two next year. Christmas is up to your DD. I would gently encourage her to think about how lovely a romainian Christmas could be and to ask her dad questions but if she decides she wants to stay at home then you will fully support her decision and tell her Dad. It’s down to him to make it sound worth tradimg her Christmas at home for and if she gets palmed off on the Romanian relatives when they go there in the summer then it’s utterly understandable why she wants to stay at home.

Hissy · 30/05/2018 10:44

I know people are saying 'You have her 90% of the time, so you have to be more flexible and compromise'

I struggle with this.

Op does 90% of the work of bringing up her dd. since the DD was 8mo. Therefore, I think she SHOULD somehow have more call to the key dates than someone who hasn't put in the time/effort. It's a perk.

It sounds like he is on a power trip and also resentful of the soft and fluffy stuff you have as tradition. he resents you somehow and contact is apparently all for him and his benefit/showing off to family.

What does the court order say about access?

He needs to ASK when is OK to go away with her in the summer and fit in with plans if need be. YOU need to liaise with him about holiday and a compromise needs to be reached.

At the end of the day, he can't take your child anywhere without your express permission. If he is not willing to make Christmas pleasant for her - away from her mother for the first time ever, then screw him.

I'd gently remind him of the fact that as resident parent you can deny permission for summer AND Christmas until he recognises that actually, you DON'T jump if he says so, and if he wants to arrange things, they are with DD and her happiness in mind, not him and his interests purely....

... or he works with you to agree dates and times for summer/holidays etc.

Notveryladylike · 30/05/2018 10:45

worridmum, please tell me how not going to Romania for Christmas will be detrimental to her future? She already goes twice a year and sees her father every week?

RunningBean · 30/05/2018 10:46

I don't understand how some posters seem to think 'he's the dad so you and DD have to fit around what he wants regardless of how little he actually parents her.'

From the sound of it he's doing the absolute bare minimum. Thursday every other week presumably means a couple of hours after school twice a month.

Tell him you couldn't change the dates of the holiday so she'll be back on (date) for him to have her.
Just leave it at that, if he makes a fuss just repeat well we won't be here before that date so arguing about it isn't going to change that.

Arrange for DD to visit after Xmas. It sounds to more like he's using contact to control you, telling you you can't go on holiday and trying to take her for Christmas but only bothering to see her a few hours a month the rest of the year.

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 30/05/2018 10:48

Tbh he got his dates in the summer, in the end, so shouldn’t get Christmas too. Tbh at nine she should also get a say

Notveryladylike · 30/05/2018 10:48

Hissy, well said!

TeisanLap · 30/05/2018 10:49

Not sure where some of the PPs are gettting the information that Romanian Christmas isn’t 25th December from that its “early January” - my husband is Romanian and is Orthodox (as is his whole family) and whenever we have gone for Christmas it is celebrated on 25th December (as Christmas Day) -

Two Romanian daughters in law and a large extended Romanian family we always spend 4 weeks with over the festive season.

The 25th is not what they consider their main celebration. And yes, they’re Orthodox.

fuzzywuzzy · 30/05/2018 10:49

Holidays isn’t the same as brushing your teeth.

Court ordered contact would split holidays in half so a week every half term and two weeks in summer and every other Christmas. The father would not get the whole of Easter and slap bang in the middle of summer holidays it would either be the beginning or the end of summer hols.

NRP’s don’t get to waltz in and have the funn part of parenting the RP is also considered when contact is agreed as they also need to have meaningful time with their children. Being the resident parent during the normal days consists of getting children to and from school and fed and ensure discipline is maintained it’s unfair if the OP and her family are not allowed to spend holiday time with DD.

I would facilitate every other Christmas but I’d also do my own summer holiday with DD and split Easter in half too.

worridmum · 30/05/2018 10:49

She wont experence half of her culture? Would you really be happy if your parter or EX said you can not go see your parents (their grandparents).

She is half Romanian so it is beneficial to experience half her culture.

A court can and will order that he can have her every other year and the court CAN order that he can take her without the OP permission and the OP would be landed with court costs. So no the OP does not have the right to dictate and he has to jump to her tune it is about compromise and by compromise i don't mean he has to fit in with all the OP plans.

Notveryladylike · 30/05/2018 10:51

Also him being Romanian and having a different culture is irrelevant. If someone with the same culture as you was saying he wouldn't keep up your little traditions to keep the magic in Christmas for your daughter then people would be furious!

Jenna43 · 30/05/2018 10:52

Hell would freeze over before I would allow a useless ex who has opted out of parenting..(he sees her every other Tuesday) to dictate to me when I could take my child on holiday and take her away from me at Christmas. HELL NO.

Notveryladylike · 30/05/2018 10:52

worridmum, but she is expected to fit around all his. Really?

gillybeanz · 30/05/2018 10:52

I'd reply that yes it's about compromise.
So he won't mind compromising for you to have 2 whole weeks during the summer.
Does he live in England?, Do you have her passport?
I'd say no to contact tbh, and let him take you to court.

Allaboutalex · 30/05/2018 10:53

I think sharing cultures is amazing and would be so lovely, but I think that after 9 Christmas’s one way to go cold turkey to a completely new tradition would be difficult. Like for a child who doesn’t want to brush their teeth- you don’t jump straight into a massive procedure with the dentist and injections- don’t you build up to it?

Does he do any Romanian Christmas traditions with her now? Most kids I know are nervous spending the Christmas Eve anywhere but home in case Santa gets lost so it is a big deal for a 9 year old.

RunningBean · 30/05/2018 10:54

Worridmum, so far its her fitting around all of his plans. He hasn't fitted around any of the ops plans he's just told her she can't ever have a holiday for 2 weeks as his plans take priority.

Dancingmonkey87 · 30/05/2018 10:55

I’m surprised she still believes in Santa in all honestly at 9 my 9 year hasn’t believe for a good year. In regards of the holiday you need to compraise which I see you have and I think as pp you need to encourage her going away for christmas

Jenna43 · 30/05/2018 10:55

A court can and will order that he can have her every other year and the court CAN order that he can take her without the OP permission

That would actually benefit the OP. At least she would have a full summer every other year and could take her DD on holiday.

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